Re: Birthday for Son Goten?

Li'l Lemmy · Post by **Li'l Lemmy** » Sun Aug 21, 2011 8:27 pm

We know that Goten was born in 767, but do we have any indication of his actual birthday? I've "seen" birthdays for other characters that for all I know are completely made-up, arbitrary fan nonsense... but they could just as easily be real, and given that I've never seen one for Goten I have to consider that he wasn't a featured enough character to get one either way.

Still. Any information?

~Da Lemmy

Shiyonasan · Post by **Shiyonasan** » Sun Aug 21, 2011 9:44 pm

Only two exact birthdays are ever stated to my knowledge, which are Piccolo's and Gohan's.

Herms states Piccolo's birthday is May 9, 753 in the A Stronger Loving Time-Line topic.

Herms wrote:Age 753

May 9th: Drum is born, only to be killed by Goku minutes afterward. Goku defeats Piccolo Daimao. Ma Junior is born. Goku goes to Kami’s temple, and from this day on receives training from Kami for the next 3 years.

Gohan is also stated to be born in May as well, according to Herms in the aforementioned topic. [D] stands for information taken from the Daizenshuu or databooks:

Herms wrote:Age 757
Sometime in May: Gohan is born. [D]

To my knowledge, no exact birthday is stated for Goten. The math behind Goten's age in the Buu arc is really askew as shown in this topic about Goten's Age.

EDIT: Just looked over my post again and corrected a few things. Looking at the A Stronger Loving Time-Line thread, Goten was actually probably born sometime in January-May 6, 767, since he is explicitly stated to be 7 years old at the 25th Tenkaichi Budoukai, which takes place May 7, 774. I seriously doubt his birthday is during the days listed during the Buu arc in 774 (March 28, April 7-10, April 20, May 7-9) since the event of his birthday would have been explicitly stated during those days even though there was a lot going on with Gohan, the Budoukai, and Buu during those days.

Anyway, here are the timelines for 767 and 774 from the timeline thread. [A] stands for things that only happened in the TV anime filler:

Herms wrote:Age 767
Goten is born this year

May 7th: The 24th Tenkaichi Budoukai is held. Mister Satan is the champion of the adult division, while Videl is the children’s division champion.

May 12th: The androids appear, and Goku passes out from his contagious disease. Not long after, Cell appears in the afternoon. Piccolo merges with the Earth’s Kami. Kuririn and Trunks (teenager) destroy the young form of the Cell that existed in the present.

May 15th: Goku recovers from his contagious disease with the medicine that Trunks brought from the future. Vegeta and Trunks enter the Room of Spirit and Time.

May 16th: Cell evolves into his second stage, and then into his perfect form. Switching with Vegata and Trunks, Goku and Gohan enter the Room of Spirit and Time.

May 17th: The opening of the Cell Games is broadcast to the entire world. Goku and Gohan emerge from the Room of Spirit and Time. Piccolo enters the Room of Spirit and Time.

May 18th:
--Switching with Piccolo, Vegeta once again enters the Room of Spirit and Time.
--Gohan visits Lime’s village, and stops the evil acts of Bourbon and his men [A]

May 19th: Goku and his family go hiking. Around noon, the Royal Defense Force is wiped out by Cell. Dende takes on the position of the Earth’s new Kami. Switching with Vegeta, Trunks enters the Room of Spirit and Time.

May 20th: Trunks comes out from the Room of Spirit and Time.

May 26th: The Cell Games begin at exactly noon. Goku dies again, and Gohan defeats Cell.

May 27th: A memorial service is held for Goku. Trunks (teenager) returns to the future.

May~June: Goku goes to the Dai-Kaio Planet and meets the Dai-Kaio. The “North-Kaio-Kicked-the-Bucket Commemoration Strongest in the Afterlife Tournament” is held. Goku and Paikuhan clash in the finals. The baby Trunks takes his first steps. “Urgent Special Broadcast!! All About Mister Satan, the Super Genius Strongest Grappler on Earth, who Save Humanity” is broadcast on television. [A]

Age 774
Uub is born this year.

March 28th: Gohan completes first part of the enrollment process at Orange Star High School. The Golden Warrior is seen by the people of Satan City for the first time.

April 7th: Gohan in enrolled as a sophomore at Orange Star High School, and attends his first day of class, and meets Videl. On his way home from school, Gohan stops by Bulma’s house at around 3:00 PM, and at 5:12 PM he receives the completed transformation suits. Great Saiyaman appears in the city for the first time.

April 8th: Videl uncovers the Great Saiyaman’s identity.

April 9th: Gohan teaches Videl Bukujutsu. The South Kaio observes Goku’s training.

April 10th: Vegeta is surprised to learn that his son Trunks (chibi) can already become a Super Saiyan. Having cut her hair short, Videl continues to train with Gohan.

April 20th: Videl masters Bukujutsu.

