Where did the "GT takes place 10 years later" myth start?

[Gaffer Tape]

I greatly appreciate you jumping in, Mike, and sharing this compilation of info as well! The Press Archive is, as always, awesome. I certainly don't think I'd read that particular Animerica blurb before. Even then people were complaining about Nozawa's "little boy" voice. Like you said in another thread recently, the same topics always keep repeating themselves over the years. =P

Was gonna say, why would you even need to get on a VPN to check it? It was already described as just being the regular old normal first episode of GT. Just... pop in the DVD, or whatever.

Well, since Hoffmann's paraphrasing of that line was so different from what I'm hearing when I popped in the DVD, as well as its subtitles, I didn't want to assume that it was just the "regular old normal first episode of GT." It probably is. It almost certainly is. But since I can't as of yet independently confirm what that video is, I didn't want to definitively state that 2022 Hoffmann had simply mis-transcribed the line. I felt that would be irresponsible of me.

At the end of the day, while I was hoping for any kind of clarification from him, part of me hoped he would provide a recollection of an issue of Jump or V-Jump or anything else that might have led him to believe that. You know, something that would be a definitive "the buck stops here" kind of origin for the idea. I think what I got is definitely insightful, and I'm so glad he responded. Given, however, that it is a rationalization of a recollection, though, it's hard to pin anything down as a "definitive origin."

[MasenkoHA]

GT taking place 10 years after Z's epilogue makes those dudes driving a car making a pass at Bra at age 13 somewhat less gross than her being like....8

[TobyS]

What did Xenoverse do in the game? They show dates

[Grimlock]

Xenoverse supports the old information. It also says Dragon Ball GT starts in AGE 789 (all Japanese content does that, I guess).

[WittyUsername]

What is with the designs of gt pan and bra I’m confused. Pan looks like a young early teen or pre teen or extreme close too that age and bra 100 percent looks like a teenager. did the people making gt not understand the difference between their actual ages and teenagers. Gt is beyond weird when it comes to this.

Pan looks pretty believable for a 9 or 10 year old, which makes it all the more uncomfortable whenever the show tries to sexualize her. As for Bra, she certainly dresses in a very off-putting manner for someone who’s supposed to be even younger than Pan, and there is that one moment where those teens/young adults are hitting on her, but she’s also drawn with a flat chest, so it’s difficult to know whether the people making the show were aware of her age…

Honestly, I always assumed the “10 years later” idea was just something people came up with to try and make some of the moments involving Pan and Bra a little less creepy.

[supersaiyamangod]

What is with the designs of gt pan and bra I’m confused. Pan looks like a young early teen or pre teen or extreme close too that age and bra 100 percent looks like a teenager. did the people making gt not understand the difference between their actual ages and teenagers. Gt is beyond weird when it comes to this.

Pan looks pretty believable for a 9 or 10 year old, which makes it all the more uncomfortable whenever the show tries to sexualize her. As for Bra, she certainly dresses in a very off-putting manner for someone who’s supposed to be even younger than Pan, and there is that one moment where those teens/young adults are hitting on her, but she’s also drawn with a flat chest, so it’s difficult to know whether the people making the show were aware of her age…

Honestly, I always assumed the “10 years later” idea was just something people came up with to try and make some of the moments involving Pan and Bra a little less creepy.

No even pan didn’t look as young as she’s supposed to it’s like the people who made this show didn’t know how old these characters really were pan looks 11 or 12 but is supposed to be younger and bra looks 13 or 14 but is younger than pan. gt is extremely weird.

[Metalwario64]

Pan is noticeably taller than Goku who I assume was wished back to his 11 year old body, with her being probably as tall as Goku was at 15. Saiyans apparently age slowly and get a huge growth spurt nearing adulthood so I can see people assuming the same with Pan and Bra.

Of course, I'm not suggesting anything other than I could see why people could assume Pan and Bra are older and the "10 years later" thing was the case. I know it's not myself.

[Grimlock]

No even pan didn’t look as young as she’s supposed to it’s like the people who made this show didn’t know how old these characters really were pan looks 11 or 12 but is supposed to be younger

Pan is eleven years old by the second half of Dragon Ball GT. If she looks eleven to you, then I think those people are right.

[supersaiyamangod]

No even pan didn’t look as young as she’s supposed to it’s like the people who made this show didn’t know how old these characters really were pan looks 11 or 12 but is supposed to be younger

Pan is eleven years old by the second half of Dragon Ball GT. If she looks eleven to you, then I think those people are right.

Oh ok then my thoughts on bra are the only one that’s valid then like why does she look and dress like she’s 13 or 14 years old that is odd and if we even get a new gt replacement series I hope the designs of these characters are done way better. specifically bra because she shouldn’t look or dress like a teen in that age of dragon ball.

[90sDBZ]

I'm pretty sure an an early UK promo for Blue Water GT mentioned it being 10 years. And the Sky TV guide also said 10 years, so for me that's where the idea came from.

