Goku and Gohan's relationship

[Bansho64]

Gohan's relationship with Goku throughout the series is a bit of an enigma of sorts. We've seen them be as close as possible and then drift off to being a bit like acquaintances more than family. I know Dragon Ball has never had the biggest focus on relationships but it had a pretty good thing going on between the two for a while. The movies did it even more so. Sorry for the rambling but what I meant for this thread to be was a discussion of their relationship with each other.

[Lord Beerus]

Goku sees Gohan, and by extension the rest of his family, as more like allies than actual "family". Toriyama has even made several comments about how Saiyans don't really understand the deep relationship among family members:

Normally, Saiyans don’t have much of a notion of romance or marriage, and apart from the royal family of Vegeta, they aren’t particular about blood-relationships.

Saiyans don’t have much of a concept of “family”.

Specifically in regards to Gohan, I think Goku views him as more of a sparring partner than a son.

[Vijay]

Gohan is a very respectful kid/boy

That being said, the actual "Father-Son" relationship have always been Piccolo & Gohan imo

Gohan views his Dad like a Demi God. Sure, he calls him "Otou-san". But if you remove that link or word, Gohan's admiration & respect for Goku goes beyond regular "Oyaji" sentiment & comes off more like crazed fanboy

Take Future Gohan for example. We wore Goku's gi. He talks about Goku's greatness to Future Trunks while resting post-training. Hell, even monologues about how he wishes he could live on strong-willed just like his Dad in facing ruthless Androids

Or Boo Arc Gohan. Realizing how terribly he has slacked in his training, (post sensing Goku's SSJ3 in Kaioshin Realm), he used his Dad as tool of motivation to master the Z-sword

To be frank, as soon as Goku touches down at Kaoishin Realm & informs everyone abt the whole event unfolded on Earth, Gohan's performance spiked incredibly. He swirled the Z-sword which he was panting just to get a grip few chapters before, confident as hell abt Z-sword slicin Katchin "like a tofu", calls Z-sword as overrated after it breaks.

The fact he requested Kibito to customize his gi similar to his Dad's before going off to fight Boo speaks volume about Gohan's crazy admiration for Goku

Goes waay beyond superficial Oyaji-musko relationship imo

[DBZAOTA482]

Gohan is the golden child... but with his lack of training Goku is clearly let down.

[MozillaVulpix]

I think the real conflict between Goku and Gohan's relationship was when Goku was unable to realise that Gohan (like everyone else in the world), isn't always like him. Goku used to treat Gohan just like he'd treat himself, which is definitely a sign of respect from him, but it didn't always work out. Eg: Goku thinks Gohan is going to be willing and actually excited to fight Cell.

He tells his son to train with him because he thinks that's what his son wants, because that's what he'd want, if he was in that situation.

It's not until the Cell fight that he has the realisation (after some grilling from Piccolo) that Gohan is his own person. And, conveniently enough, the next time they interact, it's been 7 years and Gohan has stopped training.

I mean, he's probably still a little disappointed that Gohan isn't as strong as he could be, but at that point, he understands his son well enough to know he can't force him to be something he's not.

...and that's my 2 cents

[TheBlackPaladin]

You know, for all the flack that Goku gets for being a "deadbeat dad"--which, don't get me wrong, is not entirely unjustified--there were a lot of times in the series where they were separated by circumstances rather than by choice. Goku didn't choose for Raditz to come along and wreak havoc, nor did he choose to get so horribly injured in his fight with Vegeta (in effect forcing Gohan and Kuririn to go to Namek without him), and he did not choose to get stranded in space for a bit after Namek blew up. The first time he "chose" to be away from Gohan was after Cell's defeat, and even then, it seemed that was out of consideration for his loved ones, because he noted that his being on Earth is what indirectly summoned a lot of the things and people that almost got his family (and, for that matter, the whole planet) killed.

