Best DBZ fighting game

[DBZAOTA482]

For a series based around fighting, there haven't been too many fighting games based on it that were exactly stellar... but which attempts do you think was the best?

Spoiler:

If you know me you'd know I would go with the Budokai series. Super Dragon Ball Z is a great fighting game but it didn't really feel like a DBZ fighter and Budokai Tenkaichi is probably the best at emulating the action of the series but isn't really that great of a fighting game despite the steep learning curve. Budokai, on the other hand, felt like the best middle-ground between functionally and accessibility. Deep, but still capturing a lot of the flash and flair you'd expect of a DBZ fighter.

However, the series didn't truly become good till Budokai 3. Despite some accusations of being a haven for button-mashing, B3 was commonly revered as a quality fighter regardless of it's license and became a major influence for future DBZ games. Shin Budokai, Burst Limit, and Infinite World then followed it spiritually by expanding on the standards set by B3.

[sangofe]

What do you count as fighting games? Some people call the Sparking games "DBZ simulators", others fighting, for example.

I'd say DBZ Legends on Saturn and PS1 is my favorite, even though it's hard to classify.

Then DBZ Budokai 3 on PS2 is damn good.

Some like Super DBZ on PS2, but I never got into that because I can never learn fighting commands... (or any button combination for the matter).

The last Sparking game was nice, too.

Perhaps my favorite next after DBZ Legends, is DBZ Burst Limit.

[Note: I never really played the psp games games or 3ds games, but I hear there's a good fighting game that resembles dbz legends there?].

[Nejishiki]

I'm more fond of the RPGs the franchise has provided, but I do recall enjoying Burst Limit for the PS3 if that counts.

[TheatreStyleKai]

At the moment Xenoverse is my favorite Dragon Ball game by far, in spite of its flaws. Although Budokai 3 may be technically a better game over all, partly because it plays almost like a traditional fighter and was much more polished. It's a very close tie between the two of them for me.

[DBZAOTA482]

At the moment Xenoverse is my favorite Dragon Ball game by far, in spite of its flaws. Although Budokai 3 may be technically a better game over all, partly because it plays almost like a traditional fighter and was much more polished. It's a very close tie between the two of them for me.

Budokai is hardly anything like a traditional fighter.

[MCDaveG]

In terms of gameplay, Budokai series.

[Kunzait_83]

Budokai is hardly anything like a traditional fighter.

Its a helluva lot closer compared to its immediate contemporary Sparking/Budokai Tenkaichi at least.

For best "traditional" fighter, my top 3 (in no particular order) are Dragon Ball Z 2: Super Battle (2nd arcade game), Hyper Dimension on SNES, or Super Dragon Ball Z (PS2-era game).

For "DBZ Simulators", my non-ordered top 3 are DBZ Legends on Saturn, Idainaru Son Goku Densetsu on PC Engine, or Budokai Tenkaichi 3/Sparking Meteor.

I've long held that the Budokai (non-Tenkaichi) series is complete and utter garbage. I've always been totally mystified by its immense popularity. Almost did a huge write up ripping that whole series to shreds once upon a time a ways back.

[Quebaz]

Pre-post warning: I've included some high-level play and combo videos of the games I mentioned to ilustrate my points, please watch them to get a better understanding of what I'm talking about and because some of them are also super entertaining.

Tricky tricky question, we're in 2016 and just on fighting games alone, Dragon Ball has a huge list of them with varying types of gameplay that when put back to back makes some hard to judge against another, just on the 3D Fighter alone, the Budokai games play nothing like Super DBZ and on the 2D side, something like Hyper Dimension plays nothing like Extreme Butouden and so on.

With that said, we can judge all these games based on 2 things. 1: How good the gameplay mechanics are. 2: How these mechanics (when used properly) make the fights feel like the show.

For the most part, the majority of highly regarded games succeed in atleast one of those things, Hyper Dimension is good in that it's a solid fighter for the SNES (if not a little broken due to 100% stun combos and frametraps) but it lacks some of that over-the-top action from the same time period that the game represents. Extreme Butouden while being a bit simplier than HD manages to find a good balance between being a good fighter and also at representing the Dragon Ball fights on a 2D plane, (but dear god is it broken as balls due to the assists), so I can guess you could say that Extreme Butouden is a better DBZ fighting game than Hyper Dimension.

Budokai, on the other hand, felt like the best middle-ground between functionally and accessibility. Deep, but still capturing a lot of the flash and flair you'd expect of a DBZ fighter.

