Is there a reason why the Ocean Dub didn't dub all 13 films?

[Gonstead]

Didn't many fans see the movies after 3 way before Funimation got them? I mean, the fansub tapes were circulating for years because Funimation dragged their feet with the movies.

There are a whole bunch of movies I haven't even heard dubbed, because why bother? I saw them a long time before Funimation licensed them, and by the time they did, I knew better than to watch DBZ dubbed.

Some folks are patient, and had dinky allowances and no high school job back then.

Fansub VHS tapes were pretty cheap and I didn't have a job, either. These fansubbers weren't' doing it for the money. They were doing it for their over inflated self-importance. I mean, passion for the show!

Or you happened to live somewhere where that never was an option.

[linkdude20002001]

It's less strange when you realize much of what he posted is misinterpreted and/or wrong.

What did I say that was false?

[MarcFBR]

It's less strange when you realize much of what he posted is misinterpreted and/or wrong.

What did I say that was false?

The main issue I have is you listing names and companies and what you seem to believe is their level of involvement. You list off Pioneer, then you list off some names and name them as producers for 'Geneon', which didn't exist at the time (Geneon was the name Dentsu named the entertainment divisions they bought from Pioneer.)

The films were as much Funimation as anything else.

[linkdude20002001]

No, I was quoting the ending credits of the movie.

Pioneer Entertainment is now Geneon USA since the Dentsu acquisition, so I was referring to the current name of the company. He was STILL in the company after the acquisition, though since 2010 has been president of Aniplex of America.
Since Pioneer (Entertaiment) is now called Geneon (USA), why wouldn't I be allowed to refer to refer to the company by its current name? Likewise, I would choose to refer to The Ocean Group as Ocean Productions. The name has changed, but I'm not going to refer to it as a different company if it holds the same staff. But then again, staff can change while the name can remain the same, so really that shouldn't even matter either. Or is it not okay to just say "Funimation" anymore? Should we all refer to it as "Funimation Productions" and "Funimation Entertainment" from now on, and say things like "Funimation Entertainment had no involvement in the production in the English dub of DBZ because they didn't exist at the time."?

[Valentine]

I always wanted to hear what would happen if Pioneer did dub all the films with the Ocean cast and proper BGM music.

Like Broly could have been a great villain dub wise if Pioneer and the Ocean cast had handled him (personally I find his funimation voice is very generic "I'm a loud evil psycho fear me grrrrrrr")

[MarcFBR]

Pioneer Entertainment is now Geneon USA since the Dentsu acquisition, so I was referring to the current name of the company.

More wrong stuff (in more than a few ways actually.)

Since Pioneer (Entertaiment) is now called Geneon (USA), why wouldn't I be allowed to refer to refer to the company by its current name?

Because when you are already discussing them under one name, and then just go 'and they credit Geneon producers' you've created a disjointed post where you are referring to two different companies, and then you went 'and Funimation only did this', thereby suggesting two other companies were involved

Likewise, I would choose to refer to The Ocean Group as Ocean Productions. The name has changed, but I'm not going to refer to it as a different company if it holds the same staff. But then again, staff can change while the name can remain the same, so really that shouldn't even matter either. Or is it not okay to just say "Funimation" anymore? Should we all refer to it as "Funimation Productions" and "Funimation Entertainment" from now on, and say things like "Funimation Entertainment had no involvement in the production in the English dub of DBZ because they didn't exist at the time."?

And this is just rambling nonsense to try and legitimize your mistakes.

[WittyUsername]

I always wanted to hear what would happen if Pioneer did dub all the films with the Ocean cast and proper BGM music.

Like Broly could have been a great villain dub wise if Pioneer and the Ocean cast had handled him (personally I find his funimation voice is very generic "I'm a loud evil psycho fear me grrrrrrr")

With all due respect, I honestly don't get why the Ocean voice cast gets so much praise. To me Brian Drummond makes Vegeta sound like a generic bad guy, Peter Kelamis and Terry Klassen sound way too nasally and their delivery can be very inconsistent, and Scott McNeil sounds like he's trying too hard to sound like a badass. Sure the Funimation cast was pretty bad when they first started but by the Buu saga I believe that they managed to outdo their Ocean counterparts.

[linkdude20002001]

More wrong stuff (in more than a few ways actually.)

Because when you are already discussing them under one name, and then just go 'and they credit Geneon producers' you've created a disjointed post where you are referring to two different companies, and then you went 'and Funimation only did this', thereby suggesting two other companies were involved

And this is just rambling nonsense to try and legitimize your mistakes.

All you're doing is saying NO, NO, NO, without actually giving any attempt at saying anything helpful or informative. And the little you DID say, made no sense. What am I saying that's wrong, and HOW is it wrong? I am not trying to legitimize any mistakes. As far as I am aware, I have not said anything that is not factual.

