Discussion specifically regarding the "refreshed" TV version of DBZ created in Japan for its 20th anniversary, including individual threads for each episode.
penguintruth wrote:Sometime between Sean Schemmel and Chris Sabat patting themselves on the back in those videos for doing their job correctly now and the end of the first week of episodes on Nicktoons.
Will somebody tell this weabo penguintruth asshole to shut the hell up damn
Even on youtube and anime news network.com the only thing this asshole does is bash any dub of dbz including kai and he has the audacity to say that if you like the dub then your not a real fan of dbz gtfo with that bs man
This is not how you express opinions on Kanzenshuu. If you disagree with something, you explain WHY you disagree, and you do so with a properly-written post.
:: [| Mike "VegettoEX" LaBrie |] ::
:: [| Kanzenshuu - Co-Founder/Administrator, Podcast Host, News Manager (note: our "job" titles are arbitrary and meaningless) |] ::
:: [| Website: January 1998 |] :: [| Podcast: November 2005 |] :: [| Fusion: April 2012 |] :: [| Wiki: April 2026 |] ::
VegettoEX wrote:This is not how you express opinions on Kanzenshuu. If you disagree with something, you explain WHY you disagree, and you do so with a properly-written post.
Sorry about my rant but this dude just pisses me off
Your personal opinions on people shouldn't enter into how you present yourself and converse with the rest of the community. If you have a beef with someone, take it up with THEM, and take it up with them somewhere else. We don't need to hear about it, and we don't want to read about it.
:: [| Mike "VegettoEX" LaBrie |] ::
:: [| Kanzenshuu - Co-Founder/Administrator, Podcast Host, News Manager (note: our "job" titles are arbitrary and meaningless) |] ::
:: [| Website: January 1998 |] :: [| Podcast: November 2005 |] :: [| Fusion: April 2012 |] :: [| Wiki: April 2026 |] ::
VegettoEX wrote:Your personal opinions on people shouldn't enter into how you present yourself and converse with the rest of the community. If you have a beef with someone, take it up with THEM, and take it up with them somewhere else. We don't need to hear about it, and we don't want to read about it.
Someone mentioned the dialogue in Burst Limit, and despite it not being perfect, there were moments where I was like, hmmm Funimation is actually trying here. They haven't really been good with VAing the video games after that one. Hearing "KAI - O-ken" and not Kayoken, and "Son Goku" cerntainly helped. Then watching the first couple of episodes of Kai uncut, blew me away how much better they were doing.
I am a freelance animator, check out my thangs. ART!
Check my webcomic series Off Guard now on webtoons!
I think the exact moment I knew they were doing things right this time was right after Yamucha died. Sonny Strait's Kuririn was excellent as he reacted to his friend's death and Vegeta's comment, "Wait until they get this trash off the field." The scene was well-written and well acted.
Kentai wrote:Son Gokuu is a fascinating character anyway, because he is - at face value, anyway - an idiot savant. The victim of violent head trauma as an infant [...] he's a simple bumpkin with a fair share of brain damage who's natural talents to work out what's wrong compensate for his broad lack of common sense. But he's also a fighter, through and through [...] he fight until he has, in no uncertain terms, beaten his enemy on terms they can both acknowledge. He doesn't want to kill anyone, or even prove that he can win... he just wants to know he can. He's an ineffably charming bastard who's manly leanings were really incendental, and yes, the fact that he was voiced by a squeaky woman made the combination perhaps all the more charming.
I've always felt like they were making baby-steps and small improvements over time. For one, the video games kept getting more consistant and accurate translations as well as vocal performances. And the latter parts of the Namek arc's UUE re-dub, some of the dialogue was getting closer to the Japanese script even though they kept most of their original (Ocean dubbed) dialogue written in...
I think the big tip-off for me were the recasts for Kai being announced, and the subsequent Nicktoons airings. Even though it was edited, I could still tell by the 2nd/3rd episodes that the dialogue and acting were a huge step-up from their older work. In fact, I'd go so far as to say the Nicktoons-edited dub of Kai is more accurate in tone & spirit than even the uncut dub of Z.
Nothing matters (in a cosmic sense.) Have a good time.
Once I got in touch with the Japanese Dragon Ball and got rid of the nostalgia goggles.
Why Dragon Ball Consistency in something such as power levels matter!
Spoiler:
Doctor. wrote:I've explained before, I'll just paraphrase myself.
