Kaikai versus angel transport.

[TobyS]

So you can't fly in a spaceship to heaven or presumably hell or the demon realm.

Beerus place exists in the regular universe apparently (is it only in the anime this is confirmed via monaka being a delivery guy??)

Whis however is slower then teleportation but he doesn't need a ki signature to lock onto afawk. And like teleportation he can move between realms. From Beerus to kaio samas. Vados can go to Kaioshin Kai almost instantly. Quicker then whis got to kaios

Kibito and other gods can teleport to and from Kaioshin world which seems to be in it's own little bubble to the living world. It's either an extension of the afterlife or seperate entirely but the fact that Goku and elder Kaioshin can hang out there dead implies the former.

Kaioshins can even teleport from the mortal world to Kaioshin Kai even if it's not their native timeline and universe (although they need to use the timering then teleport to do so unless you are starting in the same location as you want to end up) see Present Gowas and Shin going to dead future shins empty realm. However Gowas is already in U7 when he does this*

This explains the U6 kaio being able to get to u7s Kaioshin realm in heroes.

Whis can even get to kaioshin of times place it seems.

However what I find weird is the void between universes, apparently even angels/GoDs need a ship, though this could just be because not that many people can touch Whis simultaneously, there's nothing to say this affects the speed either way.

So my question is:

So why don't they just use the kaikai teleportation?
Presumably because they can't would be the only logical reason.

But if they can't use kaikai they must have some other way then using Whis, we see U7 spar with U10 and Shin goes to U10 and then they both use time rings AND cross back to U7

Do you think the Kaioshins also have cubes too?

So when Vados and Champa come along to U7 to steal DBs or eat food they may or may not be using the cube and parking it off screen also.

Is it fair to assume both angels and Kaioshins must have access and the ability to create universe crossing cubes?

Want do you think?

[theherodjl]

Angels probably could use the Kai Kai if they chose to. However, that's simply not part of their desired function. They don't have to teleport to places because they have their own preferred method of travel that is satisfactory to themselves and their respective Hakaishin. As entities that hold a greater power & position over 99.99% of existence, they can move however fast or slow as they wish.

[Jack Bz]

I'd argue that the kaikai is a kaioshin exclusive teleport that even the angels can't learn...but then I remember Kid Boo learnt it just by seeing it once. Maybe he could remember it from being merged with the kaioshins for a time?

[Lionel]

The Daizenshuu stipulates that a user of Kai-Kai is capable of "instantly moving anywhere in the entire universe". I think it's more efficient compared with the angelic equivalent but the details suggest that it's limited in its scope with respect to accessible space. To be fair, neither Super or the multiverse were a concept at the time of that guide's publication so there may have been some "elaboration" on its limits with the recent material.

[TobyS]

The Daizenshuu stipulates that a user of Kai-Kai is capable of "instantly moving anywhere in the entire universe". I think it's more efficient compared with the angelic equivalent but the details suggest that it's limited in its scope with respect to accessible space. To be fair, neither Super or the multiverse were a concept at the time of that guide's publication so there may have been some "elaboration" on its limits with the recent material.

That makes sense, it's weird we've only seen an Angel cross the border into the space between U6 and U7 and could obviously just keep going to get into the other.

Presumably it's just further to the others, or perhaps they briefly go up to zenos and down from there.

We have seen the Kaioshin leave to U10 without Whis (he doesn't want Whis and Beerus knowing he's getting directly involved in fact) in the black arc.

But they don't teleport to the tournament grounds.
This leaves 3 possibilities.
1.Kaikai can't take you to in-between universes. But can take you to straight to other universes.
2. A) Kaikai can take you to other universes Kaioshin realms and then you can move around the rest from there (2 step process)

B ) takes you to zenos place and from there you can go to other universes Kaioshin realms and start from there. (3 step process) perhaps they just touch those monoliths or perhaps they need the grand priests permission? This could be why Whis suggested the excuse to Shin for the GP to allow it? Or perhaps it was preempting Beerus asking him to stay for their safety.

This would provide another reason why Kaioshins realm is so distinct from the rest of the universe in it's own little exterior sphere and would also serve for them to check in upon arrival with the god of their own universe so as not to overstep their jurisdiction.

3. There's no limits and he rode the slow way to the space between universes to be sociable. He rides the slow way back from the world of the void too and we do t explicitly see the U6 god's who aren't friends with mortals teleport away fast.

[JewyB]

2. A) Kaikai can take you to other universes Kaioshin realms and then you can move around the rest from there (2 step process)

I imagine something like this personally, instant but limited to kais and their worlds. Kinda, they can teleport in three directiosn, down to the mortal plane, sideways to other universes but specifically on the kai level, and upwards to Zeno, but never like, sideways and down, always sideways then down.

[TobyS]

2. A) Kaikai can take you to other universes Kaioshin realms and then you can move around the rest from there (2 step process)

I imagine something like this personally, instant but limited to kais and their worlds. Kinda, they can teleport in three directiosn, down to the mortal plane, sideways to other universes but specifically on the kai level, and upwards to Zeno, but never like, sideways and down, always sideways then down.

Ah so are you headcanoning a further restriction of, say, Shin was on earth and went to gowasu,

Does he have to go :

from earth to Kaioshin realm
Kaioshin realm to Gowas Kaioshin realm

Or can he go from earth straight to Gowas Kaioshin realm but not from earth to a random planet within Gowas universe.

And he'd have to go from a random planet say barbari back to U7s Kaioshin realm via stopping at Gowas Kaioshin realm first, he can't ping straight home?

Your explanation might make more sense. We'll probably never get clarification.

It'd be an interesting plot point if you could smash the kaioshin planet bit more likely the entire huge sphere it's in so badly you couldn't teleport out again? Like smashing the bifrost. Could you teleport in but not back out? It'd be a cool story beat.

I really need to get a job...

[JewyB]

Ah so are you headcanoning a further restriction of, say, Shin was on earth and went to gowasu,

Does he have to go :

from earth to Kaioshin realm
Kaioshin realm to Gowas Kaioshin realm

Or can he go from earth straight to Gowas Kaioshin realm but not from earth to a random planet within Gowas universe.

And he'd have to go from a random planet say barbari back to U7s Kaioshin realm via stopping at Gowas Kaioshin realm first, he can't ping straight home?

Your explanation might make more sense. We'll probably never get clarification.

It'd be an interesting plot point if you could smash the kaioshin planet bit more likely the entire huge sphere it's in so badly you couldn't teleport out again? Like smashing the bifrost. Could you teleport in but not back out? It'd be a cool story beat.

I really need to get a job...

Thats how i'd headcanon it yeah, jsut to make them less OP than the angels, there has to be drawbacks right? Like IT, it would be too OP if it didnt have rules, ahah.

Would be interesting though, do we ever see future Zamasu use kaikai? Because there's potential he has destroyed the kai world so there may be some thing to look at there.

But would it be more interesting to think, would it affect any other abilities, perhaps their abilities are intrinsically linked to their domain, but then, like was said, Buu learnt kaikai just by watching, and then wasnt limited, but he isn't a core person so different set of rules?

A major issue is that Dragon Ball doesn't follow anything close to real world logic, like when people discuss the genetics of cell or saiyans or how things should work, we have to go by Dragon Ball logic, which hasn't given us anything for Kaikai yet, it could turn out they just walk SUPER fast(I actually wouldnt put this past Toriyama)