Is it called Rose or Rosé?

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GodVegetto91
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Is it called Rose or Rosé?

Post by GodVegetto91 » Thu Sep 01, 2016 4:12 pm

How exactly was it spelled? I heard people saying Rosé because it's an alcoholic beverage which seems to support the theory some have of Black actually being a God of Destruction..

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Re: Is it called Rose or Rosé?

Post by Soppa Saia People » Thu Sep 01, 2016 4:15 pm

Lol, I thought it was Roze.
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Re: Is it called Rose or Rosé?

Post by DragonBallFoodie » Thu Sep 01, 2016 4:51 pm

I think it can be spelled however you want. I go with the flower name myself.

But that's another clue as to Black Goku's identity.
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Re: Is it called Rose or Rosé?

Post by Ajay » Thu Sep 01, 2016 4:53 pm

As I understand it, it's Rosé like the drink.

ロ - Ro
ゼ - Ze

Rose, as in the flower, would be ローズ - Rōzu.

So it'd be better to use Rosé to avoid confusion.
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Re: Is it called Rose or Rosé?

Post by FortuneSSJ » Thu Sep 01, 2016 5:00 pm

Even if it's Rosé, the symbolism of Black Rose is too good to ignore. It can still work both ways.
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Re: Is it called Rose or Rosé?

Post by Anime Kitten » Thu Sep 01, 2016 5:24 pm

It's Rosé. It's actually pronounced that way in the episode, so we've got the official confirmation. :P
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Re: Is it called Rose or Rosé?

Post by Cetra » Thu Sep 01, 2016 7:14 pm

Considering the way it is pronounced is exactly what the flower is pronounced in German ...

An "é" might give the impression of an e that can be too long, though.
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Re: Is it called Rose or Rosé?

Post by Herms » Fri Sep 02, 2016 2:09 am

As Ajay said, it's written in Japanese as ロゼ/roze, pronounced as "ro-zay". We've known this from Day 1, back when we simply had an unconfirmed episode title mentioning the form's name. There was never any question that this would be the way characters would pronounce it on the show, in Japanese. The only question for us then is how to write and pronounce it in English.

Generally speaking, ロゼ/roze is used in Japanese to refer to Rosé wine, a name which ultimately derives from the French word for "pink" (the wine is named after its distinctive pink color). The English word for the flower is generally written ローズ/rōzu. That's how things typically are, as Ajay already noted.

However, the annoying thing is that it's not always that simple. Sometimes in Japanese they will use ロゼ/roze when they're clearly meaning the flower. It's rare, but it happens.

The big example of this, in my mind anyway, is the Digimon Rosemon, who is quite blatantly based off the rose flower, yet whose name is still written ロゼモン/Rozemon (pronounced "Ro-zay mon"). An interesting recent instance is the game Rose and the Old Castle of Twillight, where you play as a weird girl with a rose flower attached to her body. In Japanese, her name is written ロゼ/Roze, even though again it's pretty clear she's named for the flower and not the wine. In both these examples, the English localizations have opted to use "Rose" rather than "Rosé".

So, there's still a chance this new Super Saiyan form is named after the flower, in which case it would make sense to write and pronounce it the same way as the flower in English. On the flipside, if it were confirmed to be named after the wine, then spelling and pronouncing it Rosé in English would make sense.

At this point in time, all the information we have is Black's dialogue in DBS ep.56, where he says he'll name his form something in keeping with Goku and co.'s naming style. From this, it seems that the name is meant as a counterpart to "Super Saiyan Blue", taking it right back to how rosé is French for "pink".

I should probably have a conclusion of some kind here, but instead I'll just note that Rosé Thomas from Fullmetal Alchemist and Rose from Tales of Zestiria are likewise both ロゼ/Roze in Japanese, even though the English versions of those two properties opted to handle the name in different ways.
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Re: Is it called Rose or Rosé?

Post by Deathbringer » Fri Sep 02, 2016 5:05 pm

So does that maybe mean that, even though most Super Saiyan forms use English words ("Super", "One, Two, Three", "God", "Blue") Black has used a French word to go against the norm?

I mean I know that the characters don't actually acknowledge the fact that throughout the entire series they've all been using a weird mixture of English and Japanese words so this couldn't possibly function as an in-universe explanation.

Now I just need to learn how to type an e with an accent on a keyboard...

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Re: Is it called Rose or Rosé?

Post by Anime Kitten » Fri Sep 02, 2016 5:09 pm

Deathbringer wrote:Now I just need to learn how to type an e with an accent on a keyboard...
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Re: Is it called Rose or Rosé?

Post by Pantalones » Fri Sep 02, 2016 6:41 pm

ALT+0233 also works for é. Though I'm sure that everyone who's ever been into Pokémon knows at least one of the two ways to do make the é, what with all the "Poké-somethings" there (Pokémon, Pokéballs, Pokédex, Poké Flute... the list goes on and on.) XD

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Re: Is it called Rose or Rosé?

Post by Anime Kitten » Fri Sep 02, 2016 6:56 pm

I wish you could do ō on the keyboard, but it's impossible. (Zen'ō, Toyotarō, etc.)

So, uh... back on-topic somehow. Rosé!
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Re: Is it called Rose or Rosé?