Power levels establish tension and drama. People who care about them (well, people who care about them in a narrative) don't care about the big numbers or the fancy explosions. If you have character A who's so much above character B, who's the main character, you're gonna be left wondering how in the hell character B, the character we're supposed to care and root for, is going to escape the situation or overcome the odds. It makes us emotionally invested.
If character B doesn't escape the situation in a believable way that's consistent with previous events, then that emotional investment is gone. It was pointless tension, pointless drama made just to suck in the viewer. It has no critical value whatsoever. The audience is left believing that the author can just create whatever scenarios he wants and what happens to the characters is decided by whatever the author wants to happen, regardless of the events that happened in the story. Which, in fairness, is what happens, but the audience wants to be fooled. The audience wants to know that the world they're following has rules. That the world they're invested in isn't going to bend to external factors that are irrelevant to them.
An author can do whatever he wants with the characters, that's not false. But the author should also have the responsibility to make sure it fits in cohesively with the other events in the narrative he has created.
theoriginalbilis wrote:And the latter parts of the Namek arc's UUE re-dub, some of the dialogue was getting closer to the Japanese script even though they kept most of their original (Ocean dubbed) dialogue written in...
True, but I noticed that, among the redubbed portions of the first two seasons, the most accurate portions were the portions that FUNimation was dubbing for the first time. In other words, scenes that were censored or cut from the Ocean dub--some of which were pretty lengthy--struck me as being very faithfully written. Yes, it would have been nice if they discarded the old script altogether, but it struck me as more of a money-saving and time-saving decision than a creative one, because for the scenes they were adapting for the first time, the scripts were very good...another promising sign of gradual improvement.
Well, I noticed Sabat's Vegeta improving in the UUE dub. His Piccolo still needed a lot of work.
I'd say Sabat is probably the most improved of the VAs. But then, he probably needed the most improvement.
Kentai wrote:Son Gokuu is a fascinating character anyway, because he is - at face value, anyway - an idiot savant. The victim of violent head trauma as an infant [...] he's a simple bumpkin with a fair share of brain damage who's natural talents to work out what's wrong compensate for his broad lack of common sense. But he's also a fighter, through and through [...] he fight until he has, in no uncertain terms, beaten his enemy on terms they can both acknowledge. He doesn't want to kill anyone, or even prove that he can win... he just wants to know he can. He's an ineffably charming bastard who's manly leanings were really incendental, and yes, the fact that he was voiced by a squeaky woman made the combination perhaps all the more charming.
I don't think Sabat's improvements were solely due to experience, but rather him making the characters his own. His Vegeta improved drastically when he deepened the voice and didn't have to sound like Drummond. His Piccolo got good by the Buu saga, and reached "great" when he dropped the gravel. His Yamcha didn't take that long to improve, all he really had to do was drop the surfer speak. Many of those things were likely decisions he was given.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretzky" - Michael Scott
Happiness is climate, not weather.
penguintruth wrote:Sometime between Sean Schemmel and Chris Sabat patting themselves on the back in those videos for doing their job correctly now and the end of the first week of episodes on Nicktoons.
Will somebody tell this weabo penguintruth asshole to shut the hell up damn
Now, you're saying that at penguintruth's face. You must as well be dead.
fadeddreams5 wrote:
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:... Haven't we already gotten these in GT? Goku dies, the DBs go away, and the Namekian DBs most likely won't be used again because of the Evil Dragons.
Goku didn't die in GT. The show sucked him off so much, it was impossible to keep him in the world of the living, so he ascended beyond mortality.
jjgp1112 wrote: Sat Jul 18, 2020 6:31 am
I'm just about done with the concept of reboots and making shows that were products of their time and impactful "new and sexy" and in line with modern tastes and sensibilities. Let stuff stay in their era and give today's kids their own shit to watch.
I always side eye the people who say "Now my kids/today's kids can experience what I did as a child!" Nigga, who gives a fuck about your childhood? You're an adult now and it was at least 15 years ago. Let the kids have their own experience instead of picking at a corpse.
ABED wrote:His Piccolo got good by the Buu saga, and reached "great" when he dropped the gravel. His Yamcha didn't take that long to improve, all he really had to do was drop the surfer speak. Many of those things were likely decisions he was given.
Uh, I wouldn't say Sabat's Piccolo got good in the Buu arc. It was still way too saturated and unnatural. Even in the re-dub seasons it needed work. It's good in Kai. No more terrible saturation, more natural personality to it. But it was a long while in coming.
His Yamucha still slips into surfer dude now and then, if not by dialogue, then by delivery.
