Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

[SupremeKai25]

So you reckon Infinite Zamasu would get crushed by any serious fighter in the ToP?

No, he wouldn't, because he's immortal. Jiren wouldn't be able to kill him, however he'd have higher firepower than Zamasu. As per usual in Akira Toriyama's Dragon Ball, New Antagonist > Previous Saga.

[PerhapsTheOtherOne]

Actually, I think DBS has sorta dabbled a bit in the idea of not every ending antagonist being stronger than the last.

Hit wasn't as strong in raw power as Golden Freeza and got by via his powerful abilities, and Cell Max was evidently wasn't stronger than Broly in his incomplete state despite Broly also being a berserker.

And notably, Jiren and Broly remain relevant candidates of mention as of DBS:SH alongside Cell Max and the rest of the Gods of Destruction. To me, this speaks of more relative parity in the overall strength and threat level of these latest opponents instead of each subsequent one being leagues stronger than the last.

[Miracles]

That's just because he can defuse them, not because he's stronger

You need to damage the individual for Spirit Fission to work.

Vegeta wasn't doing any damage when he first started attacking Moro, but he was hitting him. So being able to hit your opponent is the requirement.

Obviously Vegeta was doing damage, otherwise Moro wouldn't have lost energy in the first place. We see Vegeta do it to planet Moro too. Then we see Moro ask Vegeta that his technique [Spirit Fission] requires damage and then he said he won't make the same mistake. So instead of taking Vegeta's punches he dodged them even when he was fused with 7-3.

[QuakingStar]

You need to damage the individual for Spirit Fission to work.

Vegeta wasn't doing any damage when he first started attacking Moro, but he was hitting him. So being able to hit your opponent is the requirement.

Obviously Vegeta was doing damage, otherwise Moro wouldn't have lost energy in the first place. We see Vegeta do it to planet Moro too. Then we see Moro ask Vegeta that his technique [Spirit Fission] requires damage and then he said he won't make the same mistake. So instead of taking Vegeta's punches he dodged them even when he was fused with 7-3.

He simply needed to land a hit, and 1hp damage is still damage. Vegeta was much weaker than Moro.

[Miracles]

Vegeta wasn't doing any damage when he first started attacking Moro, but he was hitting him. So being able to hit your opponent is the requirement.

Obviously Vegeta was doing damage, otherwise Moro wouldn't have lost energy in the first place. We see Vegeta do it to planet Moro too. Then we see Moro ask Vegeta that his technique [Spirit Fission] requires damage and then he said he won't make the same mistake. So instead of taking Vegeta's punches he dodged them even when he was fused with 7-3.

He simply needed to land a hit, and 1hp damage is still damage. Vegeta was much weaker than Moro.

That is correct. Meaning all Vegeta's punches were causing damage regardless of how minimal.
Remember the very first punch Vegeta landed Gohan said "that barely had any effect."

However, with Gogeta/Vegetto Moro using Spirit Fission with his merge with 7-3 rendered the fusion of the Saiyan's "useless."
Meaning it was overkill. Moro 7-3 would cause tons of damage. Moro already needed fusion to fight him before he absorbed 7-3.

[supersaiyangodgogeta]

Piccolo's dialogue when talking about Fusion is basically already a narrative concession that Moro is weaker than Gogeta/Vegito.

Direct contact is not the only way to activate Spirit Fission. Vegeta was using it just by blasting Earth Moro's body with Ki.

Hitting Gogeta/Vegito with some Magic attack likely activates the conditions for Fission to activate.

So even if Gogeta/Vegito and Moro both have Spirit Fission, Moro can just be way better at applying it, or he may only have to apply it once to separate Gogeta/Vegito.

[FPSSJ4_Goku]

Hi everyone, I have come to bestow you guys with a YouTube video by a guy who decided to calculate the power levels for every character after the Freeza arc, using real world physics and goes on for over an hour. And trust me, it gets insane. By the time Super rolls around, he introduces something new called God units, because the numbers gods ludicrously high.

The link: https://youtu.be/AjK8npzV5Jc?is=f9oVKtjluBJYJvp_

Give you guys' thoughts on his analysis

[Yuji]

It seems that base Goku vs Freeza in ROF is still going to be in the arc, but now Goku actually goes SSG so there's no "Saiyan beyond God" workaround.

I wonder how the powerscaling is gonna work. Base RF Goku = SSG is probably what will fans still assume is the case, but considering Goku can use SSG now, it's just fucking stupid to think he absorbed SSG and then can stack SSG again on top of it, and then SS on top of SSG. Just go on infinitely, why not?

I wonder if Freeza is still gonna beat Gohan in his first form. I guess the only real on-screen scaling would then be base Goku > Gohan & the others. That makes him stronger than a rusty Super Saiyan and underwhelming Piccolo (which they've always been portraying the base Saiyans as stronger than since the Boo arc), but not necessarily SSG tier.

Copy Vegeta if it's cut saves the scaling for the anime.

In any case, Trunks matching Goku in the anime is still a ridiculous power boost for him. Unless we scrap the whole "BoG base Goku weaker than Namek Freeza" thing which I'm more and more inclined to do.

[Koitsukai]

People thought Gohan was stacking SS on top of Ultimate in GT while still being fodder, so I wouldn't be surprised if people think Goku is stacking SSG on top of SSG.

[QuakingStar]

People thought Gohan was stacking SS on top of Ultimate in GT while still being fodder, so I wouldn't be surprised if people think Goku is stacking SSG on top of SSG.

I recall an interview or the GT Perfect Guide saying he never stopped training between Z and GT and GT treats Ultimate like a new base form, not a transformation. So in GT he is using SS with it. Only in another interview did they imply he becomes an "Ultimate Warrior" in the Shadow before the Dragon Saga starts I believe.