The Legendary Z-Sword

goodguy777 · Post by **goodguy777** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 1:34 pm

How much does the Z-sword weigh?

omegacwa · Post by **omegacwa** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 1:39 pm

I don't know if it is actually stated, but I am assuming it was a lot, probably in the hundreds of pounds range, as Goku had some difficulty swinging it in base form.

Xyex · Post by **Xyex** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 3:04 pm

omegacwa wrote:I don't know if it is actually stated, but I am assuming it was a lot, probably in the hundreds of pounds range, as Goku had some difficulty swinging it in base form.

It's actually probably closer to thousands of tons. Even ignoring the filler training in Otherworld Goku can already do 'hundreds of pounds' without breaking a sweat. Raditz lifted and blasted that truck and it likely weighed a half ton, minimum. Probably closer to two tons.

I'd say, at a minimum, the Z Sword weighed 5,000 tons. Minimum. But I wouldn't doubt somewhere in the 25,000 ton range either.

omegacwa · Post by **omegacwa** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 3:24 pm

I suppose so. But to me, 50,000lbs just seems like way too much. I know Goku is massively strong, but even so, jesus that's a lot.

Snail · Post by **Snail** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 4:29 pm

It's Dragonball Z afterall.

Post by **Herms** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 4:39 pm

Xyex wrote: Even ignoring the filler training in Otherworld Goku can already do 'hundreds of pounds' without breaking a sweat.

If the training scene you're thinking of is the one where Goku has those big red blocks on his arms and legs, then that was in the manga.

Xyex · Post by **Xyex** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 4:51 am

omegacwa wrote:I suppose so. But to me, 50,000lbs just seems like way too much. I know Goku is massively strong, but even so, jesus that's a lot.

Like Snail said, it's DBZ. XD I think the problem stems from the fact Toriyama hadn't originally intended to go beyond the Pilaf Saga. So he started off with everyone already incredibly strong. That, coupled with the fact that even after he had gone beyond that, he was just making it up as he went with no idea where it would end (and thus no way to create a 'ceiling' to the powers in the series) every time he wanted a 'new amazing feat' it pushed things just that much further into the extreme.

FindKenshi · Post by **FindKenshi** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 11:04 am

Herms wrote:
Xyex wrote: Even ignoring the filler training in Otherworld Goku can already do 'hundreds of pounds' without breaking a sweat.
If the training scene you're thinking of is the one where Goku has those big red blocks on his arms and legs, then that was in the manga.

I vouch this. When I read "filler training in otherworld" it set off bells and whistles in my head. I come from a board where Superman vs. Goku happens on an almost weekly basis, so I know more well then anyone, that scene is in the manga, it is not filler.

Goku really did struggle with 40 tons of weight in his base form.. in the Buu saga. I know, it hurts. One of Toriyama's biggest slipups. Oh well, maybe the poor guy just 'aint too good at math? I mean when you think about the mechanics of propulsion, Tao Pai Pai's pillar-throwing feat already surpasses that in brute strength.

Toriyama Boss · Post by **Toriyama Boss** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 4:36 pm

FindKenshi wrote:Goku really did struggle with 40 tons of weight in his base form.. in the Buu saga. I know, it hurts. One of Toriyama's biggest slipups. Oh well, maybe the poor guy just 'aint too good at math? I mean when you think about the mechanics of propulsion, Tao Pai Pai's pillar-throwing feat already surpasses that in brute strength.

Yeah but you have to realize Goku was not LIFTING 40 tons he was WEARING 40 tons around his limbs mid-air which is completely different. When he went Super Saiya-jin the weight was nothing for him.
You are correct how the Tao pillar feat already surpasses that in strength Taopaipai said a jet plane would take too much time, he would do twenty-three hundred kilometers northeast, in a half hour on the pillar.
You also have other strength feats of Goku which trump that one it's like you said slip ups by Toriyama.

Potential · Post by **Potential** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 5:54 pm

I am just wondering if Goku had problem with 40 tons because of the planet's gravity.For instance, what if the blocks weighted 40 tons by Earth's gravity,but in the Otherworld it felt like 400 tons(10 times Earth's gravity).Otherwise it 's just not making sense.
As for the Zed sword it has to be a little lighter than Goku's blocks since he had some trouble lifting it.Thus, it's either about 35 or 350 tons.

Xyex · Post by **Xyex** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 6:26 pm

Bah. I keep forgetting that is in the manga. I just remember the one arguement I had on Gamefaqs where someone said it was filler and people just went with that. >_<

Well, then, my point stands even better!

