On-Topic thread of Awesomeness!

[Kendamu]

Everyone knows that "Evolution" was tacked onto the title later on, anyway. Had the movie come out in August like it was supposed to, it still would've been called "Dragonball" at that point.

Maybe that's why they changed it. To separate the two entities. Makes sense to me.

That's what I figured, too, but I don't have any way of proving it so I didn't feel like having to argue about my own personal speculation.

[mrkaizoku]

Would you say that you think the thread is depressing because you don't agree with the optimism expressed by the board members?

The depression I'm speaking of comes directly from the script leaks. I have no issue with someone else enjoying a movie that I hate.

The only time I get upset with people that like "Dragonball: Evolution" is when they try to put words in my mouth. I have no problem with someone liking a terribly generic disappointing movie as long as they don't push their shit onto me.

[Chrono Trigger]

See, that says 'No, this isn't a direct adaption, we EVOLVED it, as in CHANGED it into a RETELLING OF WHAT GOKU WOULD BE IF HE WAS RAISED IN SOCIETY'

If you can't understand that, I'm sorry for you

Well like it was said earlier most people wanted Dragon Ball but they gave us Dragon Ball: Evolution. There really is no other way to look at it.

[Acid_Reign]

The new Nolan films are fucking awful. The plots themselves aren't too bad (convoluted and with gaping holes, and they all hinge on someone being incredibly stupid, but not 'terrible') but the re-characterization of all the characters it unbelievable. Add into that some of the worst direction I've ever seen. And I've seen Ed Wood films.

What movies were you watching? Not only are the Nolan films good, but they completely redefine the standard for comic book movie adaptations. I invite you to show me an example of this “re-characterization” (there should be plenty to choose from, given that it’s “all of the characters”…). The only “gaping holes” that really come into play are plot twists which, if logically explained, would completely ruin their intended effect. Sure, the plot isn’t 100% plausible, but who cares? It’s a superhero movie. Where’s your sense of imagination?

And if you honestly think his directing is the worst you’ve ever seen, then you have not seen very many films. Nolan was always pushing his crew to be at their best, and it comes through not just in the engaging interplay of the characters, nor in the way he submerses the audience into Gotham and makes you feel as if you’re in a real city, but also with the array of breathtaking stunts that you can only really begin to appreciate after knowing what actually went into them. How many directors push their stunt guys to flip an 18-wheeler vertically? Or to do an actual dive off of a building for flying sequences? Most directors nowadays would have saved themselves the trouble and used pure CGI. Decisions like these take dedication.

Shit, lots of movies. Too many to give anything resembling a complete list, but how about 'comic book movies'?
Batman (1,2), Superman (1), Hellboy (1 and 2), Iron Man, 300, Sin City, Mystery Men, V for Vendetta, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (1,2,3-haven't seen the new one).

Wow. How can you even say that something as mindless as 300 is superior to stuff like The Dark Knight? Or go on these riffs about the lack of faithfulness in adaptations ruining the experience for you, and then give the watered-down and ideologically misrepresented V for Vendetta two thumbs up?

[Rocketman]

How can you even say that something as mindless as 300 is superior to stuff like The Dark Knight?

300 kicks The Dark Knight's ass so hard Batman can't even wear pants anymore because his ass cheeks rest between his shoulder blades.

By which I mean that TDK is massively, massively overrated.

[jda95]

How can you even say that something as mindless as 300 is superior to stuff like The Dark Knight?

300 kicks The Dark Knight's ass so hard Batman can't even wear pants anymore because his ass cheeks rest between his shoulder blades.

By which I mean that TDK is massively, massively overrated.

Umm, The Dark Knight is a poor movie, but comparing it to 300?

[Acid_Reign]

By which I mean that TDK is massively, massively overrated.

Maybe it is (it isn’t), but what does that have to do with 300?

Umm, The Dark Knight is a poor movie, but comparing it to 300?

Where exactly does this notion come from? Pop culture backlash?

[JAPPO]

Wow what's with TDK bashing? Is it cool to bash that movie now?

I think it's overrated too, but it's anything but poor. The filmmaking IS oscar worthy.

[omegacwa]

Hey, 300 was good for what it was, and what it was meant to be, a ridiculously over top action version of a dodgilly recorded historical event.
But I will agree that TMNT 2 and 3 are freaking terrible. TMNT 1 is excellent though.

