Episode #0020 (02 April 2006)

Post by **VegettoEX** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 12:59 am

Episode #0020 (download MP3)
51:18; 64 kbps, mono; 23.4 MB

Episode #0020! VegettoEX, Julian, and Meri discuss the god hierarchy in DragonBall. Which heavenly (or hellish?) entity governs which area of the universe? What religion and cultural basis do they have their roots in? Meri's list of worst parents, April's releases, and tons of e-mails round out the week. Referenced sites:

Whee! Go ahead and grab it. Big thanks to godofchaos for hosting the sexy *twenty* episodes, now.

Our topic this week is the god hierarchy in the series! The various gods, the various heavenly folk, what they are based upon in religion and culture, etc. Great stuff! Picture Enma with a lasso ripping souls out of people. That's all you need to do. Really. It's all you need to do.

Then we've got Meri's list of worst parents in the series, all of April's releases, a good batch of e-mails... whee!

AND OMG JULIAN GOT A DS! DETAILS INSIDE!

w0rd.

Post by **desirecampbell** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 1:42 am

"Unicorn!"

-edit-
Now that I've actually listened to the whole thing, I might as well put somethin' else

First thing - I (heart) April Fools! And Bablefish.

Secondly - there is no secondly! Ha!

Great Saiyaman · Post by **Great Saiyaman** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:05 am

Great Podcast guys (as always).

OK, I have a question about the Gods.....what the hell is the difference between Grand Kai & Supreme Kai? Grand Kai is referenced in the Manga by Piccolo.....he says to S.Kai "Are you the Grand Kai" & Kibito chimes in with "No, he is the S.Kai"...what's the deal?

On the note of Parenting, I think Meri is way too hard on Goku....I mean yes the guy cares a lot about fighting, but cut him some slack....yes he missed 8 years of being a father, but it's becase he was dead, it's not fair to call him a bad parent because he died. Also at the end of Z....Gohan & Goten don't really need a father.....Gohan is like 26 with a wife & Kid....& Goten is 17 so he's almost an adult.

Sebastian (SB) · Post by **Sebastian (SB)** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:51 am

I think for Son Goku's case, it's not that he wasn't a good parent he was just occupied with much other troubles as shown in DragonBall Z, I mean he was there for much of Son Gohan's early childhood years between the 5-year period after the 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai (even though Son Gohan was about 4 years old). He seemed like a good parent for much of the time he spent with Son Gohan (as shown in the TV series him fishing with Gohan,etc.) then after Gohan's teenage years towards the end of Z he pretty much just left off to train Uub, but like "Great Saiyaman" said Son Gohan was pretty much fine being on his own since he was already reaching his adulthood & being with Videl as such. As far as staying dead for that 7-8 year time period after the Cell Games, Son Goku himself states that the world would better much off without him because he has a knack of attracting villains or bad guys for being so strong. He figured it would be best for the peace of earth or the universe for that matter. I would say he was a "bad" parent for Son Goten not being there for that particular 7-8 year time period, but I wouldn't like to count that given for reasons stated above & the post being stated below. In the end, I wouldn't like to think that he's a bad parent, nor was he that great.

Great Saiyaman · Post by **Great Saiyaman** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 3:02 am

I would say he was a "bad" parent for Son Goten not being there for that 7-8 year time period, but I wouldn't like to count that given for reasons stated above. In the end, I wouldn't like to think that he's a bad parent, nor was he that great.

But he didn't know Chi-Chi was pregnent as far as we know >_>.

Also....he was around for the next 10 years of Goten's life.

sangofe · Post by **sangofe** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 3:27 am

Wow! What a pleasent surprise! I can listen to the Podcast again a Sunday morning!! Yay!! This will surely be good stuff in the background while doing dishes

Post by **VegettoEX** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 8:45 am

Great Saiyaman wrote:OK, I have a question about the Gods.....what the hell is the difference between Grand Kai & Supreme Kai? Grand Kai is referenced in the Manga by Piccolo.....he says to S.Kai "Are you the Grand Kai" & Kibito chimes in with "No, he is the S.Kai"...what's the deal?

I think the problem here is that you're referencing dub dialogue and titles. I could be wrong since I haven't seen it in a while, but I think it's a lot more clear in the original Japanese dialogue.

From what I remember, Piccolo asks if he is "Dai Kaio", to which the response is, "No, he's Kaioshin". Knowing the difference between "Kaio" and "Kaioshin", that should make a lot more sense.

It's been a LONG time since I've watched this, and it appears I don't have it on DVD. If someone could check, that'd be great. Pretty sure I'm in the right ballpark, though.

Bura · Post by **Bura** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 9:16 am

Awesome podcast, as usual. ^^ And yeah, how DID Bubbles and Gregory get there? Such a mystery... also, since almost everyone is a bad parent in DragonBall, perhaps a top 5 BEST parents would be cool?

Anyhow, great job and keep it up. ^^

DaemonCorps · Post by **DaemonCorps** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 12:11 pm

Well, I was kinda shocked at why you guys were kinda nervous-laughing when Meri "said" unicorn until Mike explained it.

Pretty interesting tpoic and hilarious top 5. I have been wondering how Chi-chi became pregnant not just once, but twice! I figured Chi-chi gave Goku some sleeping potion like in early DB with Oolong.

Now that I have aniPod nano, I can listen to this during my free period, too!

Tanooki Kuribo · Post by **Tanooki Kuribo** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 1:12 pm

Japanese translated subtitles taken straight from the "World Tournament - Black Out" DVD...