I completely disagree with this notion because unless you're spamming Dragon Rush and special moves 24/7, the Budokai series have almost nothing in common with the DBZ fights, IMO, High-Level Play of Budokai 3 is a uninsteresting happy-slaps fest up to eleven due the combo system (which is the most un-DBZ thing by the way) being the only thing that really matters with the neutral game being non-existant (specially in Infinite World with P+K being so dominant, along with other issues like specials moves only serving as combo finishers/filler). To make things worse they were finally starting to mix things up in Shin Budokai 2 with finally getting rid of P+K system and introducing the Aura Burst and all of its variations, you finally had more options in the fight (both offensively and defensively) than just aproaching and spamming jab only to discard most of the improvements in Burst Limit and IW.

As for the Tenkaichi/Sparking games, my opinion of them changed drastically over the years as I've started to understand how they really work. They aren't traditional fighters in any way, shape, or form but IMO that's the best thing that you can say about them. While the character roster isn't as varied as we'd like, the actual mechanics starting from Tenkaichi 2 add so much depth to the whole thing because of how good and fast the movement is, things like quick-stopping/rising/descending to move around your opponent, stepping-in to avoid a Rush Super, manual dashing instead of auto-dashing to get a normal hit during a pursuit instead of send-away blow, etc. are all interesting things that add up and man, it looks great in action. It may not have the most varied roster or the best combo system, but the freedom it gives you can't be surpassed, making it a great multiplayer experience.

PS: the Raging Blast games are a joke and it's ridiculous how they butched up the movement system as much as they did compared to the Sparking entries and while the offensive additions are nice (and the cancel/chain system in RB2 is pretty neat), they feel like a slog compared to BT3.

But you guys know me and of course I had to talk about Super DBZ in this thread. This one for me is the best, it takes some basic cues from traditinal 2D fighters (inputs,basic combo-system) and mixes it up by adding a lot of DBZ-flair creating a unique good experience, in a way, It's pretty much like Pokken Tournament in that it takes the premise from other well-known fighters, simplifies it and adds its own spin to make it unique.

Super Dragon Ball Z is a great fighting game but it didn't really feel like a DBZ fighter

Again, I completely disagree with you because Super DBZ is IMO the best representation of the best parts of DBZ fights on a 2.5D/3D plane in that there's going to be a lot of close quarters combat but you have to lookout for all the energy attacks as well, with no breaks in the action, and unlike the Budokai games, there's a consistent neutral game (first match illustrates my point) with jump-ins, the different dash-ins and pursuits serving as mix-ups to the ordinary melee attacks as offensive options and parrying (with it's own limitations otherwise it would make Supers useless) on the defensive side to keep things flowing, even the combo system while sure, a bit wierd and sometimes repetitive (take note that some of these would never happen in a real match) still do resemble something out of DBZ with all the flying and jumping around in them. Also, it is super hype.

TL;DR: You can't go wrong with Super DBZ and Tenkaichi 3.

[Kunzait_83]

As for the Tenkaichi/Sparking games, my opinion of them changed drastically over the years as I've started to understand how they really work. They aren't traditional fighters in any way, shape, or form but IMO that's the best thing that you can say about them. While the character roster isn't as varied as we'd like, the actual mechanics starting from Tenkaichi 2 add so much depth to the whole thing because of how good and fast the movement is, things like quick-stopping/rising/descending to move around your opponent, stepping-in to avoid a Rush Super, manual dashing instead of auto-dashing to get a normal hit during a pursuit instead of send-away blow, etc. are all interesting things that add up and man, it looks great in action. It may not have the most varied roster or the best combo system, but the freedom it gives you can't be unsurpassed, making it a great multiplayer experience.

Something I've tried to convey before on here in the past I think. The Sparking games (at least the latter two: the first almost plays like an unfinished demo of what the second two would end up going for) are actually pretty good and in some circles are very underestimated for how much depth of play they actually have (in their range of movement and in their very unique little combo system). But part of the issue is that a lot of people seem to mistakenly compare them to traditional fighting games, when clearly they're ANYTHING but.

Much like Legends on the 32 bit systems, Sparking doesn't really fit comfortably into ANY standard genre classification: its why, like the Legends games, I've always maintained that "DBZ Simulator" is the best label to tag them under. They're not trying to be anything even vaguely close to Street Fighter or King of Fighters or Tekken or Virtua Fighter or what have you: they're trying to replicate the hyper fast, free flying style of fighting of the anime while still being a playable game. In that the second two Sparking games more than succeed, particularly the third which is by far and away the most refined of the series.

And yes, Raging Blast utterly decimated the gameplay on a curiously very basic-most level, almost like it was trying to "fix" everything about the Sparking games that was never actually broken to begin with.