Kentai wrote:Son Gokuu is a fascinating character anyway, because he is - at face value, anyway - an idiot savant. The victim of violent head trauma as an infant [...] he's a simple bumpkin with a fair share of brain damage who's natural talents to work out what's wrong compensate for his broad lack of common sense. But he's also a fighter, through and through [...] he fight until he has, in no uncertain terms, beaten his enemy on terms they can both acknowledge. He doesn't want to kill anyone, or even prove that he can win... he just wants to know he can. He's an ineffably charming bastard who's manly leanings were really incendental, and yes, the fact that he was voiced by a squeaky woman made the combination perhaps all the more charming.
ABED wrote:His Piccolo got good by the Buu saga, and reached "great" when he dropped the gravel. His Yamcha didn't take that long to improve, all he really had to do was drop the surfer speak. Many of those things were likely decisions he was given.
Uh, I wouldn't say Sabat's Piccolo got good in the Buu arc. It was still way too saturated and unnatural. Even in the re-dub seasons it needed work. It's good in Kai. No more terrible saturation, more natural personality to it. But it was a long while in coming.
His Yamucha still slips into surfer dude now and then, if not by dialogue, then by delivery.
I don't what you meant by "saturate" in this context. He had yet to drop the gravel, but he still sounded more natural. I said he got good during the Buu arc, but "good" is a very vague term. I wasn't implying he was what he became, but he certainly was far better than he once was and I enjoyed it. He had improved by that point and it was clear that Sabat cared about improving even more. It's one of the reasons I have a fondness for many of FUNi's actors, they care about what they are doing and the show. For many voice actors, Dragon Ball's another job, which is fine, but I do enjoy reading or hearing that actors enjoy the parts they play and are passionate about them. As to your point about Yamcha, I don't hear what you hear. Do you have a specific instance you can point to? I haven't heard surfer Yamcha in nearly a decade.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretzky" - Michael Scott
Happiness is climate, not weather.
Passion does not equal quality. You can be as passionate as you want, but if you suck, you suck. Passionately sucking is sucking.
Sabat's Piccolo still sounded overly gruff through the Buu arc and redub seasons, oversaturated with that gruffness in a way where it becomes the sole texture of the performance. It's like listening to static. His Yamucha slipped into "Dude Yamucha" every now and then in Kai. He was like that throughout Z and in the DB dub. It's better, but still needs work. It continues to sound like a fill-in role, especially compared to the brilliant work Tohru Furuya does.
Sabat needed the most improving because he had the most roles and was pretty terrible as those characters throughout most of DBZ. But he did end up improving quite a bit.
Kentai wrote:Son Gokuu is a fascinating character anyway, because he is - at face value, anyway - an idiot savant. The victim of violent head trauma as an infant [...] he's a simple bumpkin with a fair share of brain damage who's natural talents to work out what's wrong compensate for his broad lack of common sense. But he's also a fighter, through and through [...] he fight until he has, in no uncertain terms, beaten his enemy on terms they can both acknowledge. He doesn't want to kill anyone, or even prove that he can win... he just wants to know he can. He's an ineffably charming bastard who's manly leanings were really incendental, and yes, the fact that he was voiced by a squeaky woman made the combination perhaps all the more charming.
No, but passionately improving does create an emotional connection with me. It does a lot to soften the blow. I don't think Sabat sucked at that point. You did, but I don't think it was as put on as it was in the early days when he was mainly doing an impersonation of McNeil. You're right that it was still a tad overly gruff but not nearly as bad as it was.
Sabat did need a lot of improvement, but he was told to sound like other actors moreso than even guys like Schemmel. He was told to sound like Drummond and he's completely different and thus the performance suffered. Once he made them his own, he flourished. I think his Yamcha was great by the Dragon Ball dub because he wasn't written as the surfer, unless you can point to something specific, all I can say is that you are hearing something that isn't there.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretzky" - Michael Scott
Happiness is climate, not weather.
Kentai wrote:Son Gokuu is a fascinating character anyway, because he is - at face value, anyway - an idiot savant. The victim of violent head trauma as an infant [...] he's a simple bumpkin with a fair share of brain damage who's natural talents to work out what's wrong compensate for his broad lack of common sense. But he's also a fighter, through and through [...] he fight until he has, in no uncertain terms, beaten his enemy on terms they can both acknowledge. He doesn't want to kill anyone, or even prove that he can win... he just wants to know he can. He's an ineffably charming bastard who's manly leanings were really incendental, and yes, the fact that he was voiced by a squeaky woman made the combination perhaps all the more charming.