Post by GodVegetto91 » Sat Sep 03, 2016 12:55 am

Herms wrote:As Ajay said, it's written in Japanese as ロゼ/roze, pronounced as "ro-zay". We've known this from Day 1, back when we simply had an unconfirmed episode title mentioning the form's name. There was never any question that this would be the way characters would pronounce it on the show, in Japanese. The only question for us then is how to write and pronounce it in English.

Generally speaking, ロゼ/roze is used in Japanese to refer to Rosé wine, a name which ultimately derives from the French word for "pink" (the wine is named after its distinctive pink color). The English word for the flower is generally written ローズ/rōzu. That's how things typically are, as Ajay already noted.

However, the annoying thing is that it's not always that simple. Sometimes in Japanese they will use ロゼ/roze when they're clearly meaning the flower. It's rare, but it happens.

The big example of this, in my mind anyway, is the Digimon Rosemon, who is quite blatantly based off the rose flower, yet whose name is still written ロゼモン/Rozemon (pronounced "Ro-zay mon"). An interesting recent instance is the game Rose and the Old Castle of Twillight, where you play as a weird girl with a rose flower attached to her body. In Japanese, her name is written ロゼ/Roze, even though again it's pretty clear she's named for the flower and not the wine. In both these examples, the English localizations have opted to use "Rose" rather than "Rosé".

So, there's still a chance this new Super Saiyan form is named after the flower, in which case it would make sense to write and pronounce it the same way as the flower in English. On the flipside, if it were confirmed to be named after the wine, then spelling and pronouncing it Rosé in English would make sense.

At this point in time, all the information we have is Black's dialogue in DBS ep.56, where he says he'll name his form something in keeping with Goku and co.'s naming style. From this, it seems that the name is meant as a counterpart to "Super Saiyan Blue", taking it right back to how rosé is French for "pink".

I should probably have a conclusion of some kind here, but instead I'll just note that Rosé Thomas from Fullmetal Alchemist and Rose from Tales of Zestiria are likewise both ロゼ/Roze in Japanese, even though the English versions of those two properties opted to handle the name in different ways.
Thanks for the confirmation Herms! And you too Ajay! i think Rosé makes more sense given his actual color in the episode.(Aura color) It really was very similair to the color of rosé. And even wine! Black's aura didn't look all that "pinkish" to me. Except for his hair ofcourse when he's "aura-less".

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Re: Is it called Rose or Rosé?

Post by Cetra » Sat Sep 03, 2016 3:02 pm

Herms wrote:As Ajay said, it's written in Japanese as ロゼ/roze, pronounced as "ro-zay". We've known this from Day 1, back when we simply had an unconfirmed episode title mentioning the form's name. There was never any question that this would be the way characters would pronounce it on the show, in Japanese. The only question for us then is how to write and pronounce it in English.

Generally speaking, ロゼ/roze is used in Japanese to refer to Rosé wine, a name which ultimately derives from the French word for "pink" (the wine is named after its distinctive pink color). The English word for the flower is generally written ローズ/rōzu. That's how things typically are, as Ajay already noted.

However, the annoying thing is that it's not always that simple. Sometimes in Japanese they will use ロゼ/roze when they're clearly meaning the flower. It's rare, but it happens.

The big example of this, in my mind anyway, is the Digimon Rosemon, who is quite blatantly based off the rose flower, yet whose name is still written ロゼモン/Rozemon (pronounced "Ro-zay mon"). An interesting recent instance is the game Rose and the Old Castle of Twillight, where you play as a weird girl with a rose flower attached to her body. In Japanese, her name is written ロゼ/Roze, even though again it's pretty clear she's named for the flower and not the wine. In both these examples, the English localizations have opted to use "Rose" rather than "Rosé".

So, there's still a chance this new Super Saiyan form is named after the flower, in which case it would make sense to write and pronounce it the same way as the flower in English. On the flipside, if it were confirmed to be named after the wine, then spelling and pronouncing it Rosé in English would make sense.

At this point in time, all the information we have is Black's dialogue in DBS ep.56, where he says he'll name his form something in keeping with Goku and co.'s naming style. From this, it seems that the name is meant as a counterpart to "Super Saiyan Blue", taking it right back to how rosé is French for "pink".

I should probably have a conclusion of some kind here, but instead I'll just note that Rosé Thomas from Fullmetal Alchemist and Rose from Tales of Zestiria are likewise both ロゼ/Roze in Japanese, even though the English versions of those two properties opted to handle the name in different ways.

As mentioned, the Super Saiyajin Rose is how you would pronounce the flower Rose in German anyway. Same writing, different pronunciation. There is no problem to use a German word in English as well. Like Kindergarten. I know in English there is an extra pronunciation for Rose but I see no problem in using the German one. I would maybe see it a bit different if they would have actually used the word for Rose in Japanese but as they used the katakana I would take it how they pronounce it to reflect it as close as possible. Doesn't mean that they will do it. Of course Dragon Ball does like to use katakana for words that already have an existing word in Japanese. But for an accurate intention reflection I would take that into account. Pronouncing it like the English rose would not be the worst I have ever heard though. That is one word where I can at least "understand" it if they actually want it.
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