Discussion specifically regarding the "refreshed" TV version of DBZ created in Japan for its 20th anniversary, including individual threads for each episode.
Puto wrote:That's the thing, though, she shouldn't have to keep track of so many distinct variations.
Maybe people couldn't stand anyone else voicing an older Gohan like how Goku kept the same voice. I still wonder if it was planned for Goku to keep the same voice as an adult.
I would be so happy if they let someone else take a shot. Though a good 99.99 percent says that won't happen.
Why Dragon Ball Consistency in something such as power levels matter!
Spoiler:
Doctor. wrote:I've explained before, I'll just paraphrase myself.
Power levels establish tension and drama. People who care about them (well, people who care about them in a narrative) don't care about the big numbers or the fancy explosions. If you have character A who's so much above character B, who's the main character, you're gonna be left wondering how in the hell character B, the character we're supposed to care and root for, is going to escape the situation or overcome the odds. It makes us emotionally invested.
If character B doesn't escape the situation in a believable way that's consistent with previous events, then that emotional investment is gone. It was pointless tension, pointless drama made just to suck in the viewer. It has no critical value whatsoever. The audience is left believing that the author can just create whatever scenarios he wants and what happens to the characters is decided by whatever the author wants to happen, regardless of the events that happened in the story. Which, in fairness, is what happens, but the audience wants to be fooled. The audience wants to know that the world they're following has rules. That the world they're invested in isn't going to bend to external factors that are irrelevant to them.
An author can do whatever he wants with the characters, that's not false. But the author should also have the responsibility to make sure it fits in cohesively with the other events in the narrative he has created.
Have to be that guy and say Goku and Gohan, throughout the entire series, sound nothing alike. Yes, the actual sound of the voice is the same, but you could pick a random episode from the Buu arc that has Gohan in it and he's going to run a gambit of typical Gohan emotions: self-doubt, worry, timidity, etc., and you'll pick up on it quite easily, I think, through Nozawa's performance. Goku never sounds like that, at all, at any point.
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B wrote:Have to be that guy and say Goku and Gohan, throughout the entire series, sound nothing alike. Yes, the actual sound of the voice is the same, but you could pick a random episode from the Buu arc that has Gohan in it and he's going to run a gambit of typical Gohan emotions: self-doubt, worry, timidity, etc., and you'll pick up on it quite easily, I think, through Nozawa's performance. Goku never sounds like that, at all, at any point.
Adult Gohan sounds like Goku when fighting. Every time I hear Gohan scream, attack, or usually say something during battle, I think of Goku.
Why Dragon Ball Consistency in something such as power levels matter!
Spoiler:
Doctor. wrote:I've explained before, I'll just paraphrase myself.
Power levels establish tension and drama. People who care about them (well, people who care about them in a narrative) don't care about the big numbers or the fancy explosions. If you have character A who's so much above character B, who's the main character, you're gonna be left wondering how in the hell character B, the character we're supposed to care and root for, is going to escape the situation or overcome the odds. It makes us emotionally invested.
If character B doesn't escape the situation in a believable way that's consistent with previous events, then that emotional investment is gone. It was pointless tension, pointless drama made just to suck in the viewer. It has no critical value whatsoever. The audience is left believing that the author can just create whatever scenarios he wants and what happens to the characters is decided by whatever the author wants to happen, regardless of the events that happened in the story. Which, in fairness, is what happens, but the audience wants to be fooled. The audience wants to know that the world they're following has rules. That the world they're invested in isn't going to bend to external factors that are irrelevant to them.
An author can do whatever he wants with the characters, that's not false. But the author should also have the responsibility to make sure it fits in cohesively with the other events in the narrative he has created.
Gyt Kaliba wrote:I'm wondering if there will be any other replacements to speak of in this arc of Kai, on the Japanese side I mean.
The Elder Kaiou'shin will have a new voice (I believe he got one in Ultimate Blast, so that might carry over).