As for the stuff revealed by Jappo, I can't see how anyone can't see these things as mostly positive. Most of the things he revealed show off that the movie is a lot more faithful to the source than we thought, but I guess that's my opinion.

[jda95]

Wow what's with TDK bashing? Is it cool to bash that movie now?

I think it's overrated too, but it's anything but poor. The filmmaking IS oscar worthy.

Ledger was great, the film was poor.

[Chrono Trigger]

By which I mean that TDK is massively, massively overrated.

This couldn't be anymore true but for someone to say it sucked!? That it's a terrible movie!? That's just going way outta the box....

[omegacwa]

Wow what's with TDK bashing? Is it cool to bash that movie now?

I think it's overrated too, but it's anything but poor. The filmmaking IS oscar worthy.

Ledger was great, the film was poor.

ehhhem! Aaron Eckhart was the man, so many people over look his completely awesome performance as Harvey Dent/Two Face.

[Acid_Reign]

ehhhem! Aaron Eckhart was the man, so many people over look his completely awesome performance as Harvey Dent/Two Face.

So was the entire rest of the cast. That’s why these accusations are unfathomable to me: they’re oversimplified and just plain ignorant.

[desirecampbell]

Firstly, the list I just gave was of film I enjoyed, not those that were 'great films'. No, The TMNT movies weren't very faithful, neither was V for Vendetta - I still enjoyed them. I also enjoyed 'Plan 9 from Outer Space'. Liking a film, and it being 'good' are completely separate things. (For the record, I enjoyed TMNT 2 less than 1, and 3 less than 2. V for Vendetta was pretty good, but only just.)

300 was a fantastic action film. The art direction alone leaves Dark knight behind. No, 300 didn't have great character building, it was nearly pure visual action. And at that is has few equals.

And is anyone seriously saying Nolan is a good director because he told a guy to flip a transport truck? Fuck Orson Wells, he never flipped anything!

Seriously, who cares if you can't understand the main character, and the plot makes no goddamn sense; stuff blew up! (sigh)

[Acid_Reign]

And is anyone seriously saying Nolan is a good director because he told a guy to flip a transport truck? Fuck Orson Wells, he never flipped anything!

Seriously, who cares if you can't understand the main character, and the plot makes no goddamn sense; stuff blew up! (sigh)

Way to completely misinterpret what I was saying. The point was, he isn’t afraid to push his crew to get the best he can out of them. That’s directing.

But I mean, if Batman disguising his voice and a complex plot are all it takes to make someone a bad director, then there are far, far worse than Nolan. You simply have to be exaggerating if you think he’s the worst ever.

[Rocketman]

Hey, 300 was good for what it was, and what it was meant to be, a ridiculously over top action version of a dodgilly recorded historical event.

Thermopylae is fairly well recorded, actually. And my favorite part of the movie is that it's not as far over the top as people think. Most of the battle, badass lines and all, comes straight out of Herodotus' The Histories, as I quote here:

...thinking that their firm stand was mere impudence and recklessness, he [Xerxes] grew wroth, and sent against them the Medes and Cissians, with orders to take them alive and bring them into his presence. Then the Medes rushed forward and charged the Greeks, but fell in vast numbers: others however took the places of the slain, and would not be beaten off, though they suffered terrible losses. In this way it became clear to all, and especially to the king, that though he had plenty of combatants, he had but very few warriors. The struggle, however, continued during the whole day.

Then the Medes, having met so rough a reception, withdrew from the fight; and their place was taken by the band of Persians under Hydarnes, whom the king called his "Immortals": they, it was thought, would soon finish the business. But when they joined battle with the Greeks, 'twas with no better success than the Median detachment - things went much as before - the two armies fighting in a narrow space, and the barbarians using shorter spears than the Greeks, and having no advantage from their numbers. The Lacedaemonians [Spartans] fought in a way worthy of note, and showed themselves far more skillful in fight than their adversaries, often turning their backs, and making as though they were all flying away, on which the barbarians would rush after them with much noise and shouting, when the Spartans at their approach would wheel round and face their pursuers, in this way destroying vast numbers of the enemy. Some Spartans likewise fell in these encounters, but only a very few. At last the Persians, finding that all their efforts to gain the pass availed nothing, and that, whether they attacked by divisions or in any other way, it was to no purpose, withdrew to their own quarters.

...

