Can higher levels of Super Saiyan be mastered?

[sintzu]

Goku doesn't look like a "Super Saiyan 2 Full Power" in Boo arc, because his eyes are "locked" into angry mode, while in Super Saiyan Full Power, that's not the case.

at the same time whene he was in fpssj there was times were he was having fun with friends and family but in the buu arc he only used the form twice :

1- to beat yakon and it was for a second

2- whene he was fighting vegeta

in both scenarios there was no reason to act happy

[Kamiccolo9]

Goku doesn't look like a "Super Saiyan 2 Full Power" in Boo arc, because his eyes are "locked" into angry mode, while in Super Saiyan Full Power, that's not the case.

at the same time whene he was in fpssj there was times were he was having fun with friends and family but in the buu arc he only used the form twice :

1- to beat yakon and it was for a second

2- whene he was fighting vegeta

in both scenarios there was no reason to act happy

He was also using it inside of Buu's body, up until he powered up to fight Pure Buu. He had the lighthearted expression when he was talking to Old Kaioshin.Edit: Nevermind. I thought we were talking about FPSSJ, not a hypothetical FPSSJ2.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Still, there is not enough evidence for me to believe this.

[sintzu]

Still, there is not enough evidence for me to believe this.

everyting about the topic is speculation cause there is no evidence that says yes or no

[Draken]

Still, there is not enough evidence for me to believe this.

everyting about the topic is speculation cause there is no evidence that says yes or no

I don't see anything that ever implies mastering a form is required in order to get a higher form.
Mastering SSJ for Grade 2? Nope.
Mastering Grade 2 for Grade 3? Nope.
Mastering SSJ2 for SSJ3? Nope.

They never talk about mastering SSJ2, they never talk about mastering SSJ3, they never say anything other than the Cell Games mastery of SSJ.

[Monkey D Goku]

I believe they both can be mastered. However for a form such as SSJ3 which is has been shown to only been obtained by abnormal methods such as training in the afterlife or fusion, I would think the user would also need a lot of time in the afterlife to master it.

Maybe a couple 100 or 1000 years for ssj3.

Or if you were living then I guess you would need to somehow increase your life span so you could master it.

[TheGmGoken]

I believe they both can be mastered. However for a form such as SSJ3 which is has been shown to only been obtained by abnormal methods such as training in the afterlife or fusion, I would think the user would also need a lot of time in the afterlife to master it.

Maybe a couple 100 or 1000 years for ssj3.

Or if you were living then I guess you would need to somehow increase your life span so you could master it.

That or spend a shitload of time in SSJ3. Maybe they could meditate

Spoiler:

. I'm sure since meditating takes up less energy than just fighting or doing every day things it should help. However it takes more concentration which could lead to more stress on body. So it's possible that he could get used to the stress.

[OWmyDragonBallz]

Nothing in the series says you have to master the form to suppress it's state. Throughout the series when someone says "Going all out", it means they are going full power. Piccolo asked Goku if he had gone all out, would he be able to beat Fat boo.
Goku before he fights pure Boo. "I better go all out".

[Undertaker]

Nothing in the series says you have to master the form to suppress it's state. Throughout the series when someone says "Going all out", it means they are going full power. Piccolo asked Goku if he had gone all out, would he be able to beat Fat boo.
Goku before he fights pure Boo. "I better go all out".

"going all out" means fighting seriously and goes for the kill which is why Goku went SSJ3 vs Pure Boo in the beginning. You can't suppress a form you never mastered. Goku could not suppress his SSJ until he existed the Rosat so that prove everything

[OWmyDragonBallz]

Nothing in the series says you have to master the form to suppress it's state. Throughout the series when someone says "Going all out", it means they are going full power. Piccolo asked Goku if he had gone all out, would he be able to beat Fat boo.
Goku before he fights pure Boo. "I better go all out".

"going all out" means fighting seriously and goes for the kill which is why Goku went SSJ3 vs Pure Boo in the beginning. You can't suppress a form you never mastered. Goku could not suppress his SSJ until he existed the Rosat so that prove everything

Exactly, and fighting like you mean business means you are at full power. Goku wasn't going all out against Fat boo and he was SSJ3, yet he says he is going all out against Pure boo and he is also SSJ3. Nowhere was it ever stated that you have to master a form to suppress it. Mastering it means you can withstand the strain.

