Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

[ahill1]

I think that Gohan was only a SSJ against Dabura. Art says that; At that moment, was a great distinction between SSJ and SSJ2. I think the author may have had a change of mind about Gohan SSJ2 in the tournament and have found it better to ignore that part and have it just as SSJ.

Look at Majin Vegeta SSJ is depicted. Majin Vegeta SSJ is the man who will do a better job than Dabura. Majin Vegeta SSJ is portrayed as over Gohan and Dabura. Goku and Gohan are terrified with the power of Majin Vegeta SSJ while Dabura and Babidi was amazed with said power.

Gohan SSJ ( Cell Games ) 89,000,000,000
Vegeta SSJ ( Buu Saga ) 81,000,000,000
Gohan SSJ ( Buu Saga ) 73,000,000,000
Goku SSJ ( Cell Games ) 72,720,000,000
Dabura 71,878,000,000

[ZombieVito]

I usually just chalk it up to Gohan having never practiced with Super Saiyan 2, and thus not being able to *pop* into it at will like Goku and Vegeta can. He needs some time and effort. Kibito allowed Gohan that luxury at the tournament, but Dabra wouldn't have. Plus, there's reason to believe Dabra was weaker than Gohan, so Gohan very well may not have thought he'd need Super Saiyan 2 until it was too late. Anger would be a good shortcut, but we're told he's having difficulty with that too.

There's still one or two small problems with that angle, but no more or less than any other. There's just no trumping the artwork in my book. You may as well try to tell me that Vegeta used Super Saiyan to beat Pui-Pui and was just circumstantially drawn differently from every other instance of Super Saiyan ever.

I just don't see Gohan gambling the life of Piccolo and Kuririn like that.

There's also the issue with him not being able to transform into a SSJ2 when Buu was about to come out of his ball. He had no problem doing it a few hours earlier.

While I respect your stance in this Kaboom, I just can't agree. D2 explanation is just perfect in my eyes.

[Lord Beerus]

I usually just chalk it up to Gohan having never practiced with Super Saiyan 2, and thus not being able to *pop* into it at will like Goku and Vegeta can. He needs some time and effort. Kibito allowed Gohan that luxury at the tournament, but Dabra wouldn't have. Plus, there's reason to believe Dabra was weaker than Gohan, so Gohan very well may not have thought he'd need Super Saiyan 2 until it was too late. Anger would be a good shortcut, but we're told he's having difficulty with that too.

There's still one or two small problems with that angle, but no more or less than any other. There's just no trumping the artwork in my book. You may as well try to tell me that Vegeta used Super Saiyan to beat Pui-Pui and was just circumstantially drawn differently from every other instance of Super Saiyan ever.

I just don't see Gohan gambling the life of Piccolo and Kuririn like that.

Gohan gambled the fate the world on three separate instances against Cell at the Cell Games, too.

But Kaboom summed it up perfectly. I just can't take what is stated in the guidebooks over the original artwork in the manga over. Toriyama drew Gohan as SSJ against Dabra in the manga, and I just take that at face value for what it is.

[Hugo Boss]

Look at Majin Vegeta SSJ is depicted. Majin Vegeta SSJ is the man who will do a better job than Dabura. Majin Vegeta SSJ is portrayed as over Gohan and Dabura. Goku and Gohan are terrified with the power of Majin Vegeta SSJ while Dabura and Babidi was amazed with said power.

Yeah, there is that. Also the damage expected from Goku vs. Vegeta was enough for even Kaioshin risking his life in attempt of stopping that fight. Since both fought as SS2 the energy took from Goku was in a whole different level from Gohan's.

[Captain Space]

This may be me remembering things wrong, but doesn't Gohan say that "Dad and Vegeta are both fighting at a level beyond Super Saiyan, that must be why their damage energy is so high!" or somesuch to Kaioshin? That sort of (to me) implies that he himself wasn't in SSJ2, since he doesn't mention himself (in the context of his efforts against Buu's cocoon or against Dabura earlier) at all.

[DBZAOTA482]

23rd Budokai Chains

Inspired by my own thread...