May 7th: The 25th Tenkaichi Budoukai opens. Goku returns to this world for a single day. Majin Boo is revived. In order to defeat Boo, Vegeta explodes and dies. Goku transforms into a Super Saiyan 3 and battles Boo, after which Boo kills the wizard Babidi. Having used up his power fighting Boo, Goku returns to the afterlife earlier than planned. Goku goes to the Kaioshin Realm and reunites with Gohan. Majin Boo builds his house.

May 8th: Since being freed the day before, Majin Boo has already destroyed 80% of the world’s cities and population. In the Kaioshin Realm, the Elder Kaioshin is released from being sealed in the Z Sword, and begins the 25-hour ritual to draw out Gohan’s power. Mister Satan is sent to defeat Boo, but starts to befriend him instead. Goten and Trunks perfect Fusion, and Gotenks is born, but he is not yet a match for Boo.

May 9th: Boo adopts a pet dog, and vows to never kill or destroy again. But evil humans shoot Boo’s dog, and a new, evil Boo is born. Humanity is exterminated through the evil Boo’s power. Piccolo, Gotenks, and Gohan are absorbed by Boo. Goku returns to life in exchange for the Elder Kaioshin’s life, and Vegeta returns to the world for one day. Boo returns to his original state of pure evil, and annihilates the Earth. Goku and Vegeta begin battling the pure evil Boo. The Earth is restored by Polunga’s power. Vegeta, Elder Kaioshin, and the rest come back to life. Goku wipes Boo out with the Super Genki Dama collected from the genki of all humanity.

September 7th: The people of Earth’s memories of Majin Boo are erased by Shenlong.

Suupaa Gohan 2 · Post by **Suupaa Gohan 2** » Sun Aug 28, 2011 8:54 pm

Not sure how relevant this is, but you did seem to be cool with the ideas of fanmade things (which is usually where character birthdays originate in fandoms like this, as far as I've seen)...a popular thing I see on a lot of Japanese blogs and places like Pixiv is reading the character's name as numbers, which is...I actually forget the actual term for it, but it's a type of common Japanese wordplay due to the variety of different pronunciations that exist for numbers and number combinations. For instance, Goten's name can be given 'go', the Japanese word for the number 5, and then 'ten' being, of course, the English word for the number 10...so, 510. I've seen this number applied to Goten - and similar number wordplay applied to numerous characters in other fandoms, as well - and a lot of the time fans will celebrate that character's 'day' (not necessarily claiming it's their birthday, but like, 'Happy Goten Day') if it corresponds to a date. So in Goten's case, 5/10 could be May 10th, or October 5th depending on how you read it.

Personally I think May 10th fits better, though that may just be because I associate October 5th with a far more gruesome Japanese fandom ^^; But it gives room for two potential fandom birthday choices.

Li'l Lemmy · Post by **Li'l Lemmy** » Mon Aug 29, 2011 7:41 am

Thank you, Shiyonasan, for your thoughtful (and thorough) reply. I had actually meant to reply much sooner, so please forgive me for allowing your hard work to languish...

I had a bad feeling that there was no official birthday for the character, but even though I wish there were it's nice to have a "this is what's what" confirmation either way. Y'know, as opposed to me... ah, obsessing continually over the little things that I don't know, as I have been known to do with Goten.

Digging up minor facts like this is like mining for gold when it comes to someone like me. I can still remember when the Super Exciting Guides (I think?) listed pocky and daifuku as Goten's favorite foods. ;p

Yeah... just his age in general is a bit of a fuck-up, id'n it? o_O

@Suupaa Gohan 2: Hey, girl! Ain't seen you in the Dragon World for quite awhile. Thanks for participating, and thanks so much for the idea... because with no official birthday listed, I'm happy to take any numbers I can get! Happy Goten Day!!

But gosh. Now begs the question: Do I take May 10th, or October 5th? 5/10 makes more sense, since it directly "translates" to Go/Ten, but October 5th is just around the corner and I wanna celebrate...

Oh, well. I'll figure it out. Gotta love that big, sexy brain of yours either way. ;p

~Da Lemmy

Suupaa Gohan 2 · Post by **Suupaa Gohan 2** » Mon Aug 29, 2011 12:15 pm

Well I mean, typically in the United States we take 5/10 to mean May 10th, but I know in other parts of the world the reading is reversed and some people might read it October 5th. For you, May 10th would probably make the most sense. I just wasn't sure what suited all those 'Goten was conceived [x]' conspiracy theories better based on the official dates...the Androids arrived sometime in May or something, right?

dbgtFO · Post by **dbgtFO** » Mon Aug 29, 2011 12:28 pm

Suupaa Gohan 2 wrote:Well I mean, typically in the United States we take 5/10 to mean May 10th, but I know in other parts of the world the reading is reversed and some people might read it October 5th. For you, May 10th would probably make the most sense. I just wasn't sure what suited all those 'Goten was conceived [x]' conspiracy theories better based on the official dates...the Androids arrived sometime in May or something, right?

