If you would check the comments above somebody already said it is from the GT anime comic. Herms also confirmed that it is a legitimate comic because he just doesn't know if the Japanese version has what is said in the Chinese one because he hasn't bought it yet.
No link/citing to the original japanese anime comic = no case. Doesn't get simpler than that.
Saying herms or whoever else said isn't valid, back up what you say with concrete links to official statements/feats or your statement is simply invalid.
Since no one can fetch the original scan that says Z's Vegito is on par with SSJ4 Goku, nor cite that to an existing Official release, then that comparison is null.
Any source material is relevant if it was produced officially. The GT anime comic was an official production thus it holds as much clout as any official source material that talks about the characters.
It's so "official" yet you cannot link me to the official source nor cite exactly where the original japanese "anime comic" is from. Your only peice of evidence is the CHINESE comic that has been translated from Japanese to chinese and then to ENGLISH LOL. By no one credible neither, because as far as I know there isn't an official english translation of that GT anime comic.
Once again, pleaseeeeeeeeeee feel free to prove me wrong - ANYONE in here.
I'm not going to go and buy stuff I can't afford just to prove that the source material says what it does.
What a lovely strawman. Who said anything about buying? Go find a link that leads to this OfFiCiAL material in which is stated Z's SSJ1 Vegito is on par with GT's SSJ4 Goku. Hell, I'll settle for a damn SCAN of the original japanese release of that page.
If you want to see what was said about it then search the forums. Somebody above has already posted the source. Whether it be Chinese or Japanese, it is still a source. You'll have to wait until the staff at this site purchase the Japanese version if you really want clarification. If you honestly aren't going to do it yourself. I have made my point and I don't feel it necessary to go any further than I have to prove something.
You've proven nothing, are you high? Someone else posted a scan that I already acknowledged and invalidated before it was posted - and it was indeed the chinese one, and it is indeed not valid because who who is fluent in japanese, chinese and english, let alone competent English in all 3 languages to prove/disprove your claims? It also isn't valid because it isn't the ORIGINAL text, it is translated from one complex language to the next, and then retranslated to english (fairly complicated too). A shit ton gets lost in translation.
So NO, that little scan isn't concrete evidence of anything.
No, it doesn't. What you're forgetting here is relativistic scale. It doesn't matter how much you bloat the number, a 1.1x increase is nothing compared to the original value. Because 10% of a number is always going to be 10%. If Goku was the same battle power as Nappa was in the Saiyan arc. Do you honestly think a character with 4,400 is going to make much difference? In the story there are several times where such a difference would have meant nothing.
Confidence Matters wrote:
Goku SSJ4's level = 1 quintillion (example) x 1.1 = a massive power level boost
Being relative to the storyline a 10% increase is going to mean nothing in a fight. That's just how it works.
yeahhh except SSj1 Goku was only 1.25x stronger than 100% Frieza Final Form on Namek and he mollywhopped him no problem.
And that was only a 30 million level difference.
If we scale that shit to the ridiculously high levels in GT, any percentage increase from those high levels is a substantial one.
Akira's comment of it being a side-story does alter the perception of whether this can be regarded as the same continuity at the very least. Because "side-story" can, more often than not, be a nod towards a "Spin-off" event in stories. If this was an actual continuation of the story, even non-canon, then Akira Toriyama would have said so. Not call it a side-story.
Regardless if it's a spin-off or side-story, the fact remains that it's still a continuation. A spin-off/side-tory based on the events of Dragon Ball Z manga.
Goku's only comment on winning the tournament was that someone other than him, Vegeta, Pan, Goten, Trunks or Boo could win. He never specifically states himself. And it doesn't matter if this is the case either because you have to remember that Goku is talking in regard to the tournament setting. What do you think would happen if he and Vegeta go up against each other in the first round? Obviously Goku isn't going to be able to fight Boo if Vegeta pushes Goku to his limits. Or if Vegeta wins but gets exhausted from the fight then he won't be able to win either. Also, nothing is stopping another character from getting a ring-out on any of them either. Kiai's are very effective weapons at pushing superior opponents.
These are all cute rationalizations and fanfiction, but none of this is ever officially stated nor hinted at in the manga. You're reaching, and hard.
Goku was excited to meet a fighter he thought would give the Z-warriors a run fro their money for the championship, because Uub is that motherfucker and Uub is a fighting prodigy. Vegeta states Uub learns to fight as the fight goes on. Goku being ultra competitive and stated to not have taken this fight lightly at all (that's why he wanted to go first against Uub, 100% fresh, hence why he needed Boo's magic), this is all indicators of Uub being in Godku's realm.
