The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread

[shonenhikada]

Fine I concede on the second point, however it does not show goku being so incredibly weak as you suggest, for all we know he could of just gotten a little weaker from his maximum.

However let look at this shall we

Chapter: 502 (DBZ 308), P7.1
Context: talking to Goku after knocking out Tenshinhan
Boo: “…That guy just now was apparently quite a master, but he was reduced to that state in just 1 one kick…You’re making some worthless boasts…Frankly, no matter what you try, you absolutely won’t be able to even inflict damage on me.”

That's the quote I'm referring to.
He basically says 'I knocked him out in one kick. How are you supposed to do any better?' He looks upon base Goku and Tenshinhan as comparable with one another or else he wouldn't think that feat would intimidate him imo.

Pretty sure base goku would be stronger than Goten and Trunks. Since the base saiyans were said to be stronger than piccolo in the buu arc, and vegeta being confident that he could win the tournament without having to go super saiyan.

[dbzfan7]

Except that none of that matters, since the idea was them to use fusion and Super Saiyan...

yeah but my point just like toriyama even said is fusion is greater then super saiyan.

[dbgtFO]

^^Ah, you're bringing up that point, the only problem is Buu already knows that Goku has SS 3, so with that interpretation you'd be saying Tenshinhan is comparable to Super Saiyan 3 Goku.

Besides that interpretation is not shared by all. If he said, what you are saying he basically said, then it likely would, but he didn't.
He just gave a quick comment on Tenshinhan's power, which was nothing to his, got back to his conversation with Goku and assured him, he would fail no matter what he did.

[shonenhikada]

^^Ah, you're bringing up that point, the only problem is Buu already knows that Goku has SS 3, so with that interpretation you'd be saying Tenshinhan is comparable to Super Saiyan 3 Goku.

Besides that interpretation is not shared by all. If he said, what you are saying he basically said, then it likely would, but he didn't.
He just gave a quick comment on Tenshinhan's power, which was nothing to his, got back to his conversation with Goku and assured him, he would fail no matter what he did.

Buu was retarded when it came to different SSjin transformations. This is his reaction to SSjin3 Gotenks and Gotenks spelling out how he changed;
Chapter: 493 (DBZ 299), P11.5-6
Boo: “Huh? Did you change a little bit?”
Gotenks: “Idii---iiot! I’m not making a big fuss over just ‘a little bit’! I’ve become incredibly, incredibly, incree~~eedibly strong!”

All Evil Buu remembered about Goku was that he was the 'guy with the *weird* transformations' (almost as if he thought that the transformations did nothing but change his appearance?).

The facts are that SSjin,SSjin2 and SSjin3 Goku were never sensed by Buu and the only memory he had of Goku was his transformations.

[Saiga]

I didn't say Goku was incredibly weak, just weaker than normal and still enough to dwarf Tenshinhan.

The boys in the meanwhile were able to fight opponents like Gohan and #18.

Really, there's simply no evidence of Tenshinhan being stronger than the boys at all.

[shonenhikada]

I didn't say Goku was incredibly weak, just weaker than normal and still enough to dwarf Tenshinhan.

The boys in the meanwhile were able to fight opponents like Gohan and #18.

Really, there's simply no evidence of Tenshinhan being stronger than the boys at all.

Both combatants the boys fought were holding back. So its a mute point.

[FNF]

WTF, Shonen is copy and pasting one of my ancient posts from Neoseeker;

Chapter: 502 (DBZ 308), P7.1
Context: talking to Goku after knocking out Tenshinhan
Boo: “…That guy just now was apparently quite a master, but he was reduced to that state in just 1 one kick…You’re making some worthless boasts…Frankly, no matter what you try, you absolutely won’t be able to even inflict damage on me.”

That's the quote I'm referring to.
He basically says 'I knocked him out in one kick. How are you supposed to do any better?' He looks upon base Goku and Tenshinhan as comparable with one another or else he wouldn't think that feat would intimidate him imo.

But yeah I conceded a short time after that it doesn't work.