I forget, who voiced the Elder in Z? Have they since passed on?
dbzfan7 wrote:Adult Gohan sounds like Goku when fighting. Every time I hear Gohan scream, attack, or usually say something during battle, I think of Goku.
Agreed, that was when their two voices blended together the worst for me. The worst case of all was during the Trunks special, with Future Gohan, who pretty much was 'fight mode Goku' all of the time rather than Gohan.
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Gyt Kaliba wrote:Agreed, that was when their two voices blended together the worst for me. The worst case of all was during the Trunks special, with Future Gohan, who pretty much was 'fight mode Goku' all of the time rather than Gohan.
I don't hate Nozawa as Adult Gohan, it's just the mood is sort of killed when I hear Goku as Gohan's voice in fight mode. It's one of the reasons I like Hebert more. I usually don't side with the english cast but I have made some exceptions to who I'd rather hear.
Why Dragon Ball Consistency in something such as power levels matter!
Spoiler:
Doctor. wrote:I've explained before, I'll just paraphrase myself.
Power levels establish tension and drama. People who care about them (well, people who care about them in a narrative) don't care about the big numbers or the fancy explosions. If you have character A who's so much above character B, who's the main character, you're gonna be left wondering how in the hell character B, the character we're supposed to care and root for, is going to escape the situation or overcome the odds. It makes us emotionally invested.
If character B doesn't escape the situation in a believable way that's consistent with previous events, then that emotional investment is gone. It was pointless tension, pointless drama made just to suck in the viewer. It has no critical value whatsoever. The audience is left believing that the author can just create whatever scenarios he wants and what happens to the characters is decided by whatever the author wants to happen, regardless of the events that happened in the story. Which, in fairness, is what happens, but the audience wants to be fooled. The audience wants to know that the world they're following has rules. That the world they're invested in isn't going to bend to external factors that are irrelevant to them.
An author can do whatever he wants with the characters, that's not false. But the author should also have the responsibility to make sure it fits in cohesively with the other events in the narrative he has created.
As far as I'm concerned, I'm amazed at how she sounds different for Goku, Gohan and Goten!
When you hear high school Gohan, it's not the same voice than Goku's. When you hear little Goten, it's not the same voice than little Gohan's!
She has a way to transform her voice that makes it okay for me that she voices Goku, Gohan and Goten (oh, and Bardack too, yet unother different interpretation!).
Someday, she'll have to be replaced and it's going to be tough to find someone able to keep up with such a performance!
Cold Skin wrote:As far as I'm concerned, I'm amazed at how she sounds different for Goku, Gohan and Goten!
When you hear high school Gohan, it's not the same voice than Goku's. When you hear little Goten, it's not the same voice than little Gohan's!
She has a way to transform her voice that makes it okay for me that she voices Goku, Gohan and Goten (oh, and Bardack too, yet unother different interpretation!).
Someday, she'll have to be replaced and it's going to be tough to find someone able to keep up with such a performance!
Well, they don't really have to find one person to play all of the Goku-related roles. It makes more sense to me that each character would, down the line, get cast to different actors (though the question becomes...would they still cast Goku as a woman? She still finds a way for Goku to work, but in an industry now dominated by high pitched glass shattering voices from female actors, I wonder if any of them would work >_>).
But this is a depressing thing to think about. Lets focus on the now.
Personally speaking, I can't wait for this to be dubbed and join the rest of Kai. I hope, with the movie coming out soon, that it will be dubbed alongside the movie and the specials that were put out. All the modern movies could be done in one set. Give you your bang for your buck.
I know that he rarely speaks in this saga, but since Brad Jackson is back in the area now, would you guys want him to return as Oolong, or still want Mr. Masse?
Super Sonic wrote:I know that he rarely speaks in this saga, but since Brad Jackson is back in the area now, would you guys want him to return as Oolong, or still want Mr. Masse?
Unless they have an absolute good reason to, I don't see Masse being replaced by the guy who he replaced.
