How come they didn't bring Gohan to fight Kid Buu?

[FindKenshi]

Guess you'll just have to wait and see then?

[Draken]

Perhaps Vegeta figured Gohan would somehow fuck it up. Buu can still absorb things when he feels pressured. Another Buuhan wouldn't exactly be a good thing. A Super Genki Drama wouldn't kill him.

How are you sure a Genki Dama wouldn't kill him? You're assuming that Earth < Gohan + Kid Buu? Not enough details to really support that theory.

The Genki Drama barely did the job with Pure Buu and Gohan is by far stronger than Pure Buu.

The Genki Dama was more than enough to finish off Pure Buu IMO, it's just that they couldn't actually get the stupid thing to blow up on Kid Buu.

[TheMightyOzaru]

The Genki Dama was more than enough to finish off Pure Buu IMO, it's just that they couldn't actually get the stupid thing to blow up on Kid Buu.

Here is a question for you. How could Kid Buu hold it back if he was weaker? SSJ Goku likely put his energy behind the thing allowing it to overpower Kid Buu.

[Bussani]

Here is a question for you. How could Kid Buu hold it back if he was weaker? SSJ Goku likely put his energy behind the thing allowing it to overpower Kid Buu.

Doesn't (or couldn't, at least) Vegeta's comment imply that it wasn't the Genki Dama that lacked power, but Goku who lacked the stamina to launch it properly?

Chapter: 516 (DBZ 322), P8.2
Context: as Boo stops the Genki-Dama
Vegeta: “I didn’t pla-plan on this…! Kakarot doesn’t have the sta-stamina to fire that all-important Genki-Dama…!”

[Hitiro]

Here is a question for you. How could Kid Buu hold it back if he was weaker? SSJ Goku likely put his energy behind the thing allowing it to overpower Kid Buu.

As I explained on the previous page it wasn't due to a lack of strength on the Genki Dama's part but on Goku's. If it really was a technique that barely defeated him then he would have probably regenerated from it. Vegeta's sacrifice was such a technique in a way and look what happened to Fat Boo. Its the same thing with why people keep throwing around their battle powers being in the trillions or higher. If that were the case then a Genki Dama with the energy gathered from the Earth's population which only have an average battle power of 5 and Genki only makes up a certain percent of that battle power would mean the characters battle powers were only in the tens of billions in their transformed states. It does say in the Daizenshuu that past the Freeza arc battle powers became too large to work with but billions is quite a large number to work with no matter how you look at it.

[Draken]

The Genki Dama was more than enough to finish off Pure Buu IMO, it's just that they couldn't actually get the stupid thing to blow up on Kid Buu.

Here is a question for you. How could Kid Buu hold it back if he was weaker? SSJ Goku likely put his energy behind the thing allowing it to overpower Kid Buu.

Take for example a grenade. More than powerful enough to kill people, if it actually explodes. Kid buu could prevent it from exploding, by preventing the pin from being pulled. Goku was too weak to pull the pin. Once he got his full power back, he could pull the pin, and it killed Kid buu.

[alakazam^]

I think Gohan at that time is the strongest, followed by Gotenks and then Goku. I also believe Pure Boo to be weaker than Evil Boo. Please use these assumptions when reading my opinion.

Here is my view on why they didn't take Gohan there, and it can use in and out of universe explanations:

The fight with Boo had taken enough time already. Forms after forms, Boo went right back to how he was when created. Boo blew up the Earth and Goku and Vegeta were teleported to Kaioushin Realm. Boo teleported there as well.

Having this in mind, it's easy to think that Kaioushin Realm HAD to be the last fighting location: Toriyama was tired, the readers were most likely tired, Vegeta and Goku were fed up with Boo so they HAD to take care of him once and for all. There were no time nor willingness to, again, flee to another location and think of different strategies. Most everything had already been tried and failed. So, there was nothing left but fight him then and there.

Toriyama stated he felt Gohan wasn't meant to be the hero, it had to be Goku. Goku didn't power up at all during the Boo arc so, "obviously", the enemy had to be brought down to Goku's level (maybe a bit weaker, maybe equal, maybe a bit stronger), so that's done with. Vegeta said Goku was the only one to be able to beat Boo and that was before he thought about using the Dragon Balls so, interpreting that line either way, this is also done with.