Holding onto the form is the challenge, suppressing it should be no problem.

[miguelnuva1]

As SSJ is a transformation I always thought that the higher you go up the more energy you could hold back but it wouldn't be a huge suppression.

For SSJ3 I always though Goku was only taking in enough energy to transform and had at most 5% of his power held back.

[Undertaker]

Nothing in the series says you have to master the form to suppress it's state. Throughout the series when someone says "Going all out", it means they are going full power. Piccolo asked Goku if he had gone all out, would he be able to beat Fat boo.
Goku before he fights pure Boo. "I better go all out".

"going all out" means fighting seriously and goes for the kill which is why Goku went SSJ3 vs Pure Boo in the beginning. You can't suppress a form you never mastered. Goku could not suppress his SSJ until he existed the Rosat so that prove everything

Exactly, and fighting like you mean business means you are at full power. Goku wasn't going all out against Fat boo and he was SSJ3, yet he says he is going all out against Pure boo and he is also SSJ3. Nowhere was it ever stated that you have to master a form to suppress it. Mastering it means you can withstand the strain.

Holding onto the form is the challenge, suppressing it should be no problem.

No, it's not. You can be at full power but not using full effort or even trying hard

Chapter: 199 (DBZ 5), P14.1-5
Raditz: “But it’s just a matter of time before you die…I’ll be slowly making my attacks stronger.”
Piccolo: “To think that our levels would be so different…!
Raditz: “The other two Saiyan survivors besides me…Have battle powers higher than mine.”

Look at the bold line. This is what Goku was doing vs Fat Boo

Goku said he would go all out vs Pure Boo when he was just a SSJ so all out meaning going straight to SSJ3

IGoku was never shown able to suppress his SSJ state before mastering it. He even told Trunks he could not master the SSJ form before he went to Yardat

Goku had troubles going SSJ3 vs Fat Boo which means he can barely transform with ease so how can he suppress himself? That's wrong

[hleV]

You'd think Goku would've mastered SS2 during his years in the afterlife. Perhaps it can be mastered, just takes an immensively big amounts of time? To the point that learning SS3 is a better idea.

[Undertaker]

You'd think Goku would've mastered SS2 during his years in the afterlife. Perhaps it can be mastered, just takes an immensively big amounts of time? To the point that learning SS3 is a better idea.

Goku can't stay as a SSJ3 or a SSJ2 lik he did in he 10 days as a SSJ. The strain over Goku's body as a SSJ3 causes him troubles and he can't even control the form which is because he never mastered it. That much is a fact so he can't suppress himself

[hleV]

I wasn't talking about mastering SS3.

[OWmyDragonBallz]

Raditz doesn't even know how to suppress his ki so I am disappointed that you would use him as proof. Goku said he was going to go all out against Pure boo yes, but afterwards he says that he showed off too much and thought he could do better that way. Vegeta even said that Goku needs to gather his ki up for a minute to full power which means Goku was suppressed against Pure boo in SSJ3. Goku was dead against Fat boo, which means it was easier to hold onto the transformation. The problem was that he only had 24 hours of energy usage. Goku held back against Fat boo, if he had gone Full power, his time would likely be done for on Earth. He intended to finish teaching the fusion basics to the boys.

[Undertaker]

Raditz doesn't even know how to suppress his ki so I am disappointed that you would use him as proof. Goku said he was going to go all out against Pure boo yes, but afterwards he says that he showed off too much and thought he could do better that way. Vegeta even said that Goku needs to gather his ki up for a minute to full power which means Goku was suppressed against Pure boo in SSJ3. Goku was dead against Fat boo, which means it was easier to hold onto the transformation. The problem was that he only had 24 hours of energy usage. Goku held back against Fat boo, if he had gone Full power, his time would likely be done for on Earth. He intended to finish teaching the fusion basics to the boys.