Now that I'm thinking about it, there were periods of years where Goku got to spend quality time with Gohan (from his birth until the arrival of Raditz, from his arrival back on Earth until the arrival of the Androids, the Room of Spirit and Time training for the fight with Cell, etc.), but Toriyama just didn't seem to focus on them a whole lot. It'd be interesting to see some more "slice of life" episodes where they focused solely on that.

For that matter, if Raditz had never come down to Earth and set so many bad things into motion, I wonder how different Goku's life, Gohan's life--and for that matter, the Son family's life--would have been. Kinda sad to think about, actually...they might have been a perfectly happy family, had s*** not gone south so early in Gohan's life. That would have been an interesting wish to present to Shenlong..."I wish Raditz never arrived on Earth."

[dbzfan7]

Goku sees Gohan, and by extension the rest of his family, as more like allies than actual "family". Toriyama has even made several comments about how Saiyans don't really understand the deep relationship among family members:

Normally, Saiyans don’t have much of a notion of romance or marriage, and apart from the royal family of Vegeta, they aren’t particular about blood-relationships.

Saiyans don’t have much of a concept of “family”.

Specifically in regards to Gohan, I think Goku views him as more of a sparring partner than a son.

Just let it sink in that Bardock treats his family, more like a family, than Goku. Just let that sink in.

[Kamiccolo9]

and he did not choose to get stranded in space for a bit after Namek blew up.

Actually, he did. They wished for Goku to be transported back to Earth after the Freeza fight, and Goku refused.

[TheBlackPaladin]

and he did not choose to get stranded in space for a bit after Namek blew up.

Actually, he did. They wished for Goku to be transported back to Earth after the Freeza fight, and Goku refused.

....Oh. Right. Forgot about that. Never mind then, he's a deadbeat dad.

EDIT: But actually, hold on a sec...even if that's the case, he was scrambling to find a spaceship before Namek blew up. Now I'm questioning my memory (and of my favorite arc, no less! ). Did he ever say why he didn't want to be brought back to Earth yet?

[Kamiccolo9]

and he did not choose to get stranded in space for a bit after Namek blew up.

Actually, he did. They wished for Goku to be transported back to Earth after the Freeza fight, and Goku refused.

....Oh. Right. Forgot about that. Never mind then, he's a deadbeat dad.

EDIT: But actually, hold on a sec...even if that's the case, he was scrambling to find a spaceship before Namek blew up. Now I'm questioning my memory (and of my favorite arc, no less! ). Did he ever say why he didn't want to be brought back to Earth yet?

Yup. They wished for him to be brought back to life, Shenron said "nope, he's not dead," then they wished to transport him back to Earth, and the dragon's like "Yeah, he said 'nuh-uh.'" Goku actively refused to come back.

[TheBlackPaladin]

...and the dragon's like "Yeah, he said 'nuh-uh.'" Goku actively refused to come back.

Right, what I was asking was if we ever found out why he refused. Was it ever stated why? It's embarrassing to me that I can't recall such vital details of my favorite arc, but I'm really struggling to remember if we ever found out why he didn't want to come back.

[ABED]

Goku was unable to realise that Gohan (like everyone else in the world), isn't always like him.

This is untrue. People keep cherry picking Piccolo's line and disregarding Goku understanding that Gohan wants to become a scholar, but Cell needs to be dealt with first. He understands Gohan isn't him.

He tells his son to train with him because he thinks that what his son wants, because that's what he'd want, if he was in that situation.

And if you watch the show, it WAS what he wanted. Gohan was eager to train with his father and Piccolo.

Specifically in regards to Gohan, I think Goku views him as more of a sparring partner than a son.

That's not fair. He has strong feelings for the people he's close to.

Just let it sink in that Bardock treats his family, more like a family, than Goku. Just let that sink in.

Huh? From what little we saw, in the TV special, he wants nothing to do with his newborn son. It's not until he sees that Goku will confront Freeza that he shows any pride in him. People take this "Goku sucks as a father" to ridiculous levels. I love the relationship between Gohan and Piccolo but don't romanticize it and say they were closer than Goku and Gohan ever were.

