Discussion, generally of an in-universe nature, regarding any aspect of the franchise (including movies, spin-offs, etc.) such as: techniques, character relationships, internal back-history, its universe, and more.
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Saiga
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by Saiga » Sat Aug 18, 2012 7:45 am
Piccolo Daimao wrote:
I think I mentioned this, but I'll try to phrase it better. Everyone's reactions at Kami's Palace seem to at least imply that base Gotenks surpassed their expectations and/or were stronger than Goten and Trunks individually, and I count Super Saiyan as part of their whole package. #18, Piccolo...they're all taken aback. And, to me, the Fusions always seemed as if they were on another level, even in base, and even if they were still below Super Saiyan 2 tier. Anyway, since battle powers fell off the map post-Freeza, it's mostly free game as to wherever I want to put them.
But let's just end this here and agree to disagree, otherwise we'll be going round in circles.
Ok yeah, now I see what you're getting at. I used to interpret it the same way, but that was when I had the 5x SS multiplier instead of 50.
Anyway, moving on, I agree that Tao Pai Pai would make for a better Android but I'm not
entirely sure. I always thought that for human based Androids like 17 and 18 the strength of the human used would have mattered, but I'm actually not sure on this. It's possible that Tao Pai Pai's strength wouldn't make any difference in the end result. But, he'd have more fighting skill and possibly even know the Kikoho. I think if he wound up at 17's strength or any higher he'd be able to defeat Piccolo.
I'm re-watching Dragon Ball GT in full on
my blog. Check it out if you're interested in my thoughts on the series as I watch through it!
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CaptainKatsura
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by CaptainKatsura » Sat Aug 18, 2012 12:15 pm
In the worst scenario, Tao Pai Pai with 17 and 18's generation's upgrades would be stronger only by how much he had ki before upgrade. Of course, he could train his natural ki after modification, but would it matter?
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Fox666
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by Fox666 » Sat Aug 18, 2012 9:05 pm
I think you guys are overestimagin Tao Pai Pai skills, and underestimating No.17 and 18. At this point in the history the techniques of Goku and the others are incomparable to what it was before, and the fact that the Androids can fight against them says something.
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DBZGTKOSDH
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by DBZGTKOSDH » Sun Aug 19, 2012 11:00 am
Tenshinhan vs Son Gohan
Both of them are from Artificial Humans arc. Who wins?
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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Fox666
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by Fox666 » Sun Aug 19, 2012 11:48 am
Son Gohan who has been training with Goku and Piccolo. Especially since you can't predict how strong he can get with his anger.
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Kaboom
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by Kaboom » Sun Aug 19, 2012 1:54 pm
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Tenshinhan vs Son Gohan
Both of them are from Artificial Humans arc. Who wins?
Gohan. I figure he's on the same tier as the adult Saiyans, but only useless compared to them and Piccolo because he lacks Super Saiyan. Granted he's a lot younger and less skilled than Tenshinhan, but overwhelming odds are he's so much stronger that it wouldn't matter. A Kikoho is the only thing that would put him in any serious danger.
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SSJ3_Gogeta
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by SSJ3_Gogeta » Sun Aug 19, 2012 7:13 pm
Tenshinhan (Saiyan arc, no Kikouhou) vs. 99 Saibaimen & Raditz
I think that Tien's power is not so much higher than his adversaries that he would not get worn out, but I'm not sure.
Saiyan arc Vegeta & Kyui vs. Dodoria
Unless Vegeta goes Oozaru, he loses.
Vegeta (arrival on Namek), Gohan & Kuririn (both when against Ginyuu) vs. transformed Zarbon
I think Zarbon wins this one.
Gokuu (when against Ginyuu) vs. first-form Freeza
This one depends on how well Goku can handle the 10x Kaioken.
SS Gokuu (Cell arc, heart virus) vs. Mecha Freeza
If Freeza is suppressed, Goku may be stronger; however, Goku may be in too much pain to fight back.
Android #18 (present) vs. Android #18 (future)
Present Android 18 wins.
Merged Piccolo (pre-RoSaT) vs. future Cell
This one is a toss-up.
Piccolo (Cell Games) vs. Complete Cell (when against Vegeta, no regeneration)
I think Piccolo wins this one.