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Mayuri Kurotsuchi wrote:"In this world, nothing perfect exists. It may be a cliche after all but it's the way things are. That's precisely why ordinary men pursue the concept of perfection, it's infatuation. But ultimately I have to ask myself "What is the true meaning of being perfect?" and the answer I came up with was nothing. Not one thing. The truth of the matter is I despise perfection! If something is truly perfect, that's IT! The bottom line becomes there is no room for imagination! No space for intelligence or ability or improvement! Do you understand? To men of science like us, perfection is a dead end, a condition of hopelessness. Always strive to be better than anything that came before you but not perfect! Scientist's agonize over the attempt to achieve perfection! That's the kind of creatures we are! We take joy in trying to exceed our grasp, in trying to reach for something that in the end, we have to admit may in fact be unreachable!"
For consistency's sake, I doubt they'll be replacing Massey's Oolong with Jackson's. Tiffany Vollmer could walk into the studio tomorrow and she wouldn't get her role back.
Anyway, it's still in production on the Japanese side, it's a little too early to speculate on the English dub cast.
Kentai wrote:Son Gokuu is a fascinating character anyway, because he is - at face value, anyway - an idiot savant. The victim of violent head trauma as an infant [...] he's a simple bumpkin with a fair share of brain damage who's natural talents to work out what's wrong compensate for his broad lack of common sense. But he's also a fighter, through and through [...] he fight until he has, in no uncertain terms, beaten his enemy on terms they can both acknowledge. He doesn't want to kill anyone, or even prove that he can win... he just wants to know he can. He's an ineffably charming bastard who's manly leanings were really incendental, and yes, the fact that he was voiced by a squeaky woman made the combination perhaps all the more charming.
I imagine they'll just keep Massey, supposing he's still around too. I actually wish they'd gone closer to the Japanese on that role though. I know it's an odd role to want that for, but I really liked Tatsuta's work in early Dragon Ball.
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penguintruth wrote:For consistency's sake, I doubt they'll be replacing Massey's Oolong with Jackson's. Tiffany Vollmer could walk into the studio tomorrow and she wouldn't get her role back.
No, she better not return.
fadeddreams5 wrote:
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:... Haven't we already gotten these in GT? Goku dies, the DBs go away, and the Namekian DBs most likely won't be used again because of the Evil Dragons.
Goku didn't die in GT. The show sucked him off so much, it was impossible to keep him in the world of the living, so he ascended beyond mortality.
jjgp1112 wrote: Sat Jul 18, 2020 6:31 am
I'm just about done with the concept of reboots and making shows that were products of their time and impactful "new and sexy" and in line with modern tastes and sensibilities. Let stuff stay in their era and give today's kids their own shit to watch.
I always side eye the people who say "Now my kids/today's kids can experience what I did as a child!" Nigga, who gives a fuck about your childhood? You're an adult now and it was at least 15 years ago. Let the kids have their own experience instead of picking at a corpse.
penguintruth wrote:For consistency's sake, I doubt they'll be replacing Massey's Oolong with Jackson's. Tiffany Vollmer could walk into the studio tomorrow and she wouldn't get her role back.
No, she better not return.
Look, I know how scary that thought is, but it was just an example.
Shhh. It's okay. She's gone now. She can't hurt us anymore.
Kentai wrote:Son Gokuu is a fascinating character anyway, because he is - at face value, anyway - an idiot savant. The victim of violent head trauma as an infant [...] he's a simple bumpkin with a fair share of brain damage who's natural talents to work out what's wrong compensate for his broad lack of common sense. But he's also a fighter, through and through [...] he fight until he has, in no uncertain terms, beaten his enemy on terms they can both acknowledge. He doesn't want to kill anyone, or even prove that he can win... he just wants to know he can. He's an ineffably charming bastard who's manly leanings were really incendental, and yes, the fact that he was voiced by a squeaky woman made the combination perhaps all the more charming.