The Budokai games meanwhile ARE trying to be closer to a "traditional" fighting game by comparison: and they end up being immensely boring and underwhelming ones. There's just NO real meat to any of the gameplay, there's no real combo system to speak of ("slap fights" are a very good way of describing how they work: it almost feels like a primitive pre-Street Fighter II fighting game in that poking is almost all there is to how the "fighting system" actually works), and they instead rely HEAVILY on shallow, obvious gimmicks (Dragon Rush being the most egregious offender) and "content" in the form of pointless unlockables and extraneous game modes*, to distract the player from noticing how there's absolutely no "there" there to any of the core game itself.

Like them all you want, but I find that calling them "deep" is just flat out, demonstrably incorrect. Take away the bells & whistles, and Budokai would be absolutely, mercilessly (and much deservedly) laughed at in ANY discussion about fighting games. The Sparking games, by contrast, don't really belong in that discussion at all in the first place: and when you get past the maddeningly pointless "unlocking crap" aspect of it (which I still hold as a negative against it: downloading a "completed game" save is a must), there's still SOME actual shred of substance (however unconventional) to the gameplay.


*Seriously, if I have one TOWERING pet peeve about mid-2000s PS2-era fighting games, its when they so often tried to paper over their lack of a decent core fighting game with a myriad of mini games and a "shop" system filled to the brim with unlockable crap: unlockable crap that was so often also incredibly basic-most stuff that should IN NO WAY have to be cordoned off from the player as an unlockable in the first place, and by doing so is such an obvious blaring neon sign to the player that you're desperately trying to cover over the fact that you have no actual core fighting game that's interesting in any way at all underneath. "Grab Bag Fighting Games" or "Chex Mix Fighting Games" I used to call them back in the day, and still do.

The Budokai series were some of the very worst offenders of this, along with the PS2-era Mortal Kombat games and even some of that era's Soul Calibur games to an extent, among others. A lot of fighting games from that time period pulled this shit, almost like it was their way of trying desperately to appeal to a console RPG/Adventure Game oriented audience with almost no experience with or familiarity with fighting games (giving them "quests" to complete and "goals" to attain), an audience that had no experience with and no interest in a purely competitive, skill-oriented gameplay experience, and its one of my single least favorite aspects of one of my single least favorite eras of gaming in general.

By contrast, its kinda funny that the trends and winds of the fighting genre has swung SO far back to the polar opposite extreme now since 2007-ish or so, that now we're at a point where we get a Street Fighter V that is literally NOTHING but pure substantive core fighting game and almost NOTHING ELSE besides. Sure I'd like SOME manner of whipped cream or toppings to go with the actual pie (so long as the metaphorical pie in question here is actually any good to start with), but if we're gonna be doing one far-off extreme of a spectrum on "core gameplay substance to bells & whistles" ratio vs the other, I'd much rather it be this than the alternative of 10/13 years back where it was all mini games, alternate modes, and unlocks and next to no core fighting game that's worth a damn.

TL;DR: You can't go wrong with Super DBZ and Tenkaichi 3.

Word.

[DBZAOTA482]

Budokai 3 got a page on the Shoryuken wiki and IIRC they don't accept just any fighting game there.

I agree the 3D Mortal Kombat games are garbage fighting games though.

[theoriginalbilis]

Hmmm...

I dig Super Dragon Ball Z an awful lot.

Budokai 3/Tenkaichi 3 are also pretty damn entertaining IMO.

Of the most recent generation of Dragon Ball games, I really dig Xenoverse, but I'll admit the mechanics and gameplay are way more simplistic and exploitable than most of the older gen games.

[Captain-Sora]

And yes, Raging Blast utterly decimated the gameplay on a curiously very basic-most level, almost like it was trying to "fix" everything about the Sparking games that was never actually broken to begin with.

It's because the game was made from the ground up instead of being built up off of previous assets, but with little time and money given to refine and make the title actually playable. RB1 was just there to re-establish everything again on the new generation of consoles at the time, with sequels being where the real meat would lie. However, what was re-established was so blatantly rushed and broken, that not even RB2 felt all that more polished and balanced. Both installments are just insanely clunky and downright FEEL annoying to play, because they're just THAT rushed and cheap.

[ZeroAnnihilated]

Stuff...

I'll try to find time to respond to this if no one else does. I respect the opinion and you seem like an intelligent person, so I think this could actually turn into a good conversation. What is your ideal fighting game?

[Lord Beerus]

Budokai 3 got a page on the Shoryuken wiki and IIRC they don't accept just any fighting game there.

Super Dragon Ball Z and Dragon Ball Z: Hyper Dimension also have a page on the Shoryuken wiki.