SS2 kid Gohan vs. Dabra
Gohan sends Dabura to Heaven (since he enjoys being in Hell
)
Base Gotenks vs. second-form Cell
Gotenks can win if he doesn't fool around for 30 minutes.
Pan (28th TB) vs. Cell arc Gohan, pre-RoSaT
Gohan wins.
Fat Boo vs. Pure Boo (equal powers)
Fat Buu wins due to being more intelligible.
SS Vegeta (Boo arc) vs. SS Broli (Movie #10)
Vegeta is a little stronger than LSSJ broly IMO (I know some will disagree), so he crushes this Broly.
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Saiga
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by Saiga » Sun Aug 19, 2012 8:06 pm
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Tenshinhan vs Son Gohan
Both of them are from Artificial Humans arc. Who wins?
Gohan takes this with ludicrous ease. I'd even say it's a one-shot.
I'm re-watching Dragon Ball GT in full on
my blog. Check it out if you're interested in my thoughts on the series as I watch through it!
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CaptainKatsura
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by CaptainKatsura » Mon Aug 20, 2012 4:49 am
Fat Boo vs Pure Boo (equal powers)
Hard to say, Fat Boo while being the brightest crayon in the box is more intelligent than Pure Boo, but Pure Boo is completely unfettered and very unpredictable. I say, Pure Boo wins because he is more ruthless and smaller target.
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DBZAOTA482
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by DBZAOTA482 » Mon Aug 20, 2012 11:05 am
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Tenshinhan vs Son Gohan
Both of them are from Artificial Humans arc. Who wins?
Ten and Gohan aren't too far off in battle power at that point so I think Ten would last for a while unless Gohan gets angry.
fadeddreams5 wrote:DBZGTKOSDH wrote:... Haven't we already gotten these in GT? Goku dies, the DBs go away, and the Namekian DBs most likely won't be used again because of the Evil Dragons.
Goku didn't die in GT. The show sucked him off so much, it was impossible to keep him in the world of the living, so he ascended beyond mortality.
jjgp1112 wrote: Sat Jul 18, 2020 6:31 am
I'm just about done with the concept of reboots and making shows that were products of their time and impactful "new and sexy" and in line with modern tastes and sensibilities. Let stuff stay in their era and give today's kids their own shit to watch.
I always side eye the people who say "Now my kids/today's kids can experience what I did as a child!" Nigga, who gives a fuck about
your childhood? You're an adult now and it was at least 15 years ago. Let the kids have their own experience instead of picking at a corpse.
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FNF
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by FNF » Mon Aug 20, 2012 12:28 pm
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Tenshinhan vs Son Gohan
Both of them are from Artificial Humans arc. Who wins?
Without getting angry, Gohan isn't going to win this.
Imo Enraged Gohan>>Tenshinhan>Gohan.
Voltaire: "I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: 'O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous.' And God granted it."
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'Cocoman'
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dprez
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by dprez » Mon Aug 20, 2012 12:30 pm
An enraged Gohan could already fight someone with a battle power well over a million before he trains for the artificial humans. He should be able to easily handle someone like Captain Ginyu before his training.
Tenshinhan may have improved a good deal, but Gohan was training with Piccolo and Ssj Goku. I think Gohan is just too powerful, enraged or not.
Saiga wrote:DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Tenshinhan vs Son Gohan
Both of them are from Artificial Humans arc. Who wins?
Gohan takes this with ludicrous ease. I'd even say it's a one-shot.
This is what I was thinking. I guess some people don't think Gohan got all that strong, or are overestimating Tenshinhan...
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shonenhikada
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by shonenhikada » Mon Aug 20, 2012 12:37 pm
dprez wrote:An enraged Gohan could already fight someone with a battle power well over a million before he trains for the artificial humans. He should be able to easily handle someone like Captain Ginyu before his training.
Tenshinhan may have improved a good deal, but Gohan was training with Piccolo and Ssj Goku. I think Gohan is just too powerful, enraged or not.
Saiga wrote:DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Tenshinhan vs Son Gohan
Both of them are from Artificial Humans arc. Who wins?
Gohan takes this with ludicrous ease. I'd even say it's a one-shot.
This is what I was thinking. I guess some people don't think Gohan got all that strong, or are overestimating Tenshinhan...
