Goku Jr. and Vegeta Jr.

king jro · Post by **king jro** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 1:07 pm

Edit:
Ok How strong do you think Goku Jr. and Vegeta Jr. are.

Post by **VegettoEX** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 1:14 pm

king jro wrote:How strong would you say they are.(Yes i know its entirely noncannon since its a movie based after GT but whatever)

I Would say they are about as strong as Goten and Trunks during there first tornement, woulf that be right?

Or would they be much stronger or weaker.
And yes i know this is pretty much entirly opinion based.

Please re-read the forum rules; you are expected to type properly. Thanks.

Drunken Master · Post by **Drunken Master** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 1:46 pm

Probably very ridiculously strong to a stupid point.

caejones · Post by **caejones** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 2:19 pm

Goku JR seems like a super whiny sheltered less-smart version of Gohan that inherited Goten's Early SSJ blargitude. So logically, I'd say weaker than or equal to Goten and Trunks before the 25th tournament.
But since when does GT bother using logic?

king jro · Post by **king jro** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 2:26 pm

caejones wrote:Goku JR seems like a super whiny sheltered less-smart version of Gohan that inherited Goten's Early SSJ blargitude. So logically, I'd say weaker than or equal to Goten and Trunks before the 25th tournament.
But since when does GT bother using logic?

Never they probobly dont even know what logic or cannon means.
Just kidding, i just dont like GT or anything past the Cell Saga for that matter.

Olivier Hague · Post by **Olivier Hague** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 6:26 pm

king jro wrote:they probobly dont even know what logic or cannon means.

What does "cannon" mean, again? ;þ

Post by **desirecampbell** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 6:49 pm

Olivier Hague wrote:
king jro wrote:they probobly dont even know what logic or cannon means.
What does "cannon" mean, again? ;þ

Mmmm... transparent pngs and grammar burns. Damnit, we're nerds.

king jro · Post by **king jro** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 7:32 pm

Olivier Hague wrote:
king jro wrote:they probobly dont even know what logic or cannon means.
What does "cannon" mean, again? ;þ

Cannon is anything that is in the manga and anime.
They add non cannon or filler things so they can take up the 25 minutes per show and how ever many episodes they need for a season.

caejones · Post by **caejones** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 7:43 pm

I'd doublecheck the number of 'n's, just to avoid inadvertently sending fiery projectiles at people's heads.

. (Bah, I would have made the same mistake like, this time last year. T.T).

So... um... yeah, does the SSJ threshhold power (assuming that there really is such a thing) get lower for subsequent generations? Not that that makes sense, but...

Post by **TripleRach** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 8:09 pm

king jro wrote:Cannon is anything that is in the manga and anime.
They add non cannon or filler things so they can take up the 25 minutes per show and how ever many episodes they need for a season.

The joke apparently went right over your head. Look closely at desirecampbell's image.

And that's not quite why filler material exists. Most Japanese shows don't have "seasons" in the same sense that American shows do. Some are specifically planned for episode counts like 26 (six months) or 52 (one year). But shows like Dragon Ball, which are based on and running parallel with an on-going weekly manga series, don't typically have "planned" amounts of episodes. Anyway, the reason Dragon Ball had filler was because the chapters released each week were usually too short to make into one anime episode, so Toei had to pad out the anime to keep the story behind the manga.

Dark Vegeta-Sama · Post by **Dark Vegeta-Sama** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 8:12 pm

I'm going to have to say weaker.

For one thing, Goku Jr. doesn't really have to rise to the challenge of saving the world from any sort of threat; while there will always be something out there I think that GT kind of made it obvious (in anime/filler canon, at least, which Goku Jr. is a part of) that Goku and Vegeta had pretty much defeated the greatest threats in the universe by that point. It seems that Goku Jr. lives in an era of peace, plus he doesn't have the constant drive to train like the original Goku does.

Secondly, while it was established that Gohan being a half human/half Saiyan hybrid gave him the potential to be stronger than normal Saiyans, I believe this attribute probably only lasts for a few generations at best. Goku Jr. is only 1/16 Saiyan, so by that point the Saiyan blood is pretty diluted. Therefore, he's likely weaker than his ancestors just because he's more human than anything.

I think placing Goku Jr. at being about the level of Goten in the early Buu saga is accurate, although he might even be a little weaker than that.