Piccolo: Perhaps Iam mistaken, but might you be...
Shin: Yes?
Piccolo: Might you be the Grand Kaio-sama?
Shin: No. No Iam not.
Kibito: He isnt the Grand Kaio. This is Kaioshin-Sama.
Piccolo: K..Kaioshin?!

Post by **VegettoEX** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 1:41 pm

Tanooki Kuribo wrote:Japanese translated subtitles taken straight from the "World Tournament - Black Out" DVD...

Piccolo: Perhaps Iam mistaken, but might you be...
Shin: Yes?
Piccolo: Might you be the Grand Kaio-sama?
Shin: No. No Iam not.
Kibito: He isnt the Grand Kaio. This is Kaioshin-Sama.
Piccolo: K..Kaioshin?!

w00t. Glad to be right on things, from time to time

. Many thanks!

Great Saiyaman · Post by **Great Saiyaman** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:21 pm

Here's the Manga Quote.

Piccolo: Are you...the Great Lord Of The Worlds?

S.Kai: No....I'm not

Kibito: He is the Lord of the Lords

Now, Piccolo must have been refering to the Grand Kai...my question is....wouldn't a Grand Kai & a Supreme Kai have the same job? Piccolo has met King Kai (Kaio-Sama) so he wouldn't think S.Kai was Kaio-sama.

Post by **desirecampbell** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:30 pm

Great Saiyaman wrote:Here's the Manga Quote.

Piccolo: Are you...the Great Lord Of The Worlds?

S.Kai: No....I'm not

Kibito: He is the Lord of the Lords

Now, Piccolo must have been refering to the Grand Kai...my question is....wouldn't a Grand Kai & a Supreme Kai have the same job? Piccolo has met King Kai (Kaio-Sama) so he wouldn't think S.Kai was Kaio-sama.

Kaio-sama would be 'Lord of Worlds', and Dai Kaio-sama would be 'Great Lord of Worlds'. Piccolo was asking if Kaioshin was Dai Kaio-sama, whom he's never met. So many similar names, so confusinf

Great Saiyaman · Post by **Great Saiyaman** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:32 pm

OK, so my question....what's the difference between Dai Daio-Same & Kaio-shin?

Super Sonic · Post by **Super Sonic** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:47 pm

Great referring to Mrs. Brief on the bad parent list.

JulieYBM · Post by **JulieYBM** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:53 pm

LOL, great pocast guys, always funny.

I think, during these past three or so months I've listened to you guys I've developed lables for everyones voice

I've got a question I'm too floppin' lazy to email so just read it for the next 'cast, well, actually it's more of a suggestion, you guys should record yourselfs reading off a Dragonball/Z/GT episode/movie/special script!! Seriously it would be really funny, EX as Roshi, and uh....Meri as Son Goku?? (Now I'm gonna' look stupid). Julian would make a good Narrator....*cough*

Post by **desirecampbell** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 3:08 pm

Great Saiyaman wrote:OK, so my question....what's the difference between Dai Daio-Same & Kaio-shin?

What we have here are two species, the Kaios and the Kaioshins.

Dai Kaioshin rules over the Kaioshin who rule over all the Kaios. Dai Kaio rules over the Kaios who rule over the four quarters of the universe. It's not clear if the Kaioshins watch over the mortal realm or if they even watch over the Kaios.

Here's a handy reference picture.

Kirbopher · Post by **Kirbopher** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 3:12 pm

VegettoEX wrote:
Tanooki Kuribo wrote:Japanese translated subtitles taken straight from the "World Tournament - Black Out" DVD...

Piccolo: Perhaps Iam mistaken, but might you be...
Shin: Yes?
Piccolo: Might you be the Grand Kaio-sama?
Shin: No. No Iam not.
Kibito: He isnt the Grand Kaio. This is Kaioshin-Sama.
Piccolo: K..Kaioshin?!
w00t. Glad to be right on things, from time to time . Many thanks!

Thankfully the dub had a very close translation to that convo as well, including Piccolo's explanation in his own mind o,o

Post by **VegettoEX** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 3:17 pm

desirecampbell summed it up pretty well. The image is a good help.

There is a "Kami" for each planet (well, we don't really know this... but let's go ahead and make the assumption for easy clarification below).

Each galaxy (and therefore multiple "Kami"; there are tons of planets within a galaxy) are governed by a single Kaio.

There are four galaxies, and therefore four Kaio. These four Kaio are overseen by a single "Dai Kaio".

ABOVE THE KAIO are a group of gods called the "Kaioshin". What's in debate here is whether or not a single Kaioshin is given a set of Kaio to govern, or if a single Kaioshin governs a single Kaio.

Perhaps there are multiple Dai Kaio (and therefore multiple groups of even North/South/East/West Kaio?), and each of the four Kaioshin are to govern them?

But hey, since there's only one Kaioshin left, it doesn't seem to matter much

.

Ya' know what, there's a god hierarchy chart in daizenshuu #4. I'm gonna take a break from AMV editing and scan/translate this

.

Kirbopher · Post by **Kirbopher** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 4:06 pm

Good stuff as usual. I guess it made sense for Chris Rager to play both Mr. Satan and King Yema in the dub if it was the same case in the Japanese version, clever. The screeching at the end made me laugh :b

Also, I haven't seen most of this in the manga, but since the Afterworld Tournament was filler, was the whole deal with the 4 Kais and the Grand Kai made a lot more prevalent in the anime only? Same thing applies to East Surpreme Kai's explanation of how Kid Buu went around killing them all, that was in the anime only as well, wasn't it?

Kanzenshuu

Episode #0020 (02 April 2006)

Episode #0020 (02 April 2006)

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