It is said that Leonidas himself sent away the troops who departed, because he tendered their safety, but thought it unseemly that either he or his Spartans should quit the post which they had been especially sent to guard. For my own part, I incline to think that Leonidas gave the order, because he perceived the allies to be out of heart and unwilling to encounter the danger to which his own mind was made up. He therefore commanded them to retreat, but said that he himself could not draw back with honour; knowing that, if he stayed, glory awaited him, and that Sparta in that case would not lose her prosperity. For when the Spartans, at the very beginning of the war, sent to consult the oracle concerning it, the answer which they received from the Pythoness was, "that either Sparta must be overthrown by the barbarians, or one of her kings must perish.""

...

Now they joined battle beyond the defile [the narrow part], and carried slaughter among the barbarians, who fell in heaps. Behind them the captains of the squadrons, armed with whips, urged their men forward with continual blows. Many were thrust into the sea, and there perished; a still greater number were trampled to death by their own soldiers; no one heeded the dying. For the Greeks, reckless of their own safety and desperate, since they knew that, as the mountain had been crossed, their destruction was nigh at hand, exerted themselves with the most furious valour against the barbarians.

By this time the spears of the greater number were all shivered, and with their swords they hewed down the ranks of the Persians; and here, as they strove, Leonidas fell fighting bravely, together with many other famous Spartans, whose names I have taken care to learn on account of their great worthiness, as indeed I have those of all the three hundred.

...

One of the Trachinians told him, "Such was the number of the barbarians, that when they shot forth their arrows the sun would be darkened by their multitude." Dieneces, not at all frightened at these words, but making light of the Median numbers, answered, "Our Trachinian friend brings us excellent tidings. If the Medes darken the sun, we shall have our fight in the shade." Other sayings too of a like nature are reported to have been left on record by this same person.

[Onikage725]

I second Rocketman.

Hm, I think people calling TDK awful are the ones who wanted a Batman film. I personally thing it was a phenomenal film set in the Bat-verse. It was just... shitty as a film supposedly starring Batman. The first half of the movie, Bats was basically Dent's sidekick.

And, really, Rachel should've been killed off in the first film. The Bruce/Rachel?Harvey love triangle did little to hold interest.

[desirecampbell]

But I mean, if Batman disguising his voice and a complex plot are all it takes to make someone a bad director, then there are far, far worse than Nolan. You simply have to be exaggerating if you think he’s the worst ever.

Now you're misrepresenting me. I never said he was the 'worst'. Ed Wood Jr is the worst (there's no dispute about that). I'm just saying that Nolan is very bad. Like, the entire film being idiotically dark. Too dark to clearly see the action, or even what's going on in the scene. And how about, showing how Batman entered the room? I can think of at least two scenes where Batman's not there, then he is. Now, these scenes could have been done really well - and have added a sense of stealth and tension, like by showing Batman flitting from shadow to shadow, sneaking behind a thug, jumping down from the rafters - anything - but the lack of such scenes just smacks of incompetent direction. Further, the film doesn't move quickly enough in most spots, but in others jumps around so fast that the scene ends before it could make a point of any kind.

-edit-

I second Rocketman.
Hm, I think people calling TDK awful are the ones who wanted a Batman film. I personally thing it was a phenomenal film set in the Bat-verse. It was just... shitty as a film supposedly starring Batman. The first half of the movie, Bats was basically Dent's sidekick.
And, really, Rachel should've been killed off in the first film. The Bruce/Rachel?Harvey love triangle did little to hold interest.

Urgh, that was just terrible. I don't understand why Dent was even there. (Yeah it was supposedly Joker's big plan, which didn't make any sense.) Not enough time spent with Dent to endear him as a character, not enough time spent changing him evil (that took one scene) but too much time spent on him for just killing him off at the end.

Oh well. At least it was better than 'Begins'.

[Kaboom]

I agree with the notion that Dark Knight is somewhat overhyped, but to say it was bad or "sucked" is simply ludicrous. Heath Ledger's performance as Joker was more than enough to make the film great, and yes, Aaron Eckhart's Dent/Two-Face was great too.

[Big Momma]

I have a few question, JAPPO, if you don't mind.

1) Does it say anything about the SIZE of the Oozaru?
2) Is it called "Oozaru"?
3) Does it say anything about him coming to earth/hitting his head besides that one flashback to the meteor?
4)Is anything said about an animated portion of the film?
5)On a scale from 1-10, how perverted would you say Roshi is in this film overall?
6)This is just for me: How much language is in the script?


That's all. If something can't be said because of legal issues, that's fine.