Everything I just said also applies to Vegeta Jr. by the way, and Goku Jr. and Vegeta Jr. are probably perfectly equal in strength. They're certainly the two strongest individuals on planet Earth, but they don't quite measure up to their ancestors from generations past. Vegeta Jr. might be a little stronger than Goku Jr. but only if he's 1/8 Saiyan as opposed to 1/16 Saiyan. It's a shame that their family histories aren't properly explained.

Godo · Post by **Godo** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 8:14 pm

king jro wrote:
Olivier Hague wrote:
king jro wrote:they probobly dont even know what logic or cannon means.
What does "cannon" mean, again? ;þ
Cannon is anything that is in the manga and anime.
They add non cannon or filler things so they can take up the 25 minutes per show and how ever many episodes they need for a season.

I think desirecampbell explained it in his previous post. It's spelled canon. Cannon is a weapon.

gohanku · Post by **gohanku** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:38 pm

They both can go Super Saiyan, but Goku's just Super Saiyan level is way too strong. So is Gohan's. So I think they are about Goten and Trunks level.

The S · Post by **The S** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 12:17 am

Did they ever officially call the descendant of the Prince, Vegeta Jr.? I can't seem to recall.

Xyex · Post by **Xyex** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 8:13 am

The S wrote:Did they ever officially call the descendant of the Prince, Vegeta Jr.? I can't seem to recall.

Now that you mention it... I don't remember. Mabye it was mentioned at the start of their match at the end of GT?

As for their strengths, I don't even place them as strong as Goten and Trunks. Probably somewhere not much stronger than when Goku first arrived on Namek.

Conan the SSJ · Post by **Conan the SSJ** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 8:22 am

In the Japanese version, he's not referred to by name in any of the dialogue. However, I'm pretty sure the dub had written Goku Jr. to specifically refer to him as "Vegeta" at one point. In the end, what's the difference if his name was said or not? Vegeta Jr. is officially his name evidently, otherwise it wouldn't be continually used for him for nearly a decade.

caejones · Post by **caejones** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 11:28 am

Must...not... reference... Sunday Vs Saturday debates...

Actually... my copy of the last episode of GT isn't the Funi Version... leading me to wonder how they handled Vegeta JR's voice...

Supa Saiya-Jin Tullece · Post by **Supa Saiya-Jin Tullece** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 5:29 pm

I'd say that they're around where Piccolo and Goku were at the end of DragonBall (before Z, I keep forgetting which Tenkaichi Budokai it is. 23rd?)

I say that because there wasn't even any collateral damage to the ring from the force of their blows in Super Saiyan, and they were going all out. I seriously doubt in their age that they've learned how to control their ki (just look at Goten and Trunks, they didn't learn for some time, not even knowing bukujutsu when they became Super Saiyans).

Casual Matt · Post by **Casual Matt** » Wed Sep 05, 2007 10:12 am

Drunken Master wrote:Probably very ridiculously strong to a stupid point.

Considering GT, it's just as well to go with that.

Godo · Post by **Godo** » Wed Sep 05, 2007 12:46 pm

caejones wrote:Must...not... reference... Sunday Vs Saturday debates...

Actually... my copy of the last episode of GT isn't the Funi Version... leading me to wonder how they handled Vegeta JR's voice...

I think it's Vegeta's original voice actor that speaks with a lighter voice.

Supa Saiya-Jin Tullece wrote: I'd say that they're around where Piccolo and Goku were at the end of DragonBall (before Z, I keep forgetting which Tenkaichi Budokai it is. 23rd?)

I say that because there wasn't even any collateral damage to the ring from the force of their blows in Super Saiyan, and they were going all out. I seriously doubt in their age that they've learned how to control their ki (just look at Goten and Trunks, they didn't learn for some time, not even knowing bukujutsu when they became Super Saiyans).

I think it was the 25'th.

Well for Goku Jr., Pan knew how to control her ki and she may have trained Goku Jr.

Overall the "descendant" thing makes me wanna puke. First of all they fight exactly as Trunks vs. Goten. Second of all I don't like how people in Dragonball get weaker and weaker after the end of DBZ, except for base chibi Goku.

Plus, I want to smack Mr. Toriyama for making Goten and Trunks slackers after the Buu saga. And obviously Gohan too. Plus for removing many strong characters. He maybe got lazy.

Kanzenshuu

Goku Jr. and Vegeta Jr.

Goku Jr. and Vegeta Jr.

Re: Goku Jr. and Vegeta Jr.