Super Sonic wrote:I know that he rarely speaks in this saga, but since Brad Jackson is back in the area now, would you guys want him to return as Oolong, or still want Mr. Masse?
Even though it probably won't happen, yes, yes I would want him to return. Now if only he could have been in the area when they were doing the King Cold stuff.
penguintruth wrote:For consistency's sake, I doubt they'll be replacing Massey's Oolong with Jackson's. Tiffany Vollmer could walk into the studio tomorrow and she wouldn't get her role back.
No, she better not return.
Look, I know how scary that thought is, but it was just an example.
Shhh. It's okay. She's gone now. She can't hurt us anymore.
Oh cmon, she wasn't THAT bad... in the Buu Saga... when she acted nice.... and in more mellow moments.
Everything else is blah.
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Mayuri Kurotsuchi wrote:"In this world, nothing perfect exists. It may be a cliche after all but it's the way things are. That's precisely why ordinary men pursue the concept of perfection, it's infatuation. But ultimately I have to ask myself "What is the true meaning of being perfect?" and the answer I came up with was nothing. Not one thing. The truth of the matter is I despise perfection! If something is truly perfect, that's IT! The bottom line becomes there is no room for imagination! No space for intelligence or ability or improvement! Do you understand? To men of science like us, perfection is a dead end, a condition of hopelessness. Always strive to be better than anything that came before you but not perfect! Scientist's agonize over the attempt to achieve perfection! That's the kind of creatures we are! We take joy in trying to exceed our grasp, in trying to reach for something that in the end, we have to admit may in fact be unreachable!"
I don't get why Tiffany Volmer's acting gets especially attacked. To me her acting was always on par with the rest of the cast, so starting of below average and getting better as the series went on.
Super Sonic wrote:I know that he rarely speaks in this saga, but since Brad Jackson is back in the area now, would you guys want him to return as Oolong, or still want Mr. Masse?
Even though it probably won't happen, yes, yes I would want him to return. Now if only he could have been in the area when they were doing the King Cold stuff.
I really didn't like Brad Jackson's King Cold. It just felt wrong for the character. He's the "king" and he's gigantic (like seriously, look at the guy). I much prefer the deeper voice Jason Douglas gave the character. It gave him a much more commanding presence.
penguintruth wrote:For consistency's sake, I doubt they'll be replacing Massey's Oolong with Jackson's. Tiffany Vollmer could walk into the studio tomorrow and she wouldn't get her role back.
No, she better not return.
Look, I know how scary that thought is, but it was just an example.
Shhh. It's okay. She's gone now. She can't hurt us anymore.
I know, but please don't haunt me with the possibilities.
The sooner we can eradicate that horrid shrill bimbo bitch voice from our minds the better.
fadeddreams5 wrote:
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:... Haven't we already gotten these in GT? Goku dies, the DBs go away, and the Namekian DBs most likely won't be used again because of the Evil Dragons.
Goku didn't die in GT. The show sucked him off so much, it was impossible to keep him in the world of the living, so he ascended beyond mortality.
jjgp1112 wrote: Sat Jul 18, 2020 6:31 am
I'm just about done with the concept of reboots and making shows that were products of their time and impactful "new and sexy" and in line with modern tastes and sensibilities. Let stuff stay in their era and give today's kids their own shit to watch.
I always side eye the people who say "Now my kids/today's kids can experience what I did as a child!" Nigga, who gives a fuck about your childhood? You're an adult now and it was at least 15 years ago. Let the kids have their own experience instead of picking at a corpse.
That really is my biggest issue with her. Her voice always cracked when she got mad or excited, and her yelling and reactions were always shrill and phony sounding, and her voice was really whiny sounding when she attempted inflections. She was passable when the character was just talking with a normal tone, but that's really about it.
So glad Rial replaced her in Kai, and it's a shame we won't hear her in the original series, save for the DB Movie 1 dub.
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