My Podcast Idea

[Li'l Lemmy]

Y'know, I'm not sure where this was supposed to go. This doesn't pertain to any one podcast and thus probably doesn't belong in any particular podcast thread, so I figured the General Discussion forum might suit it best. But feel free to say otherwise.

Mike and Meri, Julian-sama:

I recently upgraded to a broadband internet connection, which means that without the hindrance of slow dial-up I've been able to download more than just the occasional podcast. I've even begun listening to much older episodes. No two podcasts are the same, but there is a consistency with regards to the increasing professionalism and super happy fun-time goodness of your off-the-wall antics and general craziness. My long overdue compliment is this: Kudos to you for doing something truly original with regards to Dragonball and showing an enthusiasm for what you do, and keep up the good work.

That being said, a thought occurs. I've enjoyed your reviews of Super DBZ and Sparking! NEO with their colorful commentary and occasional fanboy whining. (Please ignore the fact that though NEO in particular didn't turn out to something timeless, I'm going to be a sucker and buy it anyway.)

So if this has been mentioned already elsewhere, then I apologize . . . but I was thinking that on a slow week or a month without any releases you would consider squeezing in something of a "retro review" for games that came out before the podcast was started, like Budokai 3 or even one of the Super Famicom games. (Super Butoden 2, anyone?) I'm sure I'm not the only one who would enjoy hearing the DaizenshuuEX take on past games.

What do you think? What do other people think?

Perhaps this thread could be dedicated to podcast ideas from fans and made into a sticky.

[chibi_goten]

I think this idea is lame, and boring.

Sorry but that is just my take. I know people like to listen to the reviews of games, but I want to play them for myself and get into them and explore them.

Also my ideas and opinions on the game are going to be different to other peoples for example some people prefer Budokai 3 some prefer Sparkling. When people don't like certain aspects they bitch about it, where as some one else might love that aspect. That’s another reason I don't like listening to reviews, they are just one persons opinions really.

I know some of you disagree with this and will probably moan and say ''but I love the reviews...'' or '' it's not just one person’s opinion''. I know you will so don't waste your time. I bet some of you do love Mike's reviews, but I and probably some other people don’t.

Now back to your idea, covering old retro games, lets say a topic about well I don't know, just take Hyper Dimension as an example, does anyone really care and want to listen about this?

[desirecampbell]

Now back to your idea, covering old retro games, lets say a topic about well I don't know, just take Hyper Dimension as an example, does anyone really care and want to listen about this?

Yes. Me, for one.

I like the idea of reviewing older games. I think that reviewing games years after they've been released is just as important as reviewing them as soon as they come out. A review of an old game can show how well it's held up over the years, how things have changed in the industry since its release. For example, a review of 'Sparking! NEO' now would be "it's bad, but I'm very excited to play it", while a review in five years time would be "it sucks, period". Its the same game, just from a different perspective.

Also my ideas and opinions on the game are going to be different to other peoples for example some people prefer Budokai 3 some prefer Sparkling. When people don't like certain aspects they bitch about it, where as some one else might love that aspect. That’s another reason I don't like listening to reviews, they are just one persons opinions really.

That's what a review could be, not what it should be. Why do people respect Ebert's reviews? Because he doesn't just say "this movie sucked" he explains why it sucked, and gives examples. He cites other works as examples of how to properly execute something in film.

This is something that is done in good videogame reviews as well. This is something Mike does too. He doesn't just say "Sparking! NEO sucks", he explains its shortcomings and compares it to other games to highlight these faults.

A review is an opinion piece based in factual evidence. The more relevant examples that can be given, the better the review is.

[Li'l Lemmy]

I think this idea is lame, and boring.

Sorry but that is just my take. I know people like to listen to the reviews of games, but I want to play them for myself and get into them and explore them.

I asked for your opinion. There's no need to be sorry about it. So long as he's not going out of his way to be cruel about it, I'd rather a person would say what he's thinking rather than falsely agree or sugarcoat the truth just to be nice.

Also my ideas and opinions on the game are going to be different to other peoples for example some people prefer Budokai 3 some prefer Sparkling. When people don't like certain aspects they bitch about it, where as some one else might love that aspect. That’s another reason I don't like listening to reviews, they are just one persons opinions really.

Oh, I agree. I actually loved the first Sparking!, despite that a lot of people will compare it rather unfavorably to Budokai 3. But I don't mind a derogatory opinion if it's laid out with as much fun and enthusiasm as with what the Big Three use in their podcasts.

I know some of you disagree with this and will probably moan and say ''but I love the reviews...'' or '' it's not just one person’s opinion''. I know you will so don't waste your time. I bet some of you do love Mike's reviews, but I and probably some other people don’t.

Nothing wrong with that. I doubt those of us who do are going to take issue with it. Oh, well . . . what does everyone else think?

Now back to your idea, covering old retro games, lets say a topic about well I don't know, just take Hyper Dimension as an example, does anyone really care and want to listen about this?

Reply= Everything desirecampbell said.