Goku ~ Piccolo > Goku (Unweighted) >>> Kami >> Tenshinhan (speed) > Goku (Weighted) > Tenshinhan > Piccolo (suppressed) > Goku (Sacred Water) ~ Piccolo Daimao (young) > Krillin ~ Yamcha > Cyborg Tao > Chi-Chi = Piccolo Daimao (old) > Yajirobe > Chiaotzu > Piccolo Daimao (old; <50%) >>> Drum > Goku (22nd Budokai) >= King Chappa > Tambourine

Note: Please use Goku (22nd Budokai), Goku (Sacred Water), Piccolo Daimao (old and young), Tambourine, and Drum as reference.

What's yours?

[LightBing]

Goku = Piccolo
Kami
Tenshinhan
Goku(Sacred Water) = Piccolo Daimao(Young)
Piccolo Daimao(Old)
Kuririn = Drum
Cyborg Tao = Yamcha
Goku(22nd TB)
Yajirobe = Chiaotzu = Jackie Chun(22nd TB)
Tambourine
Chi-Chi
King Chappa

I think Yajirobe and Chappa barely increased in power. No way did the others besides Tenshinhan reached Daimao level. He totally obliterated Goku(22nd TB) at less than 50%, who had a huge gap compared with the others. They couldn't close that big of a gap so easily, in my opinion.

[ZombieVito]

Goku
Piccolo
Kami
Goku(Sacred Water) = Piccolo Daimao(Young)
Tenshinhan
Piccolo Daimao(Old)
Drum
Cyborg Tao
Kuririn
Goku(22nd TB)
Yamcha
Yajirobe
Tambourine = Chiaotzu
Jackie Chun(22nd TB)
Chi-Chi
King Chappa

[Captain Space]

Goku ~ Piccolo > Goku (Unweighted)

What's that first Goku? Surely unweighted is his max? Or is that, like, after he powers up mid-fight (which I think was anime-only and Piccolo does it too anyway...)?

[SSJ2FutureGohan]

How could Tenshinhan possibly be below Young Piccolo Daimao and post-Water Goku at the 23rd TB?

[DanielSSJ]

Without further ado....
BATTLE OF GODS

Son Goku - 90,000,000
Super Saiyan - 4,500,000,000
Super Saiyan 3 - 36,000,000,000
Super Saiyan God - 900,000,000,000
base form, God ki - 300,000,000,000
Super Saiyan, God Ki - 450,000,000,000
Vegeta - 80,000,000
Super Saiyan - 4,000,000,000
Super Saiyan 2 - 8,000,000,000
enraged - 120,000,000,000
Beerus - 1,500,000,000,000
Whis - 2,250,000,000,000
Son Gohan - 60,000,000,000
Mr Boo - 9,000,000,000
Piccolo - 1,200,000,000
Son Goten - 9,000,000
Trunks - 9,000,000
Gotenks - 180,000,000
Super Saiyan - 9,000,000,000
Android 18 ~ 440,000,000
Krillin - 450,000
Yamcha - 190,000
Tenshinhan - 1,700,000
Chiaotzu - 360,000

I'm gonna hold off on a "Resurrection F" list until I actually see the movie.

[ahill1]

How could Tenshinhan possibly be below Young Piccolo Daimao and post-Water Goku at the 23rd TB?

Daiz 7.

[ahill1]

Without further ado....
BATTLE OF GODS

Son Goku - 90,000,000
Super Saiyan - 4,500,000,000
Super Saiyan 3 - 36,000,000,000
Super Saiyan God - 900,000,000,000
base form, God ki - 300,000,000,000
Super Saiyan, God Ki - 450,000,000,000
Vegeta - 80,000,000
Super Saiyan - 4,000,000,000
Super Saiyan 2 - 8,000,000,000
enraged - 120,000,000,000
Beerus - 1,500,000,000,000
Whis - 2,250,000,000,000
Son Gohan - 60,000,000,000
Mr Boo - 9,000,000,000
Piccolo - 1,200,000,000
Son Goten - 9,000,000
Trunks - 9,000,000
Gotenks - 180,000,000
Super Saiyan - 9,000,000,000
Android 18 ~ 440,000,000
Krillin - 450,000
Yamcha - 190,000
Tenshinhan - 1,700,000
Chiaotzu - 360,000

I'm gonna hold off on a "Resurrection F" list until I actually see the movie.

Why do you think Vegeta weaker than Goku in equal forms? Do you think Vegeta lost his Majin Powers? As far as I remember Vegeta trained as hard as Goku in Dragon Ball Super.

