I remember Fox666 saying that Daizenshuu 10 stated that Vegetto is many times stronger than Goku or Vegeta, but he has deleted his posts. Is it true? Is this really stated?
Yeah, I know that we don't need a statement to know this, but there is a reason I want to know.
Question about Daizenshuu 10
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Question about Daizenshuu 10
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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Herms
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Re: Question about Daizenshuu 10
I don't think so. Sounds like a misremembering of the Perfect Files Vol.2 statement that SSj4 Gogeta is "many tens of times" stronger than SSj4 Goku or Vegeta are on their own.
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: Question about Daizenshuu 10
Is there any statement about how Vegetto compares to Goku & Vegeta?
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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Super Vegetto
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Re: Question about Daizenshuu 10
It's stated in GT Perfect Files that: Vegetto > SSJ4 Goku, and by daizenshuu 10 you mean SEG ?
SEG says that Potara is more of multiplication, and ofc Vegetto is many times strongr than Goku and Vegeta together...
SEG says that Potara is more of multiplication, and ofc Vegetto is many times strongr than Goku and Vegeta together...
Re: Question about Daizenshuu 10
Super Vegetto wrote:It's stated in GT Perfect Files that: Vegetto > SSJ4 Goku, and by daizenshuu 10 you mean SEG ?
SEG says that Potara is more of multiplication, and ofc Vegetto is many times strongr than Goku and Vegeta together...
nowhere in the Gt perfect files is that ever stated
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Herms
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Re: Question about Daizenshuu 10
No, that's not said in the Perfect Files. You're thinking of the anime comic version of GT's "Goku Jr." special, which has a supplemental section on Goku's various forms that says Vegetto "may be" stronger than even Super Saiyan 4.Super Vegetto wrote:It's stated in GT Perfect Files that: Vegetto > SSJ4 Goku,
"Daizenshuu 10" is a commonly used name for the unnumbered supplemental daizenshuu "TV Animation Part 3", the 10th daizenshuu to be published.and by daizenshuu 10 you mean SEG ?
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: Question about Daizenshuu 10
Oh, I forgot to say that it's definitely not misremembering of that. Fox666 definitely said that Vegetto was stated to be many times stronger than Goku or Vegeta on their own in a Daizenshuu anime guide (I presume D10, since that's the one that covers the Vegetto episodes) in his last posts of this thread. He definitely said that, because I saved that information in a text file (I was gathering new guidebook info back then), but I didn't save his exact post. But he definitely said that.Herms wrote:I don't think so. Sounds like a misremembering of the Perfect Files Vol.2 statement that SSj4 Gogeta is "many tens of times" stronger than SSj4 Goku or Vegeta are on their own.
No, this was stated in a special section of the GT TV Special Anime Comic.Super Vegetto wrote:It's stated in GT Perfect Files that: Vegetto > SSJ4 Goku,
No, I mean this.Super Vegetto wrote:and by daizenshuu 10 you mean SEG ?
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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Herms
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Re: Question about Daizenshuu 10
He may have said that, but he was possibly misremembering the stuff said about Gogeta or Gotenks, since both those fused characters have stuff like that said about them in guidebooks. But I can't recall any statement like that about Vegetto. I could be wrong though; it wouldn't be strange if it did say that somewhere, since like you said it's a fairly mild claim.He definitely said that, because I saved that information in a text file (I was gathering new guidebook info back then), but I didn't save his exact post. But he definitely said that.
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We might, if they screamed all the time, for no good reason.
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We might, if they screamed all the time, for no good reason.
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: Question about Daizenshuu 10
He had even posted a picture of the page Ι think, and he was doing a research back then, while the Gogeta statement was mentioned earlier in that thread. So, it was either from a different guidebook or misinformation, I dunno. Can you as mods or the admins see deleted posts?
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
Re: Question about Daizenshuu 10
A poster on another forum brought up an interesting point about the Vegetto/SSj4 comparison.
It could entirely just be a comparison between the Potara and Super Saiyan 4, not specific characters, since the actual sentence could be interpreted to be a general description.After Goku and Vegeta use a merging item to merge, they become Vegetto! They can furthermore become a Super Saiyan, making them Super Vegetto! After the two strongest people merge, they become the greatest master in the universe! Perhaps even stronger than Super Saiyan 4!
CatouttaHell wrote:I guess he's just impossibly powerful and he now gets thrills from letting things go as much to hell as possible before busting out his ultimate power and ending the villain or some shit.
Re: Question about Daizenshuu 10
Was that statement made before the introduction of SSJ4?
Because I recall Super Baby Vegeta 1 or 2 already having power surpassing that of Super Vegito, and SSJ4 Goku was pummeling him.