I never said his power was restricted to Pure Boo's maximum level. But it is clear he doesn't have access to the well of Ki that Pure Boo left him with through the reincarnation otherwise he would have killed a lot of people growing up. And he would have killed people in the tournament by accident. As I pointed out in my last post to you just because Goku's arm wobbles does not mean that he is anywhere near Goku's level. Because Goku would have to suppress to fight him. Freeza got injured by Goku while suppressed. Cell got injured by Goku while suppressed. And Kiai's knocking about characters much stronger than them has always been a thing but that is probably due to Goku suppressing as well. Goku did it against Freeza. Tenshinhan did it with his Kiai based attack, the Shin Kikoho, against Cell.
What you fail to understand, although it cannot be any simpler, is that Godku got excited and worried to fight Uub, and requested to go up against him first so they both can be 100% fresh, which means Godku was NOT holding back power.
Your logic is ridiculous concerning the environmental damage since Ultimate Gohan VS Super Boo didn't result in Gotens & Trunks & Piccolo receiving any damage, or the earth for that matter - and we know Gohan and Super Boo were definitely in the realm of Kid Boo.
Oob managed to close the gap between him and a heavily suppressed Godku. If you want to talk like Oob put up a good fight against a character much more powerful than SSJ Vegetto. Then I suggest you recollect the fight between Goku and Cell. The fight seemed fairly even yet that was only because Cell was suppressing. Once he unleashed his full power it would have been completely one sided. The only reason I can think that Godku chose Oob to get as strong as him is because he was already born with a lot of power still untapped. So he would have the most potential.
Like I just prove, the fact that Godku told Boo to manipulate the matching in order for Uub and him to be 100% during their match, means that BOTH of them were fighting at 100%.How hard is this to comprehend
You're the one who was saying GT is a continuation of the anime. Please provide me with a source of that. GT is not the next chapter of the Dragon Ball journey because Akira Toriyama calls it a side-story. Not the main story. Therefore it is more a spin-off than the "next chapter" of Dragon Ball.
I strictly said GT is a continuation of the Z manga events. Spinoff or not, canon or not, GT is a continuation by the fact that Uub from chapters 518 and 519 appears. You are confusing continuation with canonicity. They are not always the same.
I can create a story right now that is a continuation of the Z events, ytet totally not canon. here goes:
Once Goku left the tournament with his new friend Uub, Goku had finally snapped. On his way to Uub's village, all the accumulated head trauma had finally crept up on Goku and he regained his original self and absolutely obliterated everyone on earth, eventually including Uub.
The end.
See, continuation, yet non-canon.
Not a hard concept to grasp, bro
You're relying in the dragonball wikia? It usually has an abundance of things wrong with it and this is a prime example. Like I said, if you check this sites section on "Akira Toriyama contributions to anime" under the Jump Super Anime Tour title, it says that he was the one who made the first-draft of the script. As well as two accreditations in the opening credits. One saying that about the first-draft and the second about him being the original creator of the story(Dragon Ball). So unless this site is lying to us now I'd prefer to believe this over a wiki that has been wrong on numerous occasions.
All baseless statements followed by ZERO evidence/official links to back any of it up.
You simply have no case.
And you know the specific contents of the wish? How do you know they didn't just wish the peoples memory of what Majin Boo looks like?
Because it would have been OFFICIALLY STATED - ANYWHERE - if that was the case.
Is this kid serious right now? Am I the only dumbass getting trolled by this kid? holy fuck lol
He is titled with both if you check this sites "Akira Toriyama contributions to anime" section. Like I said.
Yawn more statements that crumble under The Burden Of Proof.
I'm wasting my time with this one.
Like I said. Purposely vague. There is no reason for them to bring up anything but them not seeing Goku in over 5 years. The direction of the conversation does not need to go in that direction at all.
A simple "Last time we saw each other was when Frieza was resurrected and attacked" would have sufficed.
These are not plot holes. They are just points that you have not thought much about. It's easy to see why Goku would think he may not win. Goku talks like anybody could get the final round of the tournament but it might not be any of them. His actual line from the Viz translation is "Don't worry. If any of us gets to the end. We'll let you win." Why say that if it is obvious who is the strongest there? Because in a tournament setting anything could happen. Goku and Vegeta could fight each other to the point of exhaustion so that Goten, Trunks, Pan or Boo could beat the winner between the two most powerful characters. Then Oob could beat the rest.
Impressive speculation and fanfiction, yet nothing concrete.
The facts are that Goku wasn't sure ANY of the z-warriors had a good shot at taking the championship. Because of Uub. That includes himself and Vegeta. And Ultimate Gohan. Your whole reading Goku's mind about how he thought the tourney would play out is a reach and a half, to say the least.And based on ZERO evidence from the manga.