To be fair though, Tenshinhan's appearance does have an air about it. If nobody had ever read/watched DBZ before they would probably come to the conclusion that Tenshinhan was a super-duper, strong guy based on his appearance and the air around it.

I just have both Tenshinhan and Krillin at least a good bit stronger than Freeza in the Boo arc because of a couple of suggestions here and there.

@Shonen stop copy and pasting my old posts. I myself admit they are incorrect.

“…What, did you plan on coming to save everyone? You idiot…Can’t you tell that I’m in a fundamentally different dimension than the Majin Boo from back then?”

Boo remembers that SSjin3 Goku>Fat Boo.

[dbgtFO]

^
It's funny, I too realized this was something you had said in the past and considered bringing it up, but decided against it, since I couldn't be bothered to go looking for the post on Neo should I be asked for proof.

[FNF]

^
It's funny, I too realized this was something you had said in the past and considered bringing it up, but decided against it, since I couldn't be bothered to go looking for the post on Neo should I be asked for proof.

Yeah I just came back to these forums a week ago after a few months enjoying the summer and then all of a sudden I see the vast majority of people on DBZf using my logic for Krillin>Freeza and now I see kids copying my posts from last year lol. I'm completely lost.

[mysticboy]

Mr. Satan vs. (Piccolo Jr. saga) Goku (pure skill only)

[DBZAOTA482]

Mr. Satan vs. (Piccolo Jr. saga) Goku (pure skill only)

Goku still wins.

[Fox666]

Goku is a master of martial arts. Even at the same strength Goku should able to break Satan's neck with one hand.

[FNF]

The techniques someone possesses counts as 'skills' so obviously Satan get hammered into the ground.

[Piccolo Daimao]

SS Goten vs. first-form Cell (during rematch with Piccolo)

I think that Goten may be able to put up a decent fight, but would ultimately lose to Cell's superior strength and energy-absorbing.

Future Trunks (Super Saiyan Grade III) vs. Vegeta (Super Saiyan Grade II)

I think that, since Gokuu believed that he couldn't defeat second-form Cell with SS Grade II (and the last he'd seen of Cell was his second form; he couldn't sense Perfect Cell, Vegeta or anyone else outside of the RoSaT), Trunks' speed reduction would put him at too much of a disadvantage against the faster and more skilled Vegeta.

[Kaboom]

SS Goten vs. first-form Cell (during rematch with Cell)

Do you mean "rematch with Piccolo," or are common typos canon now?

That said, I consider the boys as Super Saiyans more or less on-par with Second-form Cell, but only in power. Goten would have an easy win on his hands unless he gets too sloppy and Cell manages to stab and absorb him.

Future Trunks (Super Saiyan Grade III) vs. Vegeta (Super Saiyan Grade II)

I agree with you on this one; Grade 3's severe speed loss makes it useless in pretty much any situation. Vegeta would be able to fly circles around Trunks and take potshots at him.

[dbzfan7]

Son Goku vs Muten Roshi at the 21st Tenkaichi Budokai, but this time to the death. Who comes out on top?

Son Goku vs Tenshinhan at 22nd Tenkaichi Budokai, but also to the death

Rules
-Death is allowed at tourneys
-No ring outs
-Goku gets his tail
-Tail can't be exploited, so no exploiting the tail weakness
-No full moon/Oozaru transformation

[mysticboy]

Roshi.

[Piccolo Daimao]

Chichi (violent temperment) vs Vegeta (violent... nature)

Chi-Chi wins. Duh. “Hell hath no fury like a women scorned.”

^ Chi-Chi rapes him.

SSJ3 Broly vs. Kid Buu

If this is Broli from Movie #8, then he loses hard. If this is Broli from Movie #10, then he still loses, but is able to put up a decent fight for a bit. As Kaboom said, even if Broli did have the power to wipe Boo, he just wouldn’t know how to use it effectively. He’s batshit insane without a grain of skill or proper ki control in his body, and would eventually run out of stamina and drop out of SS3.

