Goten Overlooked?

[Kuriza510]

I love Goten and his relation with Trunks, but I feel that Goten was a fairly overlooked character. I once heard a rumor that the whole reason for Goten and his design was to replace Goku (that's why he looks so much like him), but fans didn't like it. But besides that I believe that Goten never really had any character development or purpose in the show. This was kinda shown in GT (And yes I know that it's not canon) when Goten was barely even in the show.

Does anybody else have any thoughts?

[Herms]

I once heard a rumor that the whole reason for Goten and his design was to replace Goku (that's why he looks so much like him), but fans didn't like it.

Like many such rumors, that's something that gets repeated and repeated without anyone ever providing a source. It could be true, but we have no way of knowing, that I'm aware of.

[dprez]

^ I've heard the same thing, without seeing any actual interview that states this.

I always believed that if Goten tried hard enough, he could've surpassed Goku and Gohan. Born with such incredible power, and being able to so easily achieve Ssj, Ssj2 and Ssj3 should be far easier to reach for Goten than it was for Goku and Gohan.

[FindKenshi]

I would say that what we do know of the situation makes that quite unlikely. I read at Kanzentai that Akira Toriyama had said that he had intended for Gohan to take on the role of the hero, but then had changed his mind and decided that Goku was best, after all. So, if it's not Goku, then it's Gohan. Seems there would be little room for Goten to "replace Goku" in that equation.

[Li'l Lemmy]

Could Goten have been conceded more of a role in the series than he gets? Well, certainly. Did he have a significant enough role already when you consider how late in the series he appears, though? Most definitely.

Was Goten particularly overlooked when you consider the Big Picture? My emotional bias would say yes-- I always want more Goten-- but from a logical standpoint I have to say no. Lots of other, more established characters were treated much more unevenly than Goten throughout the series' run. The kid was a fairly celebrated addition to the cast when you think about folks like Tenshinhan and Yamcha who are relegated to background status years before Goten was even born, and super power-ups like Fusion and Super Saiyan 3 keep him relevant right up until the end of the series and the last few movies. Had the series continued, I have little doubt that his Amazing Saiyan Blood would have kept him in the mix.

My own personal idea of how Goten is underutilized relates more to the things that happen to him... as in, there weren't enough. With a few exceptions, he was generally confined to specific qualities (Goku lookalike, Trunks' tag-along, etc.) and as a result just wasn't challenged enough in terms of character. Quite simply, while I adore his character for what it is, I admit that "what it is" ain't a whole lot when compared to... say, a more complex character like Gohan. The most human, three-dimensional moments Goten has as a character are when ChiChi is destroyed by Majin Boo and his subsequent determination upon entering the Room of Spirit and Time. (Well... there's also when he meets Goku for the first time, but that goes without saying.) We just didn't get enough of those.

There was room for more, but Z came to an end and that chance got nerfed. Then GT came along and... well, I kinda refuse to discuss GT. >_<;

I don't "blame" Goten, though. Even if I would have preferred to see it further developed, I would also argue that his simplicity of character is its own special charm. Generally, I blame the running-out-of-time factor and the fact that the Boo arc is a convoluted mess in general.

Goten has always been my favorite character, but even I have to admit that he was given quite a bit to do considering his circumstances. I wouldn't call him particularly neglected.


~Da Lemmy

[Rocketman]

The most human, three-dimensional moments Goten has as a character are when ChiChi is destroyed by Majin Boo and his subsequent determination upon entering the Room of Spirit and Time.

Followed by "tee hee let's fuck around as gotenks!".

[Saiga]

The most human, three-dimensional moments Goten has as a character are when ChiChi is destroyed by Majin Boo and his subsequent determination upon entering the Room of Spirit and Time.

Followed by "tee hee let's fuck around as gotenks!".

I blame Trunks for that.

[Michsi]

I kind of got the feeling that Goten's potential as a character was cut short, because he was made to play second fiddle to Trunks. We didn't really see him do anything independantly after they were paired up.

If you think about it, the same thing happened with Goku in the very beginning of the story when his presence was somewhat overshadowed by more dynamic characters like Bulma,Oolong and Yamcha. I think Toriyama's editor at the time even mentioned that even though he is supposed to be the main character, he doesn't stand out much. I'm guessing that's why he chose to have them go seperate ways after the first arc, in order to let him grow as a character and have the story focus on him more.