Although neither English dub nor the Japanese version ever mentioned it within the show itself. Funimation's Season 1 DVD booklet actually says 7 years though.

10 years has always made more sense than 5 though. Pan is shown to be dating during episode 1, and she clearly dresses and acts like a teenager throughout the series. The dynamic with her no longer respecting Goku is more believable if she's a teenager.

Also Bra is shown driving a car and is twice the height of Goku.

I feel more inclined to go by what I see in the actual show rather than an outside "official" source.

[Dragon Ball Ireland]

Also Bra is shown driving a car and is twice the height of Goku.

Dragon Ball has always kind of went it's own way with things like that. Bulma was 16 when she was first introduced and had her own car despite 18 being the minimum legal driving age in Japan (I know its not explicitly stated Dragon Ball is set in Japan, but as a native it was probably Toriyama's default mindset), although 2 years early is more believable than Bra driving at 9-11.

10 years does make the guys hitting on Bra less uncomfortable although it is still creepy to an extent because they looked a good few years older than she was even at 14.

[supersaiyamangod]

Also Bra is shown driving a car and is twice the height of Goku.

Dragon Ball has always kind of went it's own way with things like that. Bulma was 16 when she was first introduced and had her own car despite 18 being the minimum legal driving age in Japan (I know its not explicitly stated Dragon Ball is set in Japan, but as a native it was probably Toriyama's default mindset), although 2 years early is more believable than Bra driving at 9-11.

10 years does make the guys hitting on Bra less uncomfortable although it is still creepy to an extent because they looked a good few years older than she was even at 14.

That’s alone besides how bad gt is overall makes me render gt non canon in my mind I want a new series set in this time period that has not only a better story but handles pan and bra’s age significantly better and 100% more appropriately.

[WittyUsername]

Also Bra is shown driving a car and is twice the height of Goku.

Dragon Ball has always kind of went it's own way with things like that. Bulma was 16 when she was first introduced and had her own car despite 18 being the minimum legal driving age in Japan (I know its not explicitly stated Dragon Ball is set in Japan, but as a native it was probably Toriyama's default mindset), although 2 years early is more believable than Bra driving at 9-11.

10 years does make the guys hitting on Bra less uncomfortable although it is still creepy to an extent because they looked a good few years older than she was even at 14.

I think Bulma is more or less meant to be the Dragon Ball equivalent of an American. She also carries guns around, even though Japan has very strict laws regarding firearms.

[Ashur]

Pan is noticeably taller than Goku who I assume was wished back to his 11 year old body, with her being probably as tall as Goku was at 15. Saiyans apparently age slowly and get a huge growth spurt nearing adulthood so I can see people assuming the same with Pan and Bra.

Of course, I'm not suggesting anything other than I could see why people could assume Pan and Bra are older and the "10 years later" thing was the case. I know it's not myself.

Then again she is the daughter of Gohan, who, at 10 years old, was still taller than what Goku was at 12:


And looked like this at the age of 11:

Not to mention Chi Chi was also bigger than Goku in at 11 and that we don't know How Videl's growth was (Pan does resemble her mother a lot, keep that in mind) so due to all of these factors Pan's design is perfectly consistent, Goku is just smol.

Also remember that GT was made before Jaco established Goku's growth was the norm among the Saiyans, at any rate, even if you want to count that, Gohan and Pan are hybrids, so there's a possibility that they could differ from the pure Saiyan norm because of it.

Bra is the one that is weird because she is presented as being more of a full-on adolescent than Pan, who is just entering puberty and is still quite childish (Pan is watching baby cartoons while Bra goes shopping on her own), i think that, at the time, Bra's birth year was not specified, so the people making GT guessed her approximate age from how she looked in the ending of Dragon Ball, she looked and acted older than Pan so they designed her with this correlation in mind, i deep they intended for Pan to be 10 and Bra 13.

Other than Bra, which seems to be a discrepancy between subsequent sources and how she is presented during Dragon Ball's ending (nothing to blame on the conception of GT's timeframe) GT being 5 years later is perfectly consistent with what is actually shown, i am convinced that the 5 year gap was always the intent from the creators.

[WittyUsername]

Pan is noticeably taller than Goku who I assume was wished back to his 11 year old body, with her being probably as tall as Goku was at 15. Saiyans apparently age slowly and get a huge growth spurt nearing adulthood so I can see people assuming the same with Pan and Bra.

Of course, I'm not suggesting anything other than I could see why people could assume Pan and Bra are older and the "10 years later" thing was the case. I know it's not myself.

Then again she is the daughter of Gohan, who, at 10 years old, was still taller than what Goku was at 12:


And looked like this at the age of 11:

Not to mention Chi Chi was also bigger than Goku in at 11 and that we don't know How Videl's growth was (Pan does resemble her mother a lot, keep that in mind) so due to all of these factors Pan's design is perfectly consistent, Goku is just smol.