[ZombieVito]

Without further ado....
BATTLE OF GODS

Son Goku - 90,000,000
Super Saiyan - 4,500,000,000
Super Saiyan 3 - 36,000,000,000
Super Saiyan God - 900,000,000,000
base form, God ki - 300,000,000,000
Super Saiyan, God Ki - 450,000,000,000
Vegeta - 80,000,000
Super Saiyan - 4,000,000,000
Super Saiyan 2 - 8,000,000,000
enraged - 120,000,000,000
Beerus - 1,500,000,000,000
Whis - 2,250,000,000,000
Son Gohan - 60,000,000,000
Mr Boo - 9,000,000,000
Piccolo - 1,200,000,000
Son Goten - 9,000,000
Trunks - 9,000,000
Gotenks - 180,000,000
Super Saiyan - 9,000,000,000
Android 18 ~ 440,000,000
Krillin - 450,000
Yamcha - 190,000
Tenshinhan - 1,700,000
Chiaotzu - 360,000

I'm gonna hold off on a "Resurrection F" list until I actually see the movie.

Kuririn > Tenshinhan.

Why do you have Piccolo, Goten and Trunks that low?

Chaoz > Yamcha?

[Khin]

Without further ado....
BATTLE OF GODS

Son Goku - 90,000,000
Super Saiyan - 4,500,000,000
Super Saiyan 3 - 36,000,000,000
Super Saiyan God - 900,000,000,000
base form, God ki - 300,000,000,000
Super Saiyan, God Ki - 450,000,000,000
Vegeta - 80,000,000
Super Saiyan - 4,000,000,000
Super Saiyan 2 - 8,000,000,000
enraged - 120,000,000,000
Beerus - 1,500,000,000,000
Whis - 2,250,000,000,000
Son Gohan - 60,000,000,000
Mr Boo - 9,000,000,000
Piccolo - 1,200,000,000
Son Goten - 9,000,000
Trunks - 9,000,000
Gotenks - 180,000,000
Super Saiyan - 9,000,000,000
Android 18 ~ 440,000,000
Krillin - 450,000
Yamcha - 190,000
Tenshinhan - 1,700,000
Chiaotzu - 360,000

I'm gonna hold off on a "Resurrection F" list until I actually see the movie.

-SSJ Gotenks should be stronger than SSJ3 Goku
-Base Vegeta and Goku should be equals
-Ulitmate Gohan should be stronger
-Kuririn>Tenshinhan,but not by much
-Yamcha>Chaozu,same as above

[Khin]

Just finished my Buu Saga power levels

Super Saiyan Multiplyers

Super Saiyan - 50x Base

Super Saiyan 2 - 100x Base

Super Saiyan 3 - 400x Base

Fusion Multiplyers

Fusion Dance - (A+B) x 10

Potara - (A+B) x 50(250 if the users are rivals)

Super Buu's Multiplyer

Good Buu + Grey Buu x 10

Ultimate Gohan's Multiplyer

Base Gohan x 10,000

Spoiler:

25th World Martial Arts Tournament
Killa:
-5.6
Punta:
-5.8
Jewel:
-6.2
Mr.Satan:
-6.5
Videl:
-6.8
Majin Spopovich:
-8.6
Majin Yamu:
-8.6
Gohan:
Base-50,000,000
SSJ--2,500,000,000
SSJ2-5,000,000,000
Android 18:
-600,000,000
Goten:
Base-26,500,000
SSJ--1,325,000,000
Trunks:
Base-28,000,000
SSJ--1,400,000,000

Chasing Spopivich and Yamu
Kuririn:
-600,000
Kibito:
-48,000,000
Piccolo:
-1,200,000,000
Kaioshin:
-1,500,000,000

Battle on Babidi's Spaceship
Pui Pui:
-100,000
Vegeta:
Base-60,000,000
Yakon:
-50,000,000
Goku:
Base-68,000,000
SSJ-3,400,000,000
Gohan:
Base-42,000,000
SSJ-2,100,000,000
Dabra:
vs. Gohan-2,250,000,000
Full Power-3,000,000,000

Majin Vegeta vs. Goku
Goku:
Base-68,000,000
MSSJ-3,400,000,000
SSJ2-6,800,000,000