Because I recall Super Baby Vegeta 1 or 2 already having power surpassing that of Super Vegito, and SSJ4 Goku was pummeling him.
Re: Question about Daizenshuu 10
Nah, the GT special was produced and/or aired between the Baby and Super 17 arcs, and the anime comic book containing the "Vegetto ~ a Super Saiyan 4" tidbit would have come sometime after that.sekzee wrote:Was that statement made before the introduction of SSJ4?
Because I recall Super Baby Vegeta 1 or 2 already having power surpassing that of Super Vegito, and SSJ4 Goku was pummeling him.
The source of people believing Baby-Vegeta already surpassed Vegetto comes from Goku making a somewhat generic "ain't never felt a ki as amazin' as that" line about Baby. But there's a loophole to it in that those statements don't always apply to the person making them — Goku said the same thing about Fat Janemba immediately before going Super Saiyan 3 and whooping his butt, for example. So since Goku WAS Vegetto, or at least the Potara Fusion can be seen as just another technique Goku used to gain power, then...
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Re: Question about Daizenshuu 10
Or that Goku just never sensed Vegetto, seeing as they never existed at the same time.Kaboom wrote:Nah, the GT special was produced and/or aired between the Baby and Super 17 arcs, and the anime comic book containing the "Vegetto ~ a Super Saiyan 4" tidbit would have come sometime after that.sekzee wrote:Was that statement made before the introduction of SSJ4?
Because I recall Super Baby Vegeta 1 or 2 already having power surpassing that of Super Vegito, and SSJ4 Goku was pummeling him.
The source of people believing Baby-Vegeta already surpassed Vegetto comes from Goku making a somewhat generic "ain't never felt a ki as amazin' as that" line about Baby. But there's a loophole to it in that those statements don't always apply to the person making them — Goku said the same thing about Fat Janemba immediately before going Super Saiyan 3 and whooping his butt, for example. So since Goku WAS Vegetto, or at least the Potara Fusion can be seen as just another technique Goku used to gain power, then...
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Re: Question about Daizenshuu 10
No, as mentioned it comes from the anime comics version of the GT Goku Jr. special, meaning it came out after the entire Baby arc had aired. In fact, the book was releases July 23rd 1997, a week after GT episode 53 came out.sekzee wrote:Was that statement made before the introduction of SSJ4?
How do you figure? I mean, it's not as if Vegetto puts in an appearance in GT.Because I recall Super Baby Vegeta 1 or 2 already having power surpassing that of Super Vegito,
Edit: Rats, ninja'd.
Anyway, I don't have any major problem with the idea of Baby or Super Saiyan 4 Goku being stronger than Vegetto. I just think it's funny how people have such ironclad ideas about something that doesn't seem to have much evidence one way or the other.
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We might, if they screamed all the time, for no good reason.
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: Question about Daizenshuu 10
It was made during the early episodes of the Evil Dragon's arc (I think episode 54, or somewhere close to that).sekzee wrote:Was that statement made before the introduction of SSJ4?
Goku said that Super Baby 1 had the most amazing ki he had ever felt. He said the same thing about fat Janenba, right before he kicked his ass as a Super Saiyan 3. So, since Vegetto is Goku, it means that he doesn't necessarily include himself, since he didn't include himself against Janenba.Because I recall Super Baby Vegeta 1 or 2 already having power surpassing that of Super Vegito, and SSJ4 Goku was pummeling him.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
Re: Question about Daizenshuu 10
Did all 3 of you have to post the same thing?
I didn't recall exactly; I thought he had made a comparison.
I suppose people arrive at the conclusion when Goku started making comparisons to Buu so early in the series, with some bothering to go as far as claiming that Goku meant Gohan-absorbed Buu, and not just Kid Buu.
Regardless, if GT follows anime continuity, some would argue that Kid Buu > Gohan-absorbed Buu. SSJ3 Goku at full power is even beyond that, which would put him around the same level as Super Vegito.
I didn't recall exactly; I thought he had made a comparison.
I suppose people arrive at the conclusion when Goku started making comparisons to Buu so early in the series, with some bothering to go as far as claiming that Goku meant Gohan-absorbed Buu, and not just Kid Buu.
Regardless, if GT follows anime continuity, some would argue that Kid Buu > Gohan-absorbed Buu. SSJ3 Goku at full power is even beyond that, which would put him around the same level as Super Vegito.
Last edited by sekzee on Thu Feb 27, 2014 7:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: Question about Daizenshuu 10
I started writing before the others replied, and I didn't check what the others wrote until I posted what I said.sekzee wrote:Did all 3 of you have to post the same thing?
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
Re: Question about Daizenshuu 10
Edited my post.