The video quality of Dragon Box spoil anyone else?

[pjay]

Considering the pic on the left was actually considered "great" quality back in 1999, I'm definitely more than spoiled by it.

Ah that takes me back. Btw, what player is that?

[Castor Troy]

-snip-

Considering the pic on the left was actually considered "great" quality back in 1999, I'm definitely more than spoiled by it.

Ah that takes me back. Btw, what player is that?

I just loaded one of my old amvs and the corresponding Dragon Box footage in Adobe Premiere CS5.

[pjay]

Thanks

[Budogenkai]

New Yu-Gi-Oh! releases with Japanese audio won't happen, period. The license to use Yugi's VA's voice expired and the Japanese company chose not to renew it. This is also why 4Kids' subtitled Yu-Gi-Oh project had to be cancelled.

Source? I remember hearing that 4kids stopped subbing it due to the fact that they were going to re-do the subtitles and stream them on Toonzaki.

[GizmoKSX]

*image comparison snipped*
Considering the pic on the left was actually considered "great" quality back in 1999, I'm definitely more than spoiled by it.

Please tell me that's just one disturbingly ugly frame and not representative of the whole transfer. Not that I'd be too surprised either way.

[Castor Troy]

*image comparison snipped*
Considering the pic on the left was actually considered "great" quality back in 1999, I'm definitely more than spoiled by it.

Please tell me that's just one disturbingly ugly frame and not representative of the whole transfer. Not that I'd be too surprised either way.

It was an old VHS capture at 160 x 120.

[MajinVejitaXV]

On that note, my opinion on that is... So what? So what if a company used DVNR to make something old look new? Does it still look good? If so, then why does it matter? Is it because it's "artificial?" Is it because it "removes grain which is part of the picture?" Those questions don't matter to me. I'm not concerned if grain is there or not. Grain is just grain. Like pickles on a burger. I'll eat it. But I don't care if it's there or not.

Pickles or grain don't enhance or detract from the experience, in my opinion. But I don't think pickles are any less of a valid hamburger topping. Long story short, DVNR gets a bad rep... I don't agree that it's a bad thing.

Allow me to retort with an analogy: Plastic Surgery.

Much like DVNR, it has beneficial uses. However, the problem arises when people take it too far. In our culture, we see celebrities of both sexes every day who subject themselves to unnecessary cosmetic surgeries and end up turning themselves into freaks of nature. Michael Jackson, Joan Rivers, Pamela Anderson, Tara Reid, etc. And why? More often then not, because of body dysmorphic disorder.

To a degree, that's almost what studios are exhibiting a film-based equivalent of. They think their movies that were shot on film aren't good enough, even if they've received accolades in the past, and are scrubbing them so they look new ('new' meaning 'digital'). Problem is, much like Marg Helgenberger's Botox injections, no one is fooled. And sure, just like there's some idiots out there cheering whenever Pamela Anderson bumps up the size of her implants ("YEAH! WE LIKE BIG TITTIES!"), there are some idiots who love everything squeaky clean without knowing what the hell they're talking about when they bitch and moan about film grain. Meanwhile the rest of us just sit here and wonder why they're changing anything to begin with, since there was nothing wrong.

And yes, I just used an analogy in which I compared the overuse of DVNR to fake tits. Enjoy.

[Raki]

isn't YuYu Hakusho shorter and newer?

The series was started at 94!

The anime series debuted in 1992 and ended in 1995.

[bkev]

Another issue is that many American cartoons don't receive respect from their current license holders. I've heard the current TMNT '80s series DVDs are often sourced from VHS, and that Speed Racer (I consider the adaptation an American product) from sped-up beta tapes! And don't even get me started on how X-Men comes with out-of-order episodes with poor PAL/NTSC conversion, resulting in "ghosting" and occasional speed-up.

So yes, the Dragonbox does spoil me. But only because so many other cartoons don't get proper releases.

[pjay]

Another issue is that many American cartoons don't receive respect from their current license holders. I've heard the current TMNT '80s series DVDs are often sourced from VHS, and that Speed Racer (I consider the adaptation an American product) from sped-up beta tapes! And don't even get me started on how X-Men comes with out-of-order episodes with poor PAL/NTSC conversion, resulting in "ghosting" and occasional speed-up.

So yes, the Dragonbox does spoil me. But only because so many other cartoons don't get proper releases.

Well, a lot of the DC Universe cartoon series after Batman TAS seemed to have gotten good to great releases especially Superman TAS and Justice League.

[baragon_kun]

Another issue is that many American cartoons don't receive respect from their current license holders. I've heard the current TMNT '80s series DVDs are often sourced from VHS, and that Speed Racer (I consider the adaptation an American product) from sped-up beta tapes! And don't even get me started on how X-Men comes with out-of-order episodes with poor PAL/NTSC conversion, resulting in "ghosting" and occasional speed-up.