Mr. Satan vs. Panpoot

Panput wins. Didn’t that guy break, like, a brick wall or something with his elbow? I don’t think Mr. Satan has any feats on par with that. He won a Budoukai, big deal. None of the super-warriors, or even King Chapa (probably because he got too old, or he thought Gokuu would be there, or both), were there. The reason he was hyped up as “the world’s greatest champion” is because everyone had apparently forgotten about Gokuu and co., and Satan might’ve had a good PR team.

SSJ Goku (android saga before 3yr training) vs Mecha Freeza, Coola, Cold, Ginyu Force.

remove Ginyu Force if too hard and add the Coola Squadron if too easy for Goku.

Gokuu manages to score a win with strategy after a tough battle.

How about SSJ Goku Namek and SSJ Trunks vs Freeza (Mecha or Namek), Cold, and Coola

Gokuu and Trunks win easily. I think that Coola’s about as strong as Mecha Freeza.

The team of Saiyan arc Vegeta, Nappa, Tarble & Raditz vs. Final form Freeza, Zarbon, Dodoria and Cui.

Everyone is at equal power levels.

Tarble’s inconsequential here, but I think the Saiyans’ raw tenacity and battle-hardened durability would overpower Freeza and his cronies. Remember that Vegeta was able to learn ki-sensing just by observing Gokuu and co. on Earth, because, as he told Dodoria, it was easy for him once he didn’t obsess on just gaining power like Freeza.

Fat Boo vs Evil Boo vs Kid Boo vs Cell vs Freeza at equal power levels and no regeneration.

Fat Boo and Pure Boo are just mentally challenged babies compared to the others here, so they’d get lobbed off from the start. Freeza doesn’t have much in the way of skill and can’t sense ki, so he’s defeated. So then it’s between Super Boo and Cell. Because Cell has, well, the DNA of Gokuu, Vegeta and Piccolo inside, he’d win.

Mr. Satan vs. (Piccolo Jr. saga) Goku (pure skill only)

Gokuu, no question about it. Tell me what ki training Satan has had.

SS Goten vs. first-form Cell (during rematch with Cell)

Do you mean "rematch with Piccolo," or are common typos canon now?

Haha, yeah, I meant "rematch with Piccolo".

Son Goku vs Muten Roshi at the 21st Tenkaichi Budokai, but this time to the death. Who comes out on top?

Son Goku vs Tenshinhan at 22nd Tenkaichi Budokai, but also to the death

Rules
-Death is allowed at tourneys
-No ring outs
-Goku gets his tail
-Tail can't be exploited, so no exploiting the tail weakness
-No full moon/Oozaru transformation

In the first match-up, Roushi wins, because of his longer legs and experience.

In the second match-up, Gokuu wins. See what Tenshinhan says here:

Chapter: 134, P11.1-2
Tenshinhan: “But you have the right to take [the prize money]. It was just luck that I won…By actual ability, unfortunately I lost…”
Kame-sennin: “Hahhahhah, luck is a part of one’s overall ability too. Anyway, Goku managed to learn a lot by meeting a master like you.”
Goku: “Hehehe, that’s right.”

It would be stupid for Ten to use the Kikohou, as Gokuu could just dodge it and Tenshinhan would use up his stamina. And Gokuu proved that he was more than a match for all of Tenshinhan’s techniques, even rivalling Tenshinhan’s Shiyouken with his improvised Hasshu-ken.

[DBZAOTA482]

Chichi (violent temperment) vs Vegeta (violent... nature)

Chi-Chi wins. Duh. “Hell hath no fury like a women scorned.”

Yeah, I would have sworn there was a scene in the show where Chi-Chi did intimidate Vegeta and he did as she said.

[Eight-Star Dragon]

Future Trunks (Super Saiyan Grade III) vs. Vegeta (Super Saiyan Grade II)

I think that, since Gokuu believed that he couldn't defeat second-form Cell with SS Grade II (and the last he'd seen of Cell was his second form; he couldn't sense Perfect Cell, Vegeta or anyone else outside of the RoSaT), Trunks' speed reduction would put him at too much of a disadvantage against the faster and more skilled Vegeta.

What if we flipped this? What if Vegeta was Grade III but Trunks was Grade II? Vegeta would be far more powerful than Trunks, but he'd be slower. Would Vegeta's skill let him win?