It doesn't matter what Raditz knows. I say that Goku did what Raditz did because he probably can't suppress his power as a SSJ3 like Raditz so he just lowers his effort vs Fat Boo

You first said going all out means full power and now you say Goku was suppressed vs Pure Boo? Goku was fighting his hardest vs Pure Boo and lost due to the strain over his body. The strain weakens his body. Goku was weakened after his fight vs Pure Boo. Vegeta tells him to power up to full power AGAIN so he probably can use an amplified attack. That's what Goku wantd to do

You proved my point? His time on Earth was so limited due to his transformation because he could not control his SSJ3 power at all

You also forget the fact that Fat Boo was weaker than the Goku he fough and ot doesn't make sense for Goku to be suppressed because SSJ3 Goku is not leagues ahead of Fat Boo

[OWmyDragonBallz]

Raditz doesn't even know how to suppress his ki so I am disappointed that you would use him as proof. Goku said he was going to go all out against Pure boo yes, but afterwards he says that he showed off too much and thought he could do better that way. Vegeta even said that Goku needs to gather his ki up for a minute to full power which means Goku was suppressed against Pure boo in SSJ3. Goku was dead against Fat boo, which means it was easier to hold onto the transformation. The problem was that he only had 24 hours of energy usage. Goku held back against Fat boo, if he had gone Full power, his time would likely be done for on Earth. He intended to finish teaching the fusion basics to the boys.

It doesn't matter what Raditz knows. I say that Goku did what Raditz did because he probably can't suppress his power as a SSJ3 like Raditz so he just lowers his effort vs Fat Boo

You first said going all out means full power and now you say Goku was suppressed vs Pure Boo? Goku was fighting his hardest vs Pure Boo and lost due to the strain over his body. The strain weakens his body. Goku was weakened after his fight vs Pure Boo. Vegeta tells him to power up to full power AGAIN so he probably can use an amplified attack. That's what Goku wantd to do

You proved my point? His time on Earth was so limited due to his transformation because he could not control his SSJ3 power at all

You also forget the fact that Fat Boo was weaker than the Goku he fough and ot doesn't make sense for Goku to be suppressed because SSJ3 Goku is not leagues ahead of Fat Boo

Again, using Raditz as proof is no excuse. Yes, going all out means you are at full power, but you completely misunderstood what I told you on that part. Goku stated that he hasn't gotten the chance to power up because he showed off too much. He became overconfident in other words and that resulted into him overestimated his own body. Vegeta never said to power up again, he just said to power up :

Chapter: 510 (DBZ 316), P13.1-6
Vegeta: “Don’t hesitate for my sake, and finish him off! With that Super Saiyan 3, you should be able to completely wipe out Boo with your ki once you gather it with all your might…!”
Goku: “Ye…yeah…I’ve been thinking of doing that as well since awhile back, but…I haven’t gotten the chance.”
Vegeta: “Eh?”
Goku: “If I want to wipe him out, I gotta gather ki for about one minute.”
Vegeta: “One minute?!”
Goku: “Dammnit~~~If it was with the Potara, I could have done it in one blast. …..Cheh~~~I guess I went and showed off too much. But I thought things would go a little better than this…!”
Vegeta: “…S …So you weren’t thinking of me…”

So in other words, Goku did claim he was going to go all out, but then admits that he showed off and thought he could do better that way, and that lead to Goku's stamina to start dropping due to that mistake he made. Piccolo questioning Goku if he could have won or not is proof enough that Goku was holding back because at the time, the fight could have gone both ways due to Goku stalling and playing around with Boo. Goku's energy time on earth further supports me. He had to hold back because he intended SSJ Gotenks to defeat him and it also would have possibly drained up the remaining time he had left.

[Mjb1985]

I like this topic. But no, Super Saiyan 2 and 3 are not suppressable and can not be controlled. They are violent forms and have electricity brewing all around them. Suppressing that would be completely illogical to me.

[MDSTSSJ]

So in other words, Goku did claim he was going to go all out, but then admits that he showed off and thought he could do better that way, and that lead to Goku's stamina to start dropping due to that mistake he made. Piccolo questioning Goku if he could have won or not is proof enough that Goku was holding back because at the time, the fight could have gone both ways due to Goku stalling and playing around with Boo. Goku's energy time on earth further supports me. He had to hold back because he intended SSJ Gotenks to defeat him and it also would have possibly drained up the remaining time he had left.

This is one good and true explanation and I totally agree.

SSJ3 Kakarotto ( dead or alive ) is stronger than many people here think!!!

Boo Arc Goku hide his true powers several times from the very beginning.