So yes, the Dragonbox does spoil me. But only because so many other cartoons don't get proper releases.

Dont Forget the CRAPPY masters that DIC uses for his DVD releases of Captain N, AoStH, SonicStam, and the Super Mario Cartoons.

or the Disney Afternnon Cartoons DVD Releases, Ducktales for example (you know, the ones with 9 Sandwiched Interleaced Episodes in 1 Disc, that's pretty petty, i ve seen VHS tapes that looked better).

It's because in the US companies dont care about quality releases when it comes to Cartoon Shows, the parents will buy them anyway for their kids, regardless of the quality source of those.

[AnimeMaakuo]

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[Goku100xKamehameha]

Akira Toriyama is NOT the one who made the Dragon Boxes! It was Toei.

[MarcFBR]

Back to an earlier topic in the thread.

DVNR being specific to American stuff... hahahahaha.


It's actually becoming far more common in Japanese upscales, to the extent that some older Funi BDs look better in comparison (the older overfiltered muddy Funi BDs) than some current Japanese BDs.


As an example of something that isn't a newer release in Japan. Image comparisons have been done based on the fancy FMP BD box with Funi's trailer for their FMP box coming out soon, Funi's literally blows the Japanese release out of the water.

It's a complicated subject beyond the more basic one liners must people add to it.

I expect it will be coming to a head when the Aliens BD get released.

Aliens used a horrible filmstock (it was discontinued a year after it was created) that was insanely grainy. Ever since the original theatrical release it has been well known James Cameron hated the grain as it appeared in the film, not intending it to be anywhere near as grainy as it appeared (I believe he was once quoted in the 80s as saying something akin to wishing he could nuke away the grain, but the tech didn't exist to do it properly.)

It does now, and he oversaw it being done for the BD with an apparently deft hand.

Filtering isn't necessarily bad, it just needs to be done right for any given release. Especially when you consider many shows/films were made with inherently different goals than being viewed on a 1080p digital monitor.

Animeigo and Macross is another specific case (which was partially mentioned earlier.) They did the best they could with the ratty masters they had access to. Wasn't a case of a different belief in how to remaster content than the Japanese company. It was a release where due to various legal complications, they had access to very specific masters and that was it. The fact that years later the Japanese studio that made the show did their own with much better masters doesn't say they did a better job than Animeigo, just that the final product came out better (which it should have been, they had better masters.)

There are stacks of examples, these are just a few.


Plus... there are tons of releases that blow the Dragon Boxes out of the water. It is awesome for what we expect for Dragon Ball, but plenty of cel anime from before, after, and the same era got far better remasters.


Also, someone mentioned the YYH remaster appeared to be DVNRed based on the OP on Youtube... you can't really judge it on that. Having something being re-compressed to a significantly smaller size tends to introduce artifacts that often give the appearance of blurryness, which can, at times, look identical to DVNR.

[AnimeMaakuo]

.

[MarcFBR]

I think you may have some good points. But the Japanese Dragon Box is the way it is. I don't care what other people say about other Anime shows being " Better " or what not. I think it's special to watch it how It is. Grain has no problem for me. I think of it as Classic in a way. If you think Kai blows Dragon Boxes out of the water, then that's your opinion. I like my Original shows untouched and not tampered with.

I'm also from Japan, so I proudly support my Dragon Box sets

The initial post for this thread was about the Dragon Box being superior to other cel based remasters, which is why I pointed that out at the end. It is a great remaster, for Dragon Ball. Plenty of other shows have had far superior remasters.

Doesn't make the DBZ remaster bad by any means.

[AnimeMaakuo]

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[MarcFBR]

What is your opinion about Funimation and the Japanese Dragon Boxes, what are your thoughts about it?
I'm curious. I won't judge.

Outside of being framed a few pixels differently and the brightness being at a different level they are effectively identical visually.

[Goku100xKamehameha]

What is your opinion about Funimation and the Japanese Dragon Boxes, what are your thoughts about it?
I'm curious. I won't judge.

Outside of being framed a few pixels differently and the brightness being at a different level they are effectively identical visually.

He's asking your about Kai and the Japanese Dragon Boxes, Why did you change it?

[Metalwario64]

What is your opinion about Funimation and the Japanese Dragon Boxes, what are your thoughts about it?
I'm curious. I won't judge.

Outside of being framed a few pixels differently and the brightness being at a different level they are effectively identical visually.

He's asking your about Kai and the Japanese Dragon Boxes, Why did you change it?

Probably AnimeMaakuo edited the post right before MarcFBR responded.