If Gohan is so powerful why did he get knocked down to taxi service role, during android arc while Tien got to stay and help fight the androids ? Surely Tien would be able to carry Bulma better than Gohan.
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FNF
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by FNF » Mon Aug 20, 2012 12:42 pm
dprez wrote:
This is what I was thinking. I guess some people don't think Gohan got all that strong, or are overestimating Tenshinhan...
Oh, and I guess Gohan
definitely proven his prowess in battle or even
mild usefulness over Tenshinhan.
All sarcasm aside, I don't see how people can just come to that conclusion based off of Gohan being stronger than Ten almost
5 YEARS before the Android arc.
Voltaire: "I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: 'O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous.' And God granted it."
Other username on forums;
'Cocoman'
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DBZGTKOSDH
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by DBZGTKOSDH » Mon Aug 20, 2012 12:49 pm
FNF wrote:All sarcasm aside, I don't see how people can just come to that conclusion based off of Gohan being stronger than Ten almost 5 YEARS before the Android arc.
Well, Gohan was over a hundred times stronger than Tenshinhan during Freeza arc, and Gohan trained hard those 3 years with Super Saiyan Goku & Piccolo, while Tenshinhan was training for 5 years with... Chaozu. Plus, Gohan is a Saiyan. So I think that Gohan wins this.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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dprez
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by dprez » Mon Aug 20, 2012 12:54 pm
Gohan is a beast by this point. I don't see how Tenshinhan can catch up when all he has is Chiaotzu to train with. Gohan already had a head start in power from his unlock potential boost and his Zenkais vs Freeza, add in three years of superior training and Gohan is most likely much stronger than Tenshinhan by the artificial human arc.
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shonenhikada
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by shonenhikada » Mon Aug 20, 2012 12:59 pm
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:FNF wrote:All sarcasm aside, I don't see how people can just come to that conclusion based off of Gohan being stronger than Ten almost 5 YEARS before the Android arc.
Well, Gohan was over a hundred times stronger than Tenshinhan during Freeza arc, and Gohan trained hard those 3 years with Super Saiyan Goku & Piccolo, while Tenshinhan was training for 5 years with... Chaozu. Plus, Gohan is a Saiyan. So I think that Gohan wins this.
Where did you get 100x stronger from ?
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dprez
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by dprez » Mon Aug 20, 2012 1:01 pm
Tenshinhan's power in the Saiyan arc, around 2,500 or so?
Gohan launched a ki blast that pushed back third form Freeza, who's around 2,500,000(?).
This is actually 1000x.
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shonenhikada
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by shonenhikada » Mon Aug 20, 2012 1:06 pm
dprez wrote:Tenshinhan's power in the Saiyan arc, around 2,500 or so?
Gohan launched a ki blast that pushed back third form Freeza, who's around 2,500,000(?).
This is actually 1000x.
he said
Gohan was over a hundred times stronger than Tenshinhan during Freeza arc,
I want to know how he got this number from ? and Why are we comparing saiyan saga Tien to Freeza saga Gohan, that like me comparing Saiyan saga goku to end of freeza saga vegeta and claiming vegeta is 500 x stronger so vegeta is 200 x stronger than goku in Android arc.
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Isn't vegeta listed at that same PL, which would contradict him thinking he could beat freeza, seeing that he would have to have been stronger than third form freeza to stand a chance, and factor in a proportional power boost from Freeza going from second to third form.
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dprez
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by dprez » Mon Aug 20, 2012 1:11 pm
shonenhikada wrote:Isn't vegeta listed at that same PL, which would contradict him thinking he could beat freeza, seeing that he would have to have been stronger than third form freeza to stand a chance, and factor in a proportional power boost from Freeza going from second to third form.
Irrelevant. My power levels aren't official anyway, just a rough estimation. We know his second form is over 1,000,000, so his third form must be over 2,000,000, and Gohan launched a ki attack that pushed this Freeza back.
Anyway, Gohan really is almost 1000x stronger than Tenshinhan during the Freeza arc.
Point is, Tenshinhan should not be able to bridge that gap from simply training with Chiaotzu. Gohan had a super saiyan and Piccolo to spar with, plus he's saiyan.
