Toei Officially Acknowledges Yamamoto's Kai Rip-Offs

[kei17]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTvyW5mki7w#t=10m55s for Gohan going SSJ2? Is their hearing impaired?

I guess they probably couldn't use Tamashii vs~ for some copyright reason since the things were too immediate, but in that case, I would definitely put M1312 or M1318 at least.

[Goku100xKamehameha]

See what I meant when I said "this can completely change Kai! "?

Well, I hope they still keep the insert songs completely intact (especially the Ginyu Tokusentai one) since none of them are composed by Kenji Yamamoto... except Saiyan Blood and News of the Cell Games. FUCK.

Better start buying the current Kai home release since it's going to be the "rare lost" version of Kai.

And I'm glad this happens because now I can enjoy DBZ with Kikuchi score without stupid long ass filler.

[Vernichter]

Are they keeping Dragon Soul and the two ending themes, or will those be replaced as well?

To be blunt, if they're really going to re-release all of Kai with the Z music, there's no point in continuing beyond the 3 sets that are out, since we have the Dragon Boxes. Unless you're a dub fan.

[kei17]

See what I meant when I said "this can completely change Kai! "?

Well, I hope they still keep the insert songs completely intact (especially the Ginyu Tokusentai one) since none of them are composed by Kenji Yamamoto... except Saiyan Blood and News of the Cell Games. FUCK.

Better start buying the current Kai home release since it's going to be the "rare lost" version of Kai.

And I'm glad this happens because now I can enjoy DBZ with Kikuchi score without stupid long ass filler.

The most rare lost version will be the recent episodes that have not been released so far.

[penguintruth]

This is going to end with Funimation getting a good deal more of my money.

[TheBlackPaladin]

Since they're apparently bringing back Kikuchi, can we take it a step further and bring back Hironobu Kageyama? I'd be excited as hell for that.

[Savage68]

Also wouldn't Dragonball Evolution is the worst fail in Dragonball history?

Not even close, no.

[kei17]

Some Japanese online news sites began reporting this matter.

http://news.biglobe.ne.jp/it/0311/itm_1 ... 46821.html
http://www.itmedia.co.jp/news/articles/ ... ws032.html

[TheMajinRedComet]

Just so everyone calms down. None of the sources have yet to say how the score will be altered, I really doubt that they are going to use the DBZ score, considering they would have to pay for it, its not like its stock music. They will probably just re edit the score. Scratch that... Just read Kanzentai... Well either way it will be interesting.

[TheBlackPaladin]

Just so everyone calms down. None of the sources have yet to say how the score will be altered, I really doubt that they are going to use the DBZ score, considering they would have to pay for it, its not like its stock music. They will probably just re edit the score.

Except that Toei now lists "Shunsuke Kikuchi" under "Staff" for Dragon Ball Z Kai on their web site.

[Goku100xKamehameha]

So there are 2 possibilities here:
1. They will use the Z BGM mixed with Kikuchi's new ones.
2. They will only use the Z BGM.

I doubt it's the first though, since it would cost more money for Toei.

[Hujio]

...I really doubt that they are going to use the DBZ score, considering they would have to pay for it, its not like its stock music.

Unless I'm insanely mistaken, I'm pretty sure it is stock music. As far as I know, through all of my anime production research, Toei owns the rights to all of Kikuchi's music for the series. So technically, they can do with it what they want. It's like any job really; you're hired by a company to do something for them, like write reports or music. If they fire you, you can't take everything you've ever done for them with you, because since they paid you to do, they own it. For example, the band Reel Big Fish recently had to re-record some of their hit songs for a compilation album because the original recordings of said songs are owned by their previous label. If Toei paid anyone for using the original score from Z, it would be themselves. So I guess, technically speaking, it would have been cheaper for Toei to just reuse the original score to begin with... but that's a different discussion entirely.

Except that Toei now lists "Shunsuke Kikuchi" under "Staff" for Dragon Ball Z Kai on their web site.