[ZeroAnnihilated]

Stuff...

I would like to address the question of where DBZ games belong in regards to fighting games. To ensure relatable comprehension with my response, I'll try to approach the question the simplest way I can, and limit examples to that of the Budokai and Tenkaichi series. Those of you who feel it necessary to categorize Infinite World, Shin Budokai (& SBAR), and Burst Limit as Budokai subs, please feel free, but I advise you not to allow such similarities bind you to universal definition. Each of these games brings something unique to the table, it's important to recognize this lest we undermine the validity of the argument.

Dragon Ball Z games are very unique, but when we consider the very nature of the games - what is expected from the player - it is clear that the only criteria worthy of reference belongs to the fighting game genre. I do understand that upon counting the differences, the average player may feel compelled to resort to the default label "DBZ Simulator," but I believe this is taking the easy way out. Quite in fact, this label has been used many times by the stereotypical traditional fighter/Budokai enthusiast as an attempt to trivialize any/all value the games bring to the conversation, for they are not recognized as worthy of being in the same discussion as the highly regarded Street Fighter, Tekken, MvC, and other siblings. What better way to neutralize the argument of Tenkaichi being a worthy fighter, if you can convince the public that it isn't a "fighter" at all? I've seen enough to know otherwise, and the Depth Series is my response to this false claim.

Ultimately, recognizing Tenkaichi's unique mechanical construct is vital in deciding where it stands as a fighter... for it is NOT a traditional fighter, but it clearly covers the acceptable criteria of a fighting game. What makes this game so hard to place stems from the fact that it possesses traits that are not easily recognizable in most fighting games. The same can be said about the first time the side-step was implemented into fighting games. The first time juggles and cancels were implemented. The first time aerial combat and flight was implemented. The first time the parry and counter stance was implemented. The issue here is not that Tenkaichi lacks what it takes to stand as a fighting game, but that it has too much, and not everyone can handle/accept it.

Once the top layer is discarded to uncover the vast depth of the game, calling Tenkaichi a "DBZ Simulator" instead of a high paced, skill demanding monster of a competitive outlet is the same as calling Super Smash Brothers Melee a "Party" game. This label may even describe what the game was SUPPOSED to be, but it is not what defines the game for what it truly is. The advanced movement, defense, and offense of Tenkaichi gaming cannot easily be compared with traditional fighters because the game is mechanically an "evolved" fighting game in many aspects of the genre. The deeper one submerges him/herself into the mechanics of the games, the more one finds this to be true. I've been playing Tenkaichi 2 since 2006, but my skills are NOT just a culmination of a decade of Tenkaichi gaming, they are a culmination of 25 years of fighting games. Such experience includes that of the mid 2000's Mortal Kombats and Soul Caliburs as well. I don't discriminate, because each game has made me more dangerous. There's something to take away from each of them.

Quotational variant..."Semantics - Food of the wise man, liquor of the fool."

Heh, dare I prove a victim of irony...

The Tenkaichi games are fighting games and... in more aspects than one, stand above traditional fighters.

About Budokai not having a real combo system to speak of... there are many great Budokai 3 players that have proven this to be false. The top two that come to mind are TheSaiyanJin2 and UnderlordTico. They both have top level YouTube channels, I'm surprised to read someone's comment about Budokai lacking combo capability.

[Bansho64]

Burst Limit was my favorite. It had fantastic graphics and I loved the fighting system. It's a shame it didn't have anything after the Cell Games though.

[sangofe]

Burst Limit was my favorite. It had fantastic graphics and I loved the the fighting system. It's a shame it didn't have anything after the Cell Games.

Fixed for you.

[Bansho64]

Burst Limit was my favorite. It had fantastic graphics and I loved the the fighting system. It's a shame it didn't have anything after the Cell Games.

Fixed for you.

Oh yeah sorry about that. I fixed it. Thanks!

[Lord Beerus]

Burst Limit was my favorite. It had fantastic graphics and I loved the fighting system. It's a shame it didn't have anything after the Cell Games though.

Burst Limit is such an underrated classic in the DB video game library. I really wanted to see a sequel to that.

[DBZAOTA482]

Budokai 3 got a page on the Shoryuken wiki and IIRC they don't accept just any fighting game there.

Super Dragon Ball Z and Dragon Ball Z: Hyper Dimension also have a page on the Shoryuken wiki.

I know... it was just a response to Kunzait_83's statement that Budokai would be ridiculed harshly without all the fanservice by the FGC and I brought up Budokai 3's wiki page to show that at least considerable amount of people see it as a legit fighter.