Dentsu acquired Pioneer Entertainment and its name was changed to Geneon Entertainment.
Is that wrong? If so, how? Please, just tell me already.

[MarcFBR]

All you're doing is saying NO, NO, NO, without actually giving any attempt at saying anything helpful or informative. And the little you DID say, made no sense. What am I saying that's wrong, and HOW is it wrong? I am not trying to legitimize any mistakes. As far as I am aware, I have not said anything that is not factual.

Dentsu acquired Pioneer Entertainment and its name was changed to Geneon Entertainment.
Is that wrong? If so, how? Please, just tell me already.

Because you've claimed your information is accurate and up to date so I didn't feel like correcting you, just letting you know you are wrong. But fair enough.

I'll skip over how you credited Pioneer and Geneon staff, since I did explain that one already.

As for how the other thing is wrong, well you've referred to Geneon USA as if they still exist. They haven't for quite awhile.

Also, Geneon Entertainment doesn't exist anymore either.

[NitroEX]

With all due respect, I honestly don't get why the Ocean voice cast gets so much praise.

It probably has something to do with the fact that they did such a respectable job with their first and only dubbing of Dragon Ball Z.

Had they been given the same opportunity as the Funi in-house cast to do the rest of the movies, have an unedited & unrushed dub of the series, voice the dozens of DBZ video games as well as Kai I'de wager to say you wouldn't be calling them overrated.

Let's be honest. If Sean Schemmel and Chris Sabat had been at the same audition that Scott McNeil, Brian Drummond and Ian James Corlett were at back in 95/96 or whenever it was. I don't think they would have gone "sorry McNeil, sorry Drummond, that Sabat guy just nailed the Piccolo and Vegeta roles. Better luck next time."

[WittyUsername]

With all due respect, I honestly don't get why the Ocean voice cast gets so much praise.

It probably has something to do with the fact that they did such a respectable job with their first and only dubbing of Dragon Ball Z.

Had they been given the same opportunity as the Funi in-house cast to do the rest of the movies, have an unedited & unrushed dub of the series, voice the dozens of DBZ video games as well as Kai I'de wager to say you wouldn't be calling them overrated.

Let's be honest. If Sean Schemmel and Chris Sabat had been at the same audition that Scott McNeil, Brian Drummond and Ian James Corlett were at back in 95/96 or whenever it was. I don't think they would have gone "sorry McNeil, sorry Drummond, that Sabat guy just nailed the Piccolo and Vegeta roles. Better luck next time."

That's just a matter of opinion, in any case I disagree. I think the voice acting in both the old Saban dub and the Pioneer dubs were actually pretty inconsistent with all those weird awkward pauses whenever characters were speaking among other things. Furthermore, you do realize that Sean Schemmel and Chris Sabat have improved significantly since they first started voice acting right?

[NitroEX]

That's a matter of opinion and it doesn't exactly answer my question, in any case I disagree. I think the voice acting in both the old Saban dub and the Pioneer dubs were actually pretty inconsistent with all those weird awkward pauses whenever characters were speaking among other things. Furthermore, you do realize that Sean Schemmel and Chris Sabat have improved significantly since they first started voice acting right?

The performances might have been inconsistent from the movies to the series but that's more to do with the different direction of each project. One being more faithful to the Japanese version and the other being more for kids. Anyway like I said, given the same opportunities as the Funi in-house cast it only makes logical sense that they'de be better at their roles since they started out with better potential than the Funi in house cast. You said yourself that the Funi cast improved over time and I agree but don't you think Ocean would also improve under the same circumstances? And before you say "look at the westwood dub" those aren't what i would call "the same circumstances" and in any case I would still categorize that as their first and only dub of the series. If we were to only consider Funi's first and only dub of the series we'de still be laughing at Sabat's awful impressions but now we have new and improved performances to judge from which is the point I'm trying to make with the Ocean cast.

If you really want an answer to your question (which honestly just seemed like a dig at the Ocean cast) it just comes down to nostalgia and personal preference.

[WittyUsername]

That's a matter of opinion and it doesn't exactly answer my question, in any case I disagree. I think the voice acting in both the old Saban dub and the Pioneer dubs were actually pretty inconsistent with all those weird awkward pauses whenever characters were speaking among other things. Furthermore, you do realize that Sean Schemmel and Chris Sabat have improved significantly since they first started voice acting right?

The performances might have been inconsistent from the movies to the series but that's more to do with the different direction of each project. One being more faithful to the Japanese version and the other being more for kids. Anyway like I said, given the same opportunities as the Funi in-house cast it only makes logical sense that they'de be better at their roles since they started out with better potential than the Funi in house cast. You said yourself that the Funi cast improved over time and I agree but don't you think Ocean would also improve under the same circumstances? And before you say "look at the westwood dub" those aren't what i would call "the same circumstances" and in any case I would still categorize that as their first and only dub of the series. If we were to only consider Funi's first and only dub of the series we'de still be laughing at Sabat's awful impressions but now we have new and improved performances to judge from which is the point I'm trying to make with the Ocean cast.

