DB Super Exciting Guide: Story

The Tori-bot · Post by **The Tori-bot** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 9:34 am

Chuquita wrote:The cover really makes me wanna say Mr. Toriyama drew it, but you never know.

I think it is him. Just look at the recent Dragon Quest games, it's exactly the same style.

JulieYBM · Post by **JulieYBM** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 1:31 pm

Must. Have. Page 64. Scan.

Err...

Great work! Might want to buy a copy of this myself, even though I cannot read it.

Post by **Herms** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 1:51 pm

JulieYBM wrote:Must. Have. Page 64. Scan.

I haven't seen a full-sized scan myself, but I asked Hujio to read off some of the numbers, and it seems to be identical to the charts in Daizenshuu 7 and Landmark.

omae no kaasan wrote:Is that so? It really has been a long time hasn't it. Years ago I would have known that from a glance. ^o^;

It is pretty confusing, since they use “EPISODE” in the section on Goku’s battles, and 其之 for the list of Toriyama’s favorite fights.

YouTube · Post by **Hujio** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 2:10 pm

Herms wrote:
JulieYBM wrote:Must. Have. Page 64. Scan.
I haven't seen a full-sized scan myself, but I asked Hujio to read off some of the numbers, and it seems to be identical to the charts in Daizenshuu 7 and Landmark.

Well, now everyone can see a full-sized scan.

JulieYBM · Post by **JulieYBM** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 2:25 pm

Ah, thanks.

If my eyes tell me the truth, Gohan is listed as a 14,000 and Kuririn a 13,000. Are these numbers from Namek? Because Vegeta seems to be listed at 3000? O.o

A proper translation would be beyond nice.

Dayspring · Post by **Dayspring** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 2:31 pm

Chibi Mystic Gohan wrote:I own a ton of things with new Toriyama art (Kanzenban, Dragon Ball Landmark/Forever). I think this cover looks waaaaaay different. For instance, the adult Gokus are really skinny.

Just compare this to the cover of Dragon Ball Forever (2004).

But Dragonball Forever was 5 years ago. Plus it still looks pretty close to the Kanzenban and NMZ5.

Post by **Herms** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 2:40 pm

JulieYBM wrote:If my eyes tell me the truth, Gohan is listed as a 14,000 and Kuririn a 13,000. Are these numbers from Namek? Because Vegeta seems to be listed at 3000? O.o

Yeah, those numbers for Kuririn and Gohan are for when Goku arrives on Planet Namek. Vegeta's battle power is given as 30,00o. There's a bit of a story behind this: in the original manga he was said to be over 20,000 when fighting Recoom, but Daizenshuu 7 (and the anime too, I think) used 30,000, then when the kanzenban were released, the original manga line was changed from 20,000 to 30,000.

Anyway, as I thought, these are all pretty much identical to the lists from Daizenshuu 7 and Landmark. The only difference is that in 7, Gohan is listed as 1~1,307 for the Raditz fight, while in Landmark he's listed simply as 1, while here he's 1~?. Also, Tsuru-sennin being at 120 and 50% Full Power Freeza being at 60 million are left out, but that seems to be it.

JulieYBM · Post by **JulieYBM** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 2:44 pm

Ah, I see. It makes sense for the Vegeta change, though, considering his battle power was 'surprisingly over 20,000' when he landed on Namek.

Wasn't Zarbon's monster form listed as 33,000 at one point or am I completely off-base?

Code: Select all

B · Post by B » Sun Mar 08, 2009 2:51 pm

What? SSJ Goku is 15,000 and 100% Freeza is 12,000, but Gohan and Krillin are both STRONGER than Freeza? I have to be reading that wrong.

Unless it's supposed to be "a million and two hundred thousand."

Cypher · Post by **Cypher** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 2:53 pm

The kanji with Kuririn and Gohan is 'man' (ten thousand) where with Goku and Freeza it's 'oku' (hundred million).

B · Post by B » Sun Mar 08, 2009 2:56 pm

Okay, but what's with the extra zero? If Vegeta is 30,000 then Gohan's says 104,000? I'm assuming it means 14,000, right?

JulieYBM · Post by **JulieYBM** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 2:58 pm

B wrote:Okay, but what's with the extra zero? If Vegeta is 30,000 then Gohan's says 104,000? I'm assuming it means 14,000, right?

Yes, it does.

Why they don't just type out the full number I'll never know...

Cypher · Post by **Cypher** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 2:59 pm

Ah, I see what you mean.
With Gohan and Kuririn, it has

1 x ten thousand (+ 4000)
1 x ten thousand (+ 3000)

For Vegeta it's

3 x ten thousand.