Majin Vegeta:
Base-68,000,000
SSJ--3,400,000,000
SSJ2-6,800,000,000

First Battle with Majin Buu
Dabra:
-3,000,000,000

Gohan:
MSSJ-2,100,000,000
SSJ2-4,200,000,000

Kaioshin:
-1,500,000,000

Majin Buu:
Initial-2,500,000,000
Full Power-25,000,000,000

Majin Vegeta:
SS2-6,800,000,000
Suicide Attack-30,000,000,000

Majin Buu vs. Goku
Goku:
Base-68,000,000
SSJ-3,400,000,000
SSJ2-6,800,000,000
SSJ3-27,200,000,000

Majin Buu:
-25,000,000,000

The Fusion Saga
Z-Sword Gohan:
Base-45,000,000
SSJ-2,250,000,000
SSJ2-4,500,000,000

Piccolo:
-1,200,000,000

Trunks:
Base-30,000,000
SSJ-1,500,000,000

Goten:
Base-28,500,000
SSJ-1,425,000,000

Gotenks:
Base-570,000,000
SSJ-28,500,000,000

Majin Buu:
-25,000,000,000
Good-10,000,000,000
Grey-15,000,000,000

Super Buu:
-250,000,000,000

Battle at the Room of Space and Time
Goten:
Base-35,000,000

Trunks:
Base-35,000,000

Super Buu:
-250,000,000,000

Gotenks:
Base-700,000,000
SSJ-35,000,000,000
SSJ3-280,000,000,000

Ultimate Gohan arrives

Super Buu:
-250,000,000,000

Gotenks:
SSJ3-280,000,000,000

Ultimate Gohan:
-450,000,000,000

Piccolo:
-1,200,000,000

Buutenks:
-531,200,000,000

The Potara Warrrior Vegetto
Buucolo:
-251,270,000,000

Ultimate Gohan:
-450,000,000,000

Goku:
Base-68,000,000
SSJ-3,400,000,000

Vegeta:
Base-68,000,000
SSJ-3,400,000,000

Buuhan:
-701,270,000,000

Vegetto:
Base-34,000,000,000
Candy-1,000,000,000,000
SSJ----1,700,000,000,000

Destruction of Earth
Super Buu:
-250,000,000,000

Buff Buu:
-300,000,000

Kid Buu:
-28,000,000,000

The Battle for the sake of the Universe
Vegeta:
Base-70,000,000
SSJ--3,500,000,000
SSJ2-7,000,000,000

Good Buu:
-10,000,000,000

Kid Buu:
-28,000,000,000

Goku:
Base-70,000,000
SSJ--3,500,000,000
SSJ2-7,000,000,000
SSJ3-28,000,000,000

Genki Dama:
-100,000,000,000

[SSJ2FutureGohan]

How could Tenshinhan possibly be below Young Piccolo Daimao and post-Water Goku at the 23rd TB?

Daiz 7.

Manga says otherwise.

[Hugo Boss]

How could Tenshinhan possibly be below Young Piccolo Daimao and post-Water Goku at the 23rd TB?

Daiz 7.

Manga says otherwise.

I'm confused. What exactly those sources claim differently? All I can remember is that Tenshinhan gave some tough fight to Goku before he strips his heavy acessories.

[Captain Space]

I'm confused. What exactly those sources claim differently? All I can remember is that Tenshinhan gave some tough fight to Goku before he strips his heavy acessories.

I think the contention here is that:

-Daiz 7 says King Piccolo* and Sacred Water Goku are 260, and we know that BoZ Tenshinhan is 250 so presumably he was below 250 at the 23rd.

-Manga implies that that 260 number for Piccolo and Goku can't be right, since:

23rd Tenshinhan ~ Weighted 23rd Goku > Goku (vs. King Piccolo) ~ King Piccolo

...ergo whatever BP King Piccolo had, 23rd Tenshinhan must be above it, and that number must be below 250.

I hope that makes sense and I haven't remembered anything wrong (tell me if I have).

(*I lack the confidence in my ability to consistently spell Piccolo Daimao correctly.)

[SSJ2FutureGohan]

I'm confused. What exactly those sources claim differently? All I can remember is that Tenshinhan gave some tough fight to Goku before he strips his heavy acessories.

Tenshinhan was confident in taking on Goku at the 23rd after sensing Goku's strength from 3 years back.