Goten was never given such a chance, even though he showed a small glimpse that he might share the same sort of brilliance as his father when fighting. Because of that , even though Trunks won the match, it seemed to me that Goten came out the victor as a character.

[Godo]

^ I've heard the same thing, without seeing any actual interview that states this.

I always believed that if Goten tried hard enough, he could've surpassed Goku and Gohan. Born with such incredible power, and being able to so easily achieve Ssj, Ssj2 and Ssj3 should be far easier to reach for Goten than it was for Goku and Gohan.

I think that's the problem. Everytime in the series when we see a character that is very strong without training much, he has been shown to stay at that power. Look at the Ginyu squad, Boo, Freeza, Yajirobe, Dodoria, Cui etc.
Those who do train do that because of either an inner drive, or due to an absolute nessecity. Goten is never shown to have either, unless you count the ROSAT, but then his need to become powerful is negated with the presence of Gotenks.

[Dabooyaka]

I would have like the Boo saga better had Goten not existed. It's bad enough that future Trunks was replaced by Chibi Trunks, now we have 2 morons running around? Horrible character, bothersome and not needed. I might be baised mind you, my hatred for the boys might stem from my dislike of children.

[Goten Forever]

I've heard that rumor too. On Risachantag's Goten Shrine perhaps?
But, yeah. I agree. There was so much development in the Buu arc on him then he never shines again and isn't SEEN until he becomes Bebi's first victim. And kills his girlfriend, which was my favourite part of the whole of GT.

[Goten Forever]

Could Goten have been conceded more of a role in the series than he gets? Well, certainly. Did he have a significant enough role already when you consider how late in the series he appears, though? Most definitely.

Was Goten particularly overlooked when you consider the Big Picture? My emotional bias would say yes-- I always want more Goten-- but from a logical standpoint I have to say no. Lots of other, more established characters were treated much more unevenly than Goten throughout the series' run. The kid was a fairly celebrated addition to the cast when you think about folks like Tenshinhan and Yamcha who are relegated to background status years before Goten was even born, and super power-ups like Fusion and Super Saiyan 3 keep him relevant right up until the end of the series and the last few movies. Had the series continued, I have little doubt that his Amazing Saiyan Blood would have kept him in the mix.



~Da Lemmy

I definitely agree that Goten was not quite as maltreated as all the other once awesome characters - I suspect Toriyama found himself with too many characters to involve them all in epic fights and battles.
Gohan clearly has more dimensions than any other character in the series, since he seems to have more damn emotions than any others. But I like Goten's oblique childishness :3
Wish that characters like Yamucha and Kuririn and even Yajirobe could have been more involved. The only cool thing Yajirobe did in the entire series was remove the tail of... Gohan or Vegeta, I think.
But yeah, he didn't get a primary individual role at all.

[Piccolo Daimao]

Could Goten have been conceded more of a role in the series than he gets? Well, certainly. Did he have a significant enough role already when you consider how late in the series he appears, though? Most definitely.

Was Goten particularly overlooked when you consider the Big Picture? My emotional bias would say yes-- I always want more Goten-- but from a logical standpoint I have to say no. Lots of other, more established characters were treated much more unevenly than Goten throughout the series' run. The kid was a fairly celebrated addition to the cast when you think about folks like Tenshinhan and Yamcha who are relegated to background status years before Goten was even born, and super power-ups like Fusion and Super Saiyan 3 keep him relevant right up until the end of the series and the last few movies. Had the series continued, I have little doubt that his Amazing Saiyan Blood would have kept him in the mix.

My own personal idea of how Goten is underutilized relates more to the things that happen to him... as in, there weren't enough. With a few exceptions, he was generally confined to specific qualities (Goku lookalike, Trunks' tag-along, etc.) and as a result just wasn't challenged enough in terms of character. Quite simply, while I adore his character for what it is, I admit that "what it is" ain't a whole lot when compared to... say, a more complex character like Gohan. The most human, three-dimensional moments Goten has as a character are when ChiChi is destroyed by Majin Boo and his subsequent determination upon entering the Room of Spirit and Time. (Well... there's also when he meets Goku for the first time, but that goes without saying.) We just didn't get enough of those.