Given the feats of the manga, and how Uub actually damaged Godku who was going 100% against Uub, the facts point to Uub's closing the gap on Godku.
hence the excitement of Goku and the doubt of the z cast's chances at winning.
It goes against the source material that Warrior Namekian's can't make dragon balls. It also doesn't make sense due to the fact that those dragon balls should have been picked up by the dragon radar. Even assuming they were shielded by the temple somehow, you're going to tell me that Mr. Popo and Dende have been there for 30 years without so much as noticing them? And they should be on Earth anyway because they would have fallen from the lookout during the fight with Evil Boo and SSJ3 Gotenks. They would have been restored where they were destroyed. Not to mention how did PIlaf magically know there were Dragon Balls up on the lookout? How did he even get past Karin and Yajirobe? And how did they bridge the gap between Karin's tower and the lookout when they were using mech's that can't fly?
Nothing wrong with my point because Goku being a Saiyan never needed to be addressed over Dragon Ball pre-Saiyan arc. These black star Dragon Balls however do need to be addressed because they have spent the past 30 years in the lookout right under the noses of the characters. It's not like Raditz had been on Earth for 10 years and nobody noticed him. Which would be a point that would need to be referenced prior to the Saiyan arc. Because it would be a glaring problem.
These events don't need to be referenced because they aren't points needing to be addressed. Having super powerful dragon balls on the lookout and nobody ever noticing their existence in over 30 years worth of their existence is something that clearly needs to be referenced. Pilaf within a couple of minutes arriving there found them easily. You're telling me that Mr. Popo or Dende never went into this room ever in the past 30 years. Mr. Popo is trying to look after the lookout during all of these years and he has never been in the room?
zomg Why do saiyans have the ability to turn into great apes? why do they need their tails to do it? why a blutz waves and not UV rays? Why did Raditz call in Vegeta & Nappa? how did they even understand him, he had a hole in his chest? why didn't goku move away at the very last second from that special beam cannon? why did Piccolo have to miss the first time? Why would Piccolo train Gohan and not, like, rape him and eat him? why are saiyans so arrogant? why did Vegeta have to let Cell reach his perfect form? why is it possible for trunks to travel back in time? how the hell did future gohan survive so long? hell, how did future trunks survive his last fight with the androids before hopping in the time machine? why is goku such a prodigy? why is frieza such a prodigy? why was frieza even born? why was goku even born? why doesn't krillin have nose?
Them training has no relevance to the plot.
AHAHAHAHHA
The plot is based around dragon balls that can destroy the Earth and scatter across the universe. Something that doesn't even make sense because A) Pre-seperation the Nameless Namek was not an evil person. Sure he had evil in him but the fact he wanted to become Kami and look over the people of Earth, to the point he expelled his evil, shows that he would never make dragon balls like that. B) If they were that dangerous he should have destroyed the dragon or destroyed one of the dragon balls. So they could never be used to make a wish. Not put them in the lookout. C) The Nameless Namek was of the Dragon Clan, hence his ability to make Dragon Balls. Piccolo isn't therefore these Dragon Balls shouldn't be active. D) Nobody ever noticed them since their existence.
You go ask Toei all of this, not me. The plot has zero to do with canon or continuity. The official word of the head(s) of the series does. THAT is the ultimate deciding factor in a material's canonicity or continuity. Akira statng GT is a side story makes GT non-canon, not GT's plot holes. Toei AND Akira stating GT takes place after the Z manga events makes it a continuation of the manga, nothing else.
If he was as strong a SSJ Vegetto or stronger then someone like Rild would have been one-shot material. I'm sorry. But even if it was fairly one-sided Rild still managed to fend off Goku until Goku busted out SSJ.
Except Goku was stated to be holding back more than half his power. womp womp. and when he got serious, so did Rhild. womp womp.
So no, just because he didn't one-shot rhild doesn't mean what I say isn't true.
Goku was indeed Godku when he faced Rhild.
That is the point... Rild was nowhere near the strength to one-shot Gohan. And Goku was nowhere near the strength to one-shot Rild
Holy crap you need to learn your dragon ball.
Goku was stated to be HOLDING back against Rhild 1st form, who was ALSO holding back because he was in a repressed form. Thus the same Rhild who was holding back on Goku due to being in the first form is automatically holding back against GT Gohan (who is as strong as Bootenks saga Gohan).
And yet a restricted Rhild absolutely mollywhopped Gohan to the point where Majuub had to step in and suckerblast him.
Rhild's max power is eons beyond Mystic Gohan, and so is GT Goku's base, let alone GT Goku SSJ1.
To recap: GT being proven a continuation series that is non-canon/spin-off features Godku getting stronger than he ever was in Z. Therefore, since SSJ4 is that improved Godku x 500 or x4000, Z's Goku is nowhere near GT Goku SSJ4.