And the pillar is actually different, in away, than the weights. That was a lift (by hands) and a throw. And the pillar likely only weighed a few hundred pounds. Maybe a thousand. And the strength needed to throw it like he did is different than the strength needed to lift it.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 6:39 pm

Xyex wrote:Bah. I keep forgetting that is in the manga. I just remember the one arguement I had on Gamefaqs where someone said it was filler and people just went with that. >_<

Well, then, my point stands even better!

And the pillar is actually different, in away, than the weights. That was a lift (by hands) and a throw. And the pillar likely only weighed a few hundred pounds. Maybe a thousand. And the strength needed to throw it like he did is different than the strength needed to lift it.

It obviously wasn't a load-bearing pillar, could be really light.

Toriyama Boss · Post by **Toriyama Boss** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 6:56 pm

What does the Daizenshuu say about the Z sword?
Anyways did the Daizenshuu come out AFTER the series ended or during?

caejones · Post by **caejones** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 7:04 pm

The daizenshuu came out shortly before GT (like during the planning phases for the first story ark?). Same year, I think? *doesn't remember* but it's posted somewhere...

Toriyama Boss · Post by **Toriyama Boss** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 7:06 pm

caejones wrote:The daizenshuu came out shortly before GT (like during the planning phases for the first story ark?). Same year, I think? *doesn't remember* but it's posted somewhere...

Thank you.

Post by **Herms** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 7:25 pm

Daizenshuu 1 came out after the manga had ended but before the anime ended (it included artwork from the last manga chapter and even some illustrations that Toriyama made after the manga ended). The last episode of DBZ aired on January 31st, 1996; Daizenshuu 6 was releashed on December 9, 1995 while Daizenshuu 7 was releashed on February 25th, 1996, making it the only hardcover one to be releashed after the anime's end. This is why Daizenshuu 5, the second anime guide, stops around DBZ episode 268, and they needed to release a supplemental third one to cover the end of the series. (all release dates are from Kanzentai's daizenshuu page). The first episode of GT aired on February 7th, 1996, so Daizenshuu 7 would have been published while the show was still in it's early phase, while all the earlier daizenshuu were published before it started airing, but was already in the planning phase. There are some GT character models in Daizenshuu 5, along with character models for the last portion of DBZ that hadn't aired yet.

Toriyama Boss · Post by **Toriyama Boss** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 5:27 pm

Herms wrote:Daizenshuu 1 came out after the manga had ended but before the anime ended (it included artwork from the last manga chapter and even some illustrations that Toriyama made after the manga ended). The last episode of DBZ aired on January 31st, 1996; Daizenshuu 6 was releashed on December 9, 1995 while Daizenshuu 7 was releashed on February 25th, 1996, making it the only hardcover one to be releashed after the anime's end. This is why Daizenshuu 5, the second anime guide, stops around DBZ episode 268, and they needed to release a supplemental third one to cover the end of the series. (all release dates are from Kanzentai's daizenshuu page). The first episode of GT aired on February 7th, 1996, so Daizenshuu 7 would have been published while the show was still in it's early phase, while all the earlier daizenshuu were published before it started airing, but was already in the planning phase. There are some GT character models in Daizenshuu 5, along with character models for the last portion of DBZ that hadn't aired yet.

Thanks, this is great info!

Big Momma · Post by **Big Momma** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 6:29 pm

Maybe the handle to the sword was just really awkwardly made, and the blade-to-handle proportions were off.

FindKenshi · Post by **FindKenshi** » Sat Feb 02, 2008 9:09 am

Xyex wrote: And the pillar is actually different, in away, than the weights. That was a lift (by hands) and a throw. And the pillar likely only weighed a few hundred pounds. Maybe a thousand. And the strength needed to throw it like he did is different than the strength needed to lift it.

It's not the weight of the pillar that is making Tao Pai Pai's feat impressive. It's the simple mathematics involved with propulsion. He was able to throw that thing, and it flew how many hundreds of miles? He stated he could get there faster then a jet plane in that way. This feat is insane if you know anything about propulsion, as the sheer metric tons of force behind his throw must have been staggering.

As for other physical feats suprassing the whole 40-ton thing, one only has to look at the transformed Zarbon, smashing Vegeta into the ground. Vegeta, a humanoid the size of a small human male, creates a crater about as big as a large lake. In order for him to have made that crater, there'd have to be some serious force behind that impact--especially given the short distance he fell from the air, to create it.

Are we to believe that the likes of Tao Pai Pai and Zarbon are stronger then Buu-saga Goku? No. We simply must accept that Toriyama goofed, and that 40 tons was far too low a number to use.

Post by **desirecampbell** » Sat Feb 02, 2008 10:36 am

I'm still boggled by how Taopaipai could throw a tree and then jump onto it.