If you really want an answer to your question (which honestly just seemed like a dig at the Ocean cast) it just comes down to nostalgia and personal preference.

I'm not trying to bash the Ocean voice cast, I was just trying to understand why they get so much praise by people that like to bash Funimation without acknowledging how much they have improved. Also I doubt the Ocean voice cast would have improved as much as you're suggesting. The reason the Funimation voice cast was so bad back in the day was because at the time they were very inexperienced in voice acting. The Ocean voice cast doesn't have the same excuse since they were already experienced voice actors by the time they started dubbing Dbz.

[NitroEX]

Yes I know the Funi cast were inexperienced but why does that mean the Ocean cast wouldn't improve as much in the same position? If anything the added experience would give the Ocean cast a head start.

[VegettoEX]

I don't see what the problem is with someone - anyone at all - still preferring the performances of McNeil, Corlett, Cole, Drummond, Dobson+++, Kaye, Henderson, etc. to even today's decade-older-and-more-experienced FUNimation "in-house" cast. It's a completely viable opinion to have. You can concede a growth in the FUNimation cast and still not prefer them.

[WittyUsername]

Yes I know the Funi cast were inexperienced but why does that mean the Ocean cast wouldn't improve as much in the same position? If anything the added experience would give the Ocean cast a head start.

I guess we'll have to wait until the Ocean dub of Kai is finally released before making that argument.

[TheBlackPaladin]

Yes I know the Funi cast were inexperienced but why does that mean the Ocean cast wouldn't improve as much in the same position? If anything the added experience would give the Ocean cast a head start.

I guess we'll have to wait until the Ocean dub of Kai is finally released before making that argument.

Even then, we may not be able to make that argument. Writing and direction play just as big a role in an actor's performance, making the directors and (adaptation) writers either the "unsung heroes" or the "unsung villains" in any given performance. For example, we learned from a Kanzenshuuer who has talked to Brian Drummond that he was directed (not sure by who, my guess is Barry Watson) to play Vegeta like an evil psychopath. That's not the best way to describe Vegeta's character, but considering that's the direction he was given, he followed that direction very effectively.

All that to say, the performances in the Ocean dub of Kai may be sunk by factors outside the control of the actors. A director who doesn't know what he's doing, scripts that are completely different than the original, a rushed production schedule...we'll just have to wait and see.

'Cause, 'ya know. We've been waiting for almost four years now. I have no doubt whatsoever that the actors were actually brought in to record dialogue for the Ocean dub of Kai, but after almost four years...even I'm getting a little suspicious if there's a production problem going on behind the scenes that has prevented the dub's release.

[Valentine]

I just have a personal preference for them and mind you I had originally seen the entire series with the remastered funi dub and thought they were cool, until I put on the subtitles one day and saw the script changes so now I'm primarily a sub fan let alone how much the characters were changed.

But after all this rewatching season one in the dub everyone told me to avoid ignoring stupid changes etc I absolutely loved the ocean cast feeling they captured the characters much better, especially the films.

[linkdude20002001]

Because you've claimed your information is accurate and up to date so I didn't feel like correcting you, just letting you know you are wrong. But fair enough.

I'll skip over how you credited Pioneer and Geneon staff, since I did explain that one already.

As for how the other thing is wrong, well you've referred to Geneon USA as if they still exist. They haven't for quite awhile.

Also, Geneon Entertainment doesn't exist anymore either.

When I wrote that message that said "Geneon USA", I was meaning to write "Geneon Entertainment" as the full title is "Geneon Entertainment (USA) Inc.". They aren't two separate companies, though. However, in 2009 they merged with Universal Pictures Japan and became Geneon Universal Entrainment, which is still around. I'm not understand, though, what your point is. You seem to be telling me that if a company no longer exists, I can no longer speak of them or work they once did...

[MarcFBR]

They aren't two separate companies, though.

I didn't say they were, but you post referenced them as if they were (you reference Pioneer in the credits, and then refer to Geneon producers, at the time, it was just Pioneer, referring to the company under both names makes no sense, and just adds confusion.)

...although you seem to be referring to Geneon USA and Geneon Japan here, which are indeed separate companies (well... were separate companies.) Geneon's USA branch was a subsidiary owned by the Japanese company, not just an American office of the Japanese companies.

However, in 2009 they merged with Universal Pictures Japan and became Geneon Universal Entrainment, which is still around.

There is no company named Geneon Universal Entertainment anymore.

I'm not understand, though, what your point is. You seem to be telling me that if a company no longer exists, I can no longer speak of them or work they once did...

No, my point is a bit of the opposite in fact. Since the US branch never did ANY DBZ work under the Geneon name, calling them by it (while still also referring to Pioneer) adds confusion into the mix, especially for members who don't keep up on this stuff.