Sorry, but this is a pet peeve of mine... Toei Animation doesn't run a "Dragon Ball Z Kai" website, they run a "Dragon Ball Kai" website. If you're talking about an international release, the series is called "Dragon Ball Z Kai", and if it's specifically the Japanese release, it's "Dragon Ball Kai".

[TheBlackPaladin]

Except that Toei now lists "Shunsuke Kikuchi" under "Staff" for Dragon Ball Z Kai on their web site.

Sorry, but this is a pet peeve of mine... Toei Animation doesn't run a "Dragon Ball Z Kai" website, they run a "Dragon Ball Kai" website. If you're talking about an international release, the series is called "Dragon Ball Z Kai", and if it's specifically the Japanese release, it's "Dragon Ball Kai".

Sorry, old habits die hard. I'm used to calling it that because I had almost zero interest in Kai until FUNimation announced they would be dubbing it...even now, my primary interest in Kai continues to be the new dub.

[penguintruth]

Replacing Yamamoto's score wholesale seems like dreadful overkill. Just replacing the ripped off music should be enough.

[RazorX]

This is very bad news. Yamamoto's score is amazing in the Android & Cell episodes and was one of the main reasons I kept up with Kai regularly. It's quite a shocking event, I was looking forward to hearing the musical piece played when Gohan kills Cell. I suppose we should be grateful that this event did not occur before Gohan's SSJ2 transformation.

However I think the idea that Toei might rescore all of Kai is absurd.
Toei have said they are investigating and trying to gather facts. In the meantime they might want to hastily replace the music in repeats for the time being so that they can identify which musical pieces have reasonable grounds of infringement claims. They may have used Kikuchi's score and listed Kikuchi as Kai's composer to show the third party they are serious. I think Kai's score will remain mostly the same.

But this means I'll be importing Kai's soundtrack releases fairly quickly before Toei tries to do something silly with them.

Hopefully this turn of events results in a big sales increase for Kai as people might think they might get an altered product if they wait.

The most rare lost version will be the recent episodes that have not been released so far.

I think the repeats with Kikuchi's music will be the rare episodes as it seems Toei hastily scrambled themes and put them in the episodes without much thought, considering what they allegedly played during Gohan's SSJ2 transformation. Once Toei have resolved the issue they'll probably put Yamamoto's music back in. So I hope people are recording the episodes with replaced music because I doubt they'll be released.

[kei17]

Replacing Yamamoto's score wholesale seems like dreadful overkill. Just replacing the ripped off music should be enough.

There is still a possibility of existence of more rip-offs. They cannot use anything he made except the variations of others' creations such as Dragon Soul and Kokoro No Hane.

[TheMajinRedComet]

You might be right, I know some American composers have limited control and royalties, but knowing the Japanese Anime industry the composers are probably SOL. Either way I think it would be smart to buy the English Kai sets now if you like the new score, because I would not put it past toei to recall. I really hope they dont, but I bought the parts I was missing anyways, because of the price drop and just in case.

[CODii]

Just so everyone calms down. None of the sources have yet to say how the score will be altered, I really doubt that they are going to use the DBZ score, considering they would have to pay for it, its not like its stock music. They will probably just re edit the score. Scratch that... Just read Kanzentai... Well either way it will be interesting.

Why would they have to pay for it? I'd be willing to bet that since the music was produced for Toei by a composer employed by Toei that they own the rights to the music. If you make something for someone, chances are you're signing away all your rights to that product.

[penguintruth]

RazorX makes an interesting suggestion, that this may be merely a stop-gap measure until they can discern the severity of the rip-offs and how deeply the penetrate the whole soundtrack. Even if they do replace the soundtrack with Kikuchi music, it may not necessarily be in the way the episodes that have aired with Kikuchi music have it arranged.

[MR.Mark]

I certainly hope so, as I'm a bigger fan of Kikuchi's score, but not used in this slap dash way.

Man, first no Kai Buu era and now this, it's a huge mess.