[Kuririn Fan]

...and the dragon's like "Yeah, he said 'nuh-uh.'" Goku actively refused to come back.

Right, what I was asking was if we ever found out why he refused. Was it ever stated why? It's embarrassing to me that I can't recall such vital details of my favorite arc, but I'm really struggling to remember if we ever found out why he didn't want to come back.

Um, he was busy learning the most helpful technique ever?

[JulieYBM]

I forget where this was stated, but did not Gokuu promise to take Gohan fishing once? I could have sworn that was something they did to gether regularly.

[Kuririn Fan]

I forget where this was stated, but did not Gokuu promise to take Gohan fishing once? I could have sworn that was something they did to gether regularly.

Yeah, before he fought Vegeta. And they went fishing in that filler before Cell Games.

[Cipher]

It actually seems to have taken a fairly realistic arc. Gohan has plenty of moments as a kid when he's enormously proud of his dad, and vice versa, especially once Gohan starts adventuring. They're close during the Cell arc when circumstances see them training for battle together (though they're both getting vastly different things out of it). In the Boo arc, Gohan wants to make his dad proud, but it's obvious he's been interested in things other than fighting during the last seven years, and things progress from there.

At this point (Super), it's obvious they both still respect each other greatly, but Goku's not much of a family man and the two have completely different interests. I think Gohan realizes this.

I forget where this was stated, but did not Gokuu promise to take Gohan fishing once? I could have sworn that was something they did to gether regularly.

He did, just before he went off to fight Vegeta alone in the Saiyan arc. According to at least the anime, he finally made good on this promise during the ten-day waiting period before the Cell Games (though it seems a little unlikely they never did anything recreational together during the three years they were training with Piccolo for the Androids).

EDIT -- Beaten.

[DBZAOTA482]

I forget where this was stated, but did not Gokuu promise to take Gohan fishing once? I could have sworn that was something they did to gether regularly.

Yeah... and Toriyama said Goku only viewed his family as an afterthought.

[ABED]

I forget where this was stated, but did not Gokuu promise to take Gohan fishing once? I could have sworn that was something they did to gether regularly.

Yeah... and Toriyama said Goku only viewed his family as an afterthought.

While it's true that he says that, it's a bit hyperbolic, don't you think? He stayed with his family for 5 full years and even though he could've learned more techniques from the Yardratians, he came home after a year.

[Cipher]

On this real quick:

He tells his son to train with him because he thinks that what his son wants, because that's what he'd want, if he was in that situation.

And if you watch the show, it WAS what he wanted. Gohan was eager to train with his father and Piccolo.

Gohan totally wants to train with Goku (and Piccolo, before the Androids arrive), but his wants are 1: to help, since he's super-powerful, and 2: to be close to Goku.

Those are different motivations from Goku's pure love of challenge and fighting, which is why Piccolo calls Goku out for his somewhat wrong-headed approach at the Cell Games.

[ABED]

On this real quick:

He tells his son to train with him because he thinks that what his son wants, because that's what he'd want, if he was in that situation.

And if you watch the show, it WAS what he wanted. Gohan was eager to train with his father and Piccolo.

Gohan totally wants to train with Goku (and Piccolo, before the Androids arrive), but his wants are 1: to help, since he's super-powerful, and 2: to be close to Goku.

Those are different motivations from Goku's pure love of challenge and fighting, which is why Piccolo calls Goku out for his somewhat wrong-headed approach at the Cell Games.

Neither point detracts from mine. It was never stated that Goku thought Gohan wanted to help because he loved a good fight, he just thought Gohan might want to train with him, which was true. Again with that darn Piccolo line. Everyone points to that line, but why is everyone assuming that Goku thinks that or that Piccolo knows what Gohan was thinking? And why does everyone miss Goku's line? He knows Gohan wants to be a scholar.