Now, Vegeta's plan starts developing. Earth is restored, everyone is revived. Looking at the manga, I didn't find any panel in which Kibitokaioushin said he was tired so I'm going to dismiss he didn't act as plot convenience. Goku says that Vegeta's plan was to have Gohan, Gotenks and the others revived and have them fight. Vegeta says that's not it. <- The way this is worded doesn't really specify that he needed both to go there and fight, either was fine.

Goku and Vegeta were focused on the battle at hand. They weren't turning their backs anymore. They were there. They were fighting. They wanted to have control and be a part of the solution. Bring Gohan to dispose of Buu? Too disrupting of the fight's flow and there's no need. They fully know Boo's current strength and Vegeta is certain his plan will defeat him. Start that Genki-dama, Kakarrot! We'll have the Earthlings give a hand and fend for themselves for once. What a great way to end the manga's last battle.


So, as you can see, it's possible for Gohan to be the strongest, Pure Boo being weaker than Evil Boo, Goku being the hero and all of them coexisting peacefully.

Amuro Ray, I don't know if you'll be back to discuss these things but I wanted to say something to you. I think using those scans are against the rules but even if they aren't, you don't need to clutter your posts up with them. Just take whichever quotes you want and write them in text. Also, I got the impression that you don't think Herms' translations are reliable. Most of us know they are and if you don't want to spend some time checking whether they are or not, and I assume you can't read Japanese, I don't think you should have these kind of discussions. You can't guarantee those scanlations are realiable as well and you can't use the source text, so...

[Pan-Pan]

Goku says that Vegeta's plan was to have Gohan, Gotenks and the others revived and have them fight. Vegeta says that's not it. <- The way this is worded doesn't really specify that he needed both to go there and fight, either was fine.

Goku : “Oh, I know! You’ll bring Gohan and Gotenks back to life so they can fight.”

and =/= or
they =/= one
to fight =/= to defeat
The way it's worded highly implies both are required to manage something against Boo.
Vegeta's plan is not about swapping an easy victory for a risky solution. Gohan couldn't beat Pure Boo, otherwise Goku would have found Vegeta's idea much more silly and wouldn't have agreed. And don't tell me the idea of bringing Gohan to the fight was risky as well cause he could have been absorbed once again. I would answer they don't even think of that possibility, as shown in Goku's quote below :
(At the end of the fight against Majin Boo, when the others raise the possibility that Pure Boo reborn from Innocent Boo.)

Goku : “And if worse comes to worse, we can just fight again. Let’s train so that this time for sure we won’t lose even if we go one-on-one.”

In Goku's opinion, fighting is a good solution. That's why he fought against Pure Boo after all. He didn't think he could be absorbed.
Moreover, as you can see in the second sentence, Goku says that without training, nobody would be able to win against Pure Boo one-on-one. This means Pure Boo was stronger than Evil Boo, otherwise Gohan alone could have defeated him easily for sure.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Goku doesn't necessarily mean that Gohan & Gotenks will fight together. They would just come & fight.

[Amuro Ray]

Goku says that Vegeta's plan was to have Gohan, Gotenks and the others revived and have them fight. Vegeta says that's not it. <- The way this is worded doesn't really specify that he needed both to go there and fight, either was fine.

Goku : “Oh, I know! You’ll bring Gohan and Gotenks back to life so they can fight.”

and =/= or
they =/= one
to fight =/= to defeat
The way it's worded highly implies both are required to manage something against Boo.
Vegeta's plan is not about swapping an easy victory for a risky solution. Gohan couldn't beat Pure Boo, otherwise Goku would have found Vegeta's idea much more silly and wouldn't have agreed. And don't tell me the idea of bringing Gohan to the fight was risky as well cause he could have been absorbed once again. I would answer they don't even think of that possibility, as shown in Goku's quote below :
(At the end of the fight against Majin Boo, when the others raise the possibility that Pure Boo reborn from Innocent Boo.)

Goku : “And if worse comes to worse, we can just fight again. Let’s train so that this time for sure we won’t lose even if we go one-on-one.”

In Goku's opinion, fighting is a good solution. That's why he fought against Pure Boo after all. He didn't think he could be absorbed.
Moreover, as you can see in the second sentence, Goku says that without training, nobody would be able to win against Pure Boo one-on-one. This means Pure Boo was stronger than Evil Boo, otherwise Gohan alone could have defeated him easily for sure.

And game over, this person gets it.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

So, Goku's generic statement about bringing Gohan & Gotenks beats all the statements that imply Pure Boo < SS3 Goku < Evil Boo = SS3 Gotenks < U. Gohan?

