"Gotenks surpassing Vegeta and the others".

[Herms]

When did that happen, anyway? I don't remember that at all.

As far as I know, it happens twice:

The anime changes Kaiosin's quote, adding "strongest" on top of the quote that originally only called Pure Buu the most dangerous.

Goku states that Pure Buu is on a "whole different level from all the Buus up 'till now" in their fight.

Sorry, I wasn't clear. I meant when does the Grand Kaio suggest they use Fusion to fight pure Boo?

[RandomGuy96]

He probably meant Elder Kaioshin. I see a lot of people calling him "Grand Kai".

[Zantetsuken]

When did that happen, anyway? I don't remember that at all.

As far as I know, it happens twice:

The anime changes Kaiosin's quote, adding "strongest" on top of the quote that originally only called Pure Buu the most dangerous.

Goku states that Pure Buu is on a "whole different level from all the Buus up 'till now" in their fight.

Sorry, I wasn't clear. I meant when does the Grand Kaio suggest they use Fusion to fight pure Boo?

He tells Kaioshinn to give Goku and Vegeta the earrings. He suggested it twice, once as soon as Buu appears and starts to destory the Earth. He does it again after Kaioshinn brings them back, and they are watching Buu rebuild himself. He again makes another comment after being trasported to another planet "they are not even going to fuse" and later gets upset for Goku trying to fight Buu 1vs1.
So 2 and a half times?

[Zantetsuken]

How does that implies? They was obviouly talking about Ssj forms. Mystic is not a form.

Like I said - if Gohan was the benchmark, they would have stated it. But to have something more powerful than a Sayjin at SSJ3? That's incredible.

Goku is the only non fusion SSJ3 and is the main character. They wanted a stronger form for GOKU. Not to mention they Forgot about Mystic

Goku is the strongest period. What are you trying to argue - They made Goku stronger for JUST this and every other movie, and the End of Z...and for the Buu Saga.

[TheGmGoken]

Goku is the strongest period. What are you trying to argue - They made Goku stronger for JUST this and every other movie, and the End of Z...and for the Buu Saga.

So even when Goku said someone is stronger than himself while other character whoop the character(That Goku said was stronge) ass. Goku is still stronger? Lolwut?

[Zantetsuken]

Goku is the strongest period. What are you trying to argue - They made Goku stronger for JUST this and every other movie, and the End of Z...and for the Buu Saga.

So even when Goku said someone is stronger than himself while other character whoop the character(That Goku said was stronge) ass. Goku is still stronger? Lolwut?

Later retconned into Goku admitting he was more powerful than he let on. Once on his own confession, again with Vegeta's comments, and again with the comments in regards to Pure Buu's power. Goku even suggest bring BOTH GOTENKS AND GOHAN to fight Buu. This guy is obviously not 1 shot material like SuperBuu was.

[RandomGuy96]

Later retconned into Goku admitting he was more powerful than he let on.

Funny. You keep throwing that around, but Goku never contradicted his previous statement that Super Buu would kick his ass, and reinforces it several times.

[Zantetsuken]

Later retconned into Goku admitting he was more powerful than he let on.

Funny. You keep throwing that around, but Goku never contradicted his previous statement that Super Buu would kick his ass, and reinforces it several times.

Except I did^ the post right above yours. The anime supports this, Vegeta's comments support this, Goku's comments on fighting fatbuu support this, and his comments in relation to Gotenks and Gohan HELPING him fight Buu support this.

[TheGmGoken]

Later retconned into Goku admitting he was more powerful than he let on.

Funny. You keep throwing that around, but Goku never contradicted his previous statement that Super Buu would kick his ass, and reinforces it several times.

Except I did^ the post right above yours. The anime supports this, Vegeta's comments support this, Goku's comments on fighting fatbuu support this, and his comments in relation to Gotenks and Gohan HELPING him fight Buu support this.

Stop using the anime. I'm talking about the MANGA. The anime contradict the manga A LOT of times. Goku stated that Super Boo can kick his ass before Boo told him that size decrease his Ki. Yet Gohan and Gotenks beat Super Boo.

[RandomGuy96]

The anime means nothing. Vegeta's comments do not, and Goku never says anything about Gohan and Gotenks "helping". He simply says that the most rational decision, or at least the one he thought Vegeta was going for, was to bring his sons back, so they can fight. Neither Vegeta nor Goku doubt this will work, and in fact Vegeta clarifies his exact reason for not bringing them. It has nothing to do with their chances of success.