Also remember that GT was made before Jaco established Goku's growth was the norm among the Saiyans, at any rate, even if you want to count that, Gohan and Pan are hybrids, so there's a possibility that they could differ from the pure Saiyan norm because of it.

Bra is the one that is weird because she is presented as being more of a full-on adolescent than Pan, who is just entering puberty and is still quite childish (Pan is watching baby cartoons while Bra goes shopping on her own), i think that, at the time, Bra's birth year was not specified, so the people making GT guessed her approximate age from how she looked in the ending of Dragon Ball, she looked and acted older than Pan so they designed her with this correlation in mind, i deep they intended for Pan to be 10 and Bra 13.

Other than Bra, which seems to be a discrepancy between subsequent sources and how she is presented during Dragon Ball's ending (nothing to blame on the conception of GT's timeframe) GT being 5 years later is perfectly consistent with what is actually shown, i am convinced that the 5 year gap was always the intent from the creators.

What reason was there to think Bra was older than Pan just going by the original manga?

[Grimlock]

i think that, at the time, Bra's birth year was not specified, so the people making GT guessed her approximate age from how she looked in the ending of Dragon Ball

Daizenshuu 7, which says Bra was born in AGE 779, was released in February 1996. Perfect Files, which says Bra was born in AGE 780, was released in 1997 (I don't know which one contains such information). Dragon Ball GT started in February 1996, so all they had was the Daizenshuu information.

Even if they were to take into consideration Daizenshuu (and I don't know if they used to keep up with the guidebooks), Bra should have been just the same age as Pan. That still wouldn't explain the way she was portrayed. I think it's impossible to draw any kind of conclusion based solely from what is seen in the end of the manga, so they really went wild if that was the case.

[JulieYBM]

I doubt anyone was paying attention to the Daizenshuu when creating the Dragon Ball GT animated series. Matsui and the other writers probably just went for a certain vibe that they wanted for Pan and Bra—or the vibe that Series Director Kasai Osamu wanted—and then wrote from there.

[VegettoEX]

Daizenshuu 7, which says Bra was born in AGE 779, was released in February 1996. Perfect Files, which says Bra was born in AGE 780, was released in 1997 (I don't know which one contains such information). Dragon Ball GT started in February 1996, so all they had was the Daizenshuu information.

You're mistaking some information. Daizenshuu 7 lists Bra's birth year as 780 in its opening timeline, and then as 778 in its character profile section for Bra herself.

See - https://imgur.com/gallery/AwjSvDR

(Pan, meanwhile, is consistently listed as being born in Age 779 everywhere.)

After this point, all supplemental timeline materials (the first GT Perfect File, the 2013 Akira Toriyama exhibition booklet, etc.) all go with Age 780 for Bra.

The only exception to this is Chouzenshuu 4... which just re-prints both the 778 and 780 inconsistency as-is from Daizenshuu 7, as it is itself largely a reprint of prior Daizenshuu material.

[Grimlock]

Damn, I was pretty sure I was spot on. I was already doing research for the other conversation I'm in, so I was kinda lazy to do the same here. Sorry. It's the Daizenshuu that contradicts itself, gotta remember that.

Anyway, my point stands, even so. Bra being born in AGE 778 would mean she was eleven by the time Dragon Ball GT starts, the same age as Pan is by the end of it. Still no reason to portray her the way she was.

[Ashur]

i think that, at the time, Bra's birth year was not specified, so the people making GT guessed her approximate age from how she looked in the ending of Dragon Ball

Daizenshuu 7, which says Bra was born in AGE 779, was released in February 1996. Perfect Files, which says Bra was born in AGE 780, was released in 1997 (I don't know which one contains such information). Dragon Ball GT started in February 1996, so all they had was the Daizenshuu information.

Even if they were to take into consideration Daizenshuu (and I don't know if they used to keep up with the guidebooks), Bra should have been just the same age as Pan. That still wouldn't explain the way she was portrayed. I think it's impossible to draw any kind of conclusion based solely from what is seen in the end of the manga, so they really went wild if that was the case.

It still came out after the designs for GT were made, and almost at the same time as the first episode, they probably didin't have access to the Daizenshuu 7's information before it came out (or they didin't bother checking in such a small detail with the people makkng the daizenshuu, or had incomplete information).

It is possible to draw something from what we see in the ending, Bra speaks and behaves much less 'baby-like' compared to Pan and looks a bit older, overall she feels more adjusted, like a full on kid other than someone getting out of the toddler stage like Pan, from how she is presented it is natural the creators of GT interpreted her age to be an unspecified ammount older than Pan (probably around 3 years older if i had to guess), and if Pan is supposed to be just entering puberty, Bra's potrayal as a bratty early teen makes sense from this perspective, i'm not saying this is the only way to interpret her if you just look at the ending, but it is possible and reasonable to reach such concludion.

So i think this was the basis of the mistake, the creators didin't\couldn't check on the daizenshuu info and simply interpreted Bra in a way that was inconsistent with later information.