I won't even bother to argue about this with you anymore.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Yeah AmuroRay you seriously need to think before posting.... Vegeta only denied Goku's statement because he feels Earth should save itself. The mere fact that Goku suggest Gohan and Gotenks implies both are superior. Doesn't Goku also say that Gotenks is on a whole other level than him when explaining Ssj3 to Kaioshin after Gotenks goes Ssj3?

[TheMightyOzaru]

Here is a question for you. How could Kid Buu hold it back if he was weaker? SSJ Goku likely put his energy behind the thing allowing it to overpower Kid Buu.

As I explained on the previous page it wasn't due to a lack of strength on the Genki Dama's part but on Goku's. If it really was a technique that barely defeated him then he would have probably regenerated from it. Vegeta's sacrifice was such a technique in a way and look what happened to Fat Boo. Its the same thing with why people keep throwing around their battle powers being in the trillions or higher. If that were the case then a Genki Dama with the energy gathered from the Earth's population which only have an average battle power of 5 and Genki only makes up a certain percent of that battle power would mean the characters battle powers were only in the tens of billions in their transformed states. It does say in the Daizenshuu that past the Freeza arc battle powers became too large to work with but billions is quite a large number to work with no matter how you look at it.

What of Freeza? He couldn't stop the thing and Goku's stamina was completely used up. Hell Freeza even lived. The idea that Goku needs to put force behind it to kill his opponent is completely contradicted by Freeza. Again Goku likely put his energy into the bomb. Oh please don't bring up the Battle power argument. The Genki Drama was fueled by Gohan's Genki so it's as strong as it needs to be.

[Amuro Ray]

So, Goku's generic statement about bringing Gohan & Gotenks beats all the statements that imply Pure Boo < SS3 Goku < Evil Boo = SS3 Gotenks < U. Gohan?

I won't even bother to argue about this with you anymore.

So one Statement by Goku ignores all the other implications and comments (meaning, more than one) made multiple times after the fact (read: in the context of the situation)

Please don't bother, it's already be settled a while ago.

[Amuro Ray]

Yeah AmuroRay you seriously need to think before posting.... Vegeta only denied Goku's statement because he feels Earth should save itself. The mere fact that Goku suggest Gohan and Gotenks implies both are superior. Doesn't Goku also say that Gotenks is on a whole other level than him when explaining Ssj3 to Kaioshin after Gotenks goes Ssj3?

Yes, Vegeta and Goku would let the whole universe be destroyed rather than have someone who is obviously superior like Gohan (note the sarcasm) would could easily beat Buu. And no, but Goku did say that it was impressive that they were able to obtain that state at their age.

[VegettoEX]

I'm fairly certain that not only myself, but another moderator, have had to step in and tell you, Amuro Ray, to cool your jets. The attitude is not welcome, warranted, or appreciated.

The same thing goes for everyone else. Particularly for you members who have been around a while, I shouldn't have to step in and play babysitter over these types of conversations. You know better. Either speak politely with your fellow fans and respect what they want to bring to the table, or please find another place to call home.

[Kaboom]

(note the sarcasm)

I have. Knock it off.

[Amuro Ray]

So personal attacks and condesending remarks are ok with comments like
"Yeah AmuroRay you seriously need to think before posting"
And
"I won't even bother to argue about this with you anymore."

but making a logical argument is not? If you don't feel my sarcasm was acceptable in the context of the statement, so be it, but I don't think it was as rude as the other two.

[VegettoEX]

You will note that I specifically addressed other folks, as well.

Additionally, two wrongs don't make a right. If you don't like the way someone is speaking to you, take the higher road, and also report the post.

Enough free warnings have been given. From here on out, strikes will be placed against the accounts of those participating in this discussion that choose to ignore the rules that they agreed to (twice!) prior to registration.

[TheMightyOzaru]

So personal attacks and condesending remarks are ok with comments like
"Yeah AmuroRay you seriously need to think before posting"
And
"I won't even bother to argue about this with you anymore."

but making a logical argument is not? If you don't feel my sarcasm was acceptable in the context of the statement, so be it, but I don't think it was as rude as the other two.

How else am I supposed to phrase "please think before you speak"? I'm simply trying to help you come to a proper conclusion. It's become generally accepted that Pure Buu is weaker than Evil Buu and for good reason. Now in order to further help you, I will spend my time looking for all the evidence to support my claims.