Cut all of the assumptions. Show me where Goku says he could beat Super Buu. We have several statements outright saying he couldn't, from him and everyone else; show me one, just one statement where he says he was lying about being able to beat Super like he was about Fat.

[Zantetsuken]

Stop using the anime. I'm talking about the MANGA. The anime contradict the manga A LOT of times. Goku stated that Super Boo can kick his ass before Boo told him that size decrease his Ki. Yet Gohan and Gotenks beat Super Boo.

I'm using the anime to suppliment what is said in the manga, not contradict it. Everthing I have posted appears in both unless otherwise noted.

[TheGmGoken]

Stop using the anime. I'm talking about the MANGA. The anime contradict the manga A LOT of times. Goku stated that Super Boo can kick his ass before Boo told him that size decrease his Ki. Yet Gohan and Gotenks beat Super Boo.

I'm using the anime to suppliment what is said in the manga, not contradict it. Everthing I have posted appears in both unless otherwise noted.

Anime Goku said Pure Boo > Boohan. C'mon now.

[Zantetsuken]

The anime means nothing. Vegeta's comments do not, and Goku never says anything about Gohan and Gotenks "helping". He simply says that the most rational decision, or at least the one he thought Vegeta was going for, was to bring his sons back, so they can fight. Neither Vegeta nor Goku doubt this will work, and in fact Vegeta clarifies his exact reason for not bringing them. It has nothing to do with their chances of success.

Cut all of the assumptions. Show me where Goku says he could beat Super Buu. We have several statements outright saying he couldn't, from him and everyone else; show me one, just one statement where he says he was lying about being able to beat Super like he was about Fat.

The anime means something to ME, and that's what I care about. You can continue to ignore whatever you like because you don't like what it says or implies. Why are you so bent out of shape with this, Goku is the hero as AT wanted and they story is clearly written to support that idea? What use would a weak hero be versus the next threat?

And Goku absolutely suggest that Gohan and gotenks should be wished back to HELP. Actually, Goku in my translated copy says "I know! You'll get Gotenks AND Gohan to fight with us" Why not JUST Gohan? Why Gotenks as well? Why does Goku go for a Spirt Bomb which hasn't ever killed anyone in the manga thus far? Seriously, you're reaching so far here man.

[Zantetsuken]

Stop using the anime. I'm talking about the MANGA. The anime contradict the manga A LOT of times. Goku stated that Super Boo can kick his ass before Boo told him that size decrease his Ki. Yet Gohan and Gotenks beat Super Boo.

I'm using the anime to suppliment what is said in the manga, not contradict it. Everthing I have posted appears in both unless otherwise noted.

Anime Goku said Pure Boo > Boohan. C'mon now.

Anime Goku's powers are Maximum. He fused with Broli.

[TheGmGoken]

Your translated copy? What source is it?
Viz?
Illegal manga sites?

Anime Goku's powers are Maximum. He fused with Broli.

Ok. I'm not trying to break the rules. But just for this I'm done with this debate. You aren't serious are you?!

[Zantetsuken]

Your translated copy? What source is it?
Viz?
Illegal manga sites?

Viz.

[TheGmGoken]

Your translated copy? What source is it?
Viz?
Illegal manga sites?

Viz.

If I'm correct. Viz is only 70% Translated correctly.

[Super Saiyan Turlast x4]

Gohan and Gotenks would've been the only ones fighting Boo. Goku and Vegeta were totally useless at that point.

The Gohan and Gotenks quote:

Chapter: 514 (DBZ 320), P7.4
Context: after Vegeta has the Earth brought back with the dragonballs
Goku: “Oh, I know! You’ll bring Gohan and Gotenks back to life so they can fight.”
Vegeta: “No.”

[Zantetsuken]

Your translated copy? What source is it?
Viz?
Illegal manga sites?

Viz.

If I'm correct. Viz is only 70% Translated correctly.

You're probably not right, and I'm not saying that to be rude. But what are you basing this on? Where did you get the an arbitrary number like 70% from? Even the scanslations say the same thing FYI

[TheGmGoken]

I think Herms or SaiyaJedi said it. Also please tell me you aren't serious bout Goku being maximum