Not sure if that makes it any clearer, it's kinda awkward to explain ^^'

B · Post by B » Sun Mar 08, 2009 3:04 pm

That makes sense, thanks.

EDIT: I just noticed Bulma using a calculator and the following panel of the scouter exploding on her face.

Unless it's meant to be read manga-style, where the Scouter couldn't do it and she has to resort to using a calculator.

But the other way aronud is funnier to me because I'm twisted.

The Tori-bot · Post by **The Tori-bot** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 3:14 pm

B wrote:Unless it's meant to be read manga-style, where the Scouter couldn't do it and she has to resort to using a calculator.

But the other way aronud is funnier to me because I'm twisted.

Now that you mention it, it could work both ways, but I think I like the scouter -> calculator one better: at least the calculator doesn't have a chance of breaking.

JulieYBM wrote:Why they don't just type out the full number I'll never know...

Mabye to save space? Or to make it look less sloppy by not having loads of zeros cluttering up the page?

Dayspring · Post by **Dayspring** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 3:32 pm

Cypher wrote:Ah, I see what you mean.
With Gohan and Kuririn, it has

1 x ten thousand (+ 4000)
1 x ten thousand (+ 3000)

For Vegeta it's

3 x ten thousand.

Not sure if that makes it any clearer, it's kinda awkward to explain ^^'

Nope, that's a perfect answer to what's being asked.

For those still confused:
SSJ Goku = 1 x hundred million + (5,000 x ten thousand) = 150 million
Freeza = 1 x hundred million + (2,000 x ten thousand) = 120 million

I like the Gohan retcon of 1-? instead of 1-1,307, but not the Kanzenban's retcon of "over 20,000" to "over 30,000." Vegeta, Gohan, and Krillin were all flying at the same speed, implying their pre-power up strengths were more or less equal (ie: less than 13,000). Vegeta's power up being "over 20,000" when he's still powering up makes sense; it just means he's nowhere near his true unknown PL that's over 24,000. A supplemental 30,000 in the guide books is perfect, but retconning the manga is silly.

@Yuugi: Zarbon's pre-monster form PL is given in his daizenshuu bio as being 23,000 (and Dodoria's is 22,000). No info is given on Zarbon's monster form (unless Landmark has something I don't know about).

Back to the Super Exciting Guide's PLs, am I right in assuming the 10 under Bulma means the average human PL was retconed to 10? If that's the case, I hate it. It makes Pilaf-Goku look average instead of strong.

Cypher · Post by **Cypher** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 3:39 pm

Dayspring- the part with the '10' under Bulma is a 'how to use' example- just a 'here is the name, here's the power level' deal (Did they really need to have a section explaining how to use this page...? Weird)

EDIT: for completeness' sake, it basically says

'The left side is the time period, the right side is Goku's power level at that time. Power levels for other characters of the same time period have also been measured.'

Dayspring · Post by **Dayspring** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 3:51 pm

Cypher wrote:Dayspring- the part with the '10' under Bulma is a 'how to use' example- just a 'here is the name, here's the power level' deal (Did they really need to have a section explaining how to use this page...? Weird)

EDIT: for completeness' sake, it basically says

'The left side is the time period, the right side is Goku's power level at that time. Power levels for other characters of the same time period have also been measured.'

Good. I was worried because Daizenshuu 7 used 5 as the average human PL to show that Goku's Pilaf-era strength was twice the norm. Didn't think it'd be an example since the daizenshuu had an example using the number 0 or 000 as opposed to a specific random number.

Cypher · Post by **Cypher** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 4:05 pm

Yeah, I think it would have been better left as it was...
About Goku's 'twice as strong as a normal man' (which is retained on this chart as well)- I always thought that was a bit weird; I mean, surely some Olympic athletes are twice as strong/physically 'powerful' as a normal man, but they can't crush huge boulders with their bare hands or any of the other crazy stuff Goku does when we first see him...still, just another minor niggle in Toriyama's story ^^'

Bejiita · Post by **Bejiita** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 5:22 pm

The Tori-bot wrote:
Chuquita wrote:The cover really makes me wanna say Mr. Toriyama drew it, but you never know.
I think it is him. Just look at the recent Dragon Quest games, it's exactly the same style.

Toriyama did draw the cover, and the picture with Goku, Buruma and Shen Long, and also the Vegeta , Gohan and Goku one. (Those images are viewable on Kanzentai.com).

There's absolutely no question about it.