Yeah, May 12th.
I honestly think there's a retcon going on with Goten. He's directly stated to be 7 in the Buu Arc right? If so he should have been born before the androids started attacking.

Post by **Herms** » Mon Aug 29, 2011 1:31 pm

dbgtFO wrote:I honestly think there's a retcon going on with Goten. He's directly stated to be 7 in the Buu Arc right? If so he should have been born before the androids started attacking.

Yeah, the tournament announcer says he's 7 right before he fights Ikose. Maybe he's supposed to be 7 under the "everyone's age goes up at New Years rather than their individual birthdays" method of counting age, but even then the android/Cell arc's in May, so if he were conceived then he'd be born well into the next year and would only be around for 6 New Years by the Boo arc.

So, ugh...Hey, maybe 7 was the minimum age to enter the tournament, so they lied about his age to get him in? Not that there's anything supporting that...

Piccolo Daimao · Post by **Piccolo Daimao** » Mon Aug 29, 2011 1:37 pm

Herms wrote:So, ugh...Hey, maybe 7 was the minimum age to enter the tournament, so they lied about his age to get him in? Not that there's anything supporting that...

But Trunks is 8, and it's said that he's a year older than Goten.

caejones · Post by **caejones** » Tue Aug 30, 2011 3:32 am

Did Gyu-mao appear in the Jinzouningen arc? I seem to remember him hanging out with ChiChi when they were watching the Cell Games on TV, but I don't recall him doing much otherwisee (not outside of filler, anyway).
Maybe they anticipated that the Jinzouningen might attack Goku's house, so Gyu-Mao took Goten somewhere else for May 12?

Or...ur... maybe ChiChi hid Goten's birth from Goku, since he was ignoring her to train all that time. And... umm... maybe he was kidnapped ... and... Gyu-mao was out rescuing him while everyone else was dealing with the Jinzouningen...

... Hmm, let's see what other silly theories that probably can't work I can come up with...
Goten could be a clone of Goku that Trunks and Krillin rescued from Gero's lab and secretly dropped off with ChiChi when no one was looking!

Piccolo Daimao · Post by **Piccolo Daimao** » Tue Aug 30, 2011 10:03 am

caejones wrote:Did Gyu-mao appear in the Jinzouningen arc? I seem to remember him hanging out with ChiChi when they were watching the Cell Games on TV, but I don't recall him doing much otherwisee (not outside of filler, anyway).
Maybe they anticipated that the Jinzouningen might attack Goku's house, so Gyu-Mao took Goten somewhere else for May 12?

Or...ur... maybe ChiChi hid Goten's birth from Goku, since he was ignoring her to train all that time. And... umm... maybe he was kidnapped ... and... Gyu-mao was out rescuing him while everyone else was dealing with the Jinzouningen...

... Hmm, let's see what other silly theories that probably can't work I can come up with...
Goten could be a clone of Goku that Trunks and Krillin rescued from Gero's lab and secretly dropped off with ChiChi when no one was looking!

In the manga, Gyu-mao appeared in the Cell arc when he and Chi-Chi were in Chi-Chi's house, watching Gohan fight Cell at the Cell Games. I think that's the only time we see him.

A common fan theory to explain away the plothole of Chi-Chi not looking pregnant throughout the Cell arc is that, because Goten's a half-Saiyan, the nine-months-pregnancy or whatever was different for her.

Of course, the actual explanation is that throughout DB (and probably other manga), Toriyama never draws pregnant women, only introducing a new child after a time skip. Not to mention Goten probably wasn't even concieved (lol, pun intended) by Toriyama until after the Cell arc.

Post by **Herms** » Tue Aug 30, 2011 10:29 am

Piccolo Daimao wrote:Of course, the actual explanation is that throughout DB (and probably other manga), Toriyama never draws pregnant women, only introducing a new child after a time skip.

We do get to see Midori pregnant during Dr. Slump, and the hero's girlfriend pregnant at the end of Mad Matic.

Michsi · Post by **Michsi** » Tue Aug 30, 2011 10:37 am

I think I've read somewhere once that in some asian countries, people also add the year they spend in the mothers womb to their age. Don't think this applies in Japan aswell, tough.

Piccolo Daimao · Post by **Piccolo Daimao** » Tue Aug 30, 2011 11:09 am

Herms wrote:
Piccolo Daimao wrote:Of course, the actual explanation is that throughout DB (and probably other manga), Toriyama never draws pregnant women, only introducing a new child after a time skip.
We do get to see Midori pregnant during Dr. Slump, and the hero's girlfriend pregnant at the end of Mad Matic.

OK then. I was just guessing, as I haven't really read much of Toriyama's other manga.