Powerlevels

Horgus · Post by **Horgus** » Tue Mar 24, 2009 2:20 pm

Yeah as far as I know 'ningen' refers to humanoids and 'chikyujin' (don't know exactly how it's spelled, but that's what it sounds like) specifically refers to earthlings.

Chikyu being 'earth' and Uchyuu being 'universe', uchyuujin (sorry if I butchered that) refers to 'alien.'

This being what I have learned from watching anime incessantly.

Post by **Herms** » Tue Mar 24, 2009 4:28 pm

UMMX wrote:But the one thing that goes against this is Android 17 and 18 Aka Jinzōningen Jū Hachi and Jinzōningen Jū Nana. Now they where born as Earthlings but they are not count as ningen. In English term's Android 17/18 are called android, but in reality they are really Cyborgs. And In Japanese they are called Jinzoningen but that some weird mix breed name?

Can you example better?

They're Earthlings who were restructured by Gero from humans (ningen) into artificial humans (jinzou ningen). Jinzou ningen is usually translated as "android" (and "Android No.17/18" is the romanization for the pair's names that is used in Japan), though No.17 and No.18 are closer to cyborgs; even in Japanese, jinzou ningen isn't quite the correct term for beings like No.17 and 18.

UMMX · Post by **UMMX** » Tue Mar 24, 2009 5:04 pm

Herms wrote:
UMMX wrote:But the one thing that goes against this is Android 17 and 18 Aka Jinzōningen Jū Hachi and Jinzōningen Jū Nana. Now they where born as Earthlings but they are not count as ningen. In English term's Android 17/18 are called android, but in reality they are really Cyborgs. And In Japanese they are called Jinzoningen but that some weird mix breed name?

Can you example better?
They're Earthlings who were restructured by Gero from humans (ningen) into artificial humans (jinzou ningen). Jinzou ningen is usually translated as "android" (and "Android No.17/18" is the romanization for the pair's names that is used in Japan), though No.17 and No.18 are closer to cyborgs; even in Japanese, jinzou ningen isn't quite the correct term for beings like No.17 and 18.

Okay that makes sense, but on a smaller note then. Does this mean that Japanese Kanji doesn't have right characterizes to say Cyborg in Japanese?

Post by **Herms** » Tue Mar 24, 2009 5:11 pm

They just use the English word "cyborg", written in katakana: サイボーグ/saiboogu.

UMMX · Post by **UMMX** » Tue Mar 24, 2009 5:23 pm

Herms wrote:They just use the English word "cyborg", written in katakana: サイボーグ/saiboogu.

Okay that make sense also. And this will be my finally question about android 18 family.

If i was to take saiboogu form written in katakana and add (ningen) from Kanji and add ju hachi to it and make.... Saibooguningen Ju Hachi Would this also count as saying Cybrog 17 or does it make a hole new word?

Adamant · Post by **Adamant** » Tue Mar 24, 2009 5:35 pm

That would translate to "cyborg human", which would be a somewhat more specific term, telling us that these particular cyborgs were originally human, rather than dogs or something.

Also, they're referred to as "Juunanagou" and "Juuhachigou". The "gou" is a counter, so it translates to "Number Seventeen" and "Number Eighteen".

Come to think of it, aren't the Jinzouningen referred to as "cyborgs" by Trunks when he first arrives to warn the group about them?

Post by **Herms** » Tue Mar 24, 2009 6:33 pm

Adamant wrote:Come to think of it, aren't the Jinzouningen referred to as "cyborgs" by Trunks when he first arrives to warn the group about them?

Yeah, which is interesting since Toriyama was only thinking of No.19 and No.20 at that point, and No.19 turned out to be purely robotic.

Bussani · Post by **Bussani** » Tue Mar 24, 2009 7:31 pm

UMMX wrote:But the one thing that goes against this is Android 17 and 18 Aka Jinzōningen Jū Hachi and Jinzōningen Jū Nana. Now they where born as Earthlings but they are not count as ningen. In English term's Android 17/18 are called android, but in reality they are really Cyborgs. And In Japanese they are called Jinzoningen but that some weird mix breed name?

Can you example better?

I've said this before, but it gets a bit complicated.

Terms like 'android' aren't as well defined as science fiction would tell you. Android simply means humanoid robot. Robot itself can mean anything programmable and built to do a specific task; it doesn't have to be made of metal. The first robots ever used in fiction were organic (not clones though, their flesh and muscles were 'spun' like wool and the resulting stuff was put together like a car to make a 'person').

So Gero using Android to describe all his creations isn't a stretch; he built them and he did so to have them perform a specific task (kill Goku?).

Cyborg is usually still more specific for 17 and 18, although I think the modern usage of cyborg/cybernetic is also quite simplified from what it was supposed to mean.