There was room for more, but Z came to an end and that chance got nerfed. Then GT came along and... well, I kinda refuse to discuss GT. >_<;

I don't "blame" Goten, though. Even if I would have preferred to see it further developed, I would also argue that his simplicity of character is its own special charm. Generally, I blame the running-out-of-time factor and the fact that the Boo arc is a convoluted mess in general.

Goten has always been my favorite character, but even I have to admit that he was given quite a bit to do considering his circumstances. I wouldn't call him particularly neglected.


~Da Lemmy

I pretty much wholly agree with this post (apart from Goten being my favourite character; Piccolo is ). At the end of the day, alongside Trunks, the most he contributed to the plot was basically being Fusion fodder for Gotenks. Shafting Gohan out of the way for a while (Gokuu apparently quickly gave up on Gohan being the next hero after seeing how much he'd slacked off), the story attempts to hype up Goten and Trunks being the next protectors of Earth, with even Gokuu holding off on killing Boo because he wants them to give it a shot, only for their characters to practically disappear when they merge into Gotenks, who could probably best be explained as taking Goten and Trunks' worst qualities and then multiplying them by x10, presumably the reason why he still decided to fuck around even after his parents had been killed. And then, like Gohan, they turn into slackers by the end of the manga, when they become teenagers and start living normal lives.

I do think it was a bad idea and a gimmick for Toriyama to try and make Goten like another Gokuu. He looked like him, yet he had practically none of the original and charming qualities that child Gokuu had, what with his social ignorance, overall optimism about everything, etc. Goten was just an extension of Trunks' character, which can make for a quite a good (and somewhat relatable) dynamic between the two kids, but it kind of defeats the point and I guess Toriyama even realized this when he ended up changing his hairstyle at the end of the manga to differentiate him from Gokuu.

All in all...wasted potential. I've never been happy about Goten and Trunks basically being handed SS on a golden platter while everyone else actually had to work for their power, and while I understand that that was part of the whole wacky nature of the Boo arc, it's still like Toriyama took a massive shit on the other warriors (especially the Earthlings, who by this point had been shafted twice over) and it makes Goten and Trunks' under-utilization all the more sad. Toei had a chance to give them the attention they needed, but they were apparently blinded from all the spunk as a result of too much Gokuu-fapping, to the point that even characters like Gohan and Vegeta were shafted.

Maybe it would've been better if they'd never existed at all. Then they could focus on Gohan, rather than introduce another generation of warriors right at the end of the series that just remain at loose ends (and I think Toriyama had decided before or during the Boo arc that it would mark the series' climax, considering that the series had past its sell-by date sometime before then and both the story and art were suffering under Toriyama's fatigue).

[Twinbee_Mk_II]

Ummm Goten never kills his girlfriend. Mr Satan gets her to saftey just fine and she survives GT. Dunno where you got the idea that he did her in.

[dbboxkaifan]

Whatever Goten's point was, I never liked Son Goten, with the original Japanese voice, English, Spanish, Portuguese or etc. Trunks was more interesting.

Goten to me was like a Kid Goku in DBZ, but inferior.

[Piccolo Daimao]

Whatever Goten's point was, I never liked Son Goten, with the original Japanese voice, English, Spanish, Portuguese or etc. Trunks was more interesting.

To be honest, I think neither Goten nor Trunks were interesting at all. Maybe that's just because I don't like kids, but I found Trunks to be a spoilt, annoying little brat, a sharp contrast to the humble, polite and more cautious future Trunks (although, obviously, that's because he grew up in an apocalyptic future).

[Goten Forever]

Ummm Goten never kills his girlfriend. Mr Satan gets her to saftey just fine and she survives GT. Dunno where you got the idea that he did her in.

What?

*Wiki time*

[TheDevilsCorpse]

*Wiki time*

First mistake... should be *watch GT time*. =P

[Goten Forever]

You are right... DAMMIT.

But check out this page: http://dragonball.wikia.com/wiki/Valese
My god. Written by a 5-year-old pairing fangirl.

[Goten Forever]

*Wiki time*

First mistake... should be *watch GT time*. =P

One: dunno about the right episode.
Two: GT? Not worth my time.