EDIT: (Dammit, chibi_goten, where did you get that avatar? I don't recognize the art.)

[VegettoEX]

I gotta say, there doesn't seem to be a middle-ground on game reviews. People either eat them up, or can't care any less.

I'm not going to NOT review new games, since they're so important to DB fandom as a whole throughout the world right now. Plus, I like games . I don't think there was much concern about that, anyway.

I will say that whenever we review a game, we intentionally try and throw some other really great (funny?) stuff in the episode to keep other people enthralled. We really do strive for balance.

As far as older game reviews, it's something I've thought about since the very beginning of the podcast. I'd like to do it, since I'm so ridiculously familiar with a lot of the games, and what I always envisioned my target audience as (read: me) would probably find it interesting. I don't have any immediate plans to do any, but it's definitely on my mind. Like I mentioned before, if we were to do something like that, we'd totally balance out the episode with other fun things (more e-mails, a funny Top 5, etc.).

Thoughts?

[Li'l Lemmy]

I will say that whenever we review a game, we intentionally try and throw some other really great (funny?) stuff in the episode to keep other people enthralled. We really do strive for balance.

And that's great. I like game reviews, but I don't think you'd want an episode to be without the usual podcast stuff too. I know I wouldn't.

As far as older game reviews, it's something I've thought about since the very beginning of the podcast. I'd like to do it, since I'm so ridiculously familiar with a lot of the games, and what I always envisioned my target audience as (read: me) would probably find it interesting. I don't have any immediate plans to do any, but it's definitely on my mind. Like I mentioned before, if we were to do something like that, we'd totally balance out the episode with other fun things (more e-mails, a funny Top 5, etc.).

Clearly, you sound as though you'd like to try it at least once. If you aren't sure about listener reaction, one option is to perhaps do a limited version for just that once and read the reactions in that podcast's thread. Myself, I would use a "popular" title that most DBZ fans know and might care to hear about as a retro review debut, but you could always just go in order too or simply start off with your favorite game of all time.

Your strategy is just fine, I think. If there's other things in the podcasts to keep people entertained, then I think they'll listen through the review too. (You might even get people wanting to listen to another one.) The first podcast with a retro review should probably contain more of that "other" category, just so that the review ends up sharing time rather than eating most of it . . . if you're worried about turning off people who don't care about reviews, that is.

The other thing is . . . and this is important:

It's your podcast. You can do what you want, really! Keeping listener consideration in mind is great, but it's still about DaizenshuuEX. This isn't a democracy.

Thoughts?

It's only my opinion. But I would enjoy such a thing.

[DaemonCorps]

I will say that whenever we review a game, we intentionally try and throw some other really great (funny?) stuff in the episode to keep other people enthralled. We really do strive for balance.

[...]

Like I mentioned before, if we were to do something like that, we'd totally balance out the episode with other fun things (more e-mails, a funny Top 5, etc.).

That's cool. As I mentioned somewhere before, I'm not much of a gamer, so the game reviews as a whole kinda bore me. However, I still enjoy hearing you guys nitpicking at things like the details and some of the stuff that just stuck out to you in the game (Kiwi's distraction attack seems pretty interesting, especially since he actually did that in the manga).

But yeah, I do think balancing the game review episodes with other stuff is a must. For example, the main reason(s) why I'm keeping episode 48 is because of that hilarious top 5 and manga reading . And don't get me started with the whole Godfather/Saichouro.

And as for those retro game reviews, I'll just say to try and keep it interesting for passerby DB-gamers and make sure to make everything else funny, too (I'm saying this like it's nothing for you guys!).

[Tanooki Kuribo]

I actually skipped through the Sparking Neo review for week two cause I just coulndt stand to here more about it. Maybe I just dont like the new games as much as the old 2-D fighting games. I'd love to hear a retro reveiw, even if there not a whole epiosde long just a few minutes, it'd be cool.

With that said, I know I'll still buy Sparking Neo when it comes out here, play it for like 2 hours, go to bed and never play it ever again.

[chibi_goten]

I'm not going to NOT review new games, since they're so important to DB fandom as a whole throughout the world right now. Plus, I like games . I don't think there was much concern about that, anyway.

Most people will be desperate to hear your reviews, since you get the game before a lot of them and they want to hear what it is about as they haven't bourght the game yet as they like to wait untill it gets released in their own country. The audience also like to have some one who has played the Dragonball games before and has experience, can compare, and knows what they are talking about.

I agree this is important, it's big Dragonball news and deserves it's own topic.

As far as older game reviews, it's something I've thought about since the very beginning of the podcast. I'd like to do it

Older games are old news, not as important. I bet most of the fans haven't even heard of some of them. Just the old die hards. I bet a lot of people would like to hear it coverd but I wouldn't. I have played the games so I know for myself, and I think a lot of other people who have already played the games wouldn't like to hear the review of them either.

I think that the people who would like to hear the review is a handfull of people that haven't had the oppertunity to play the game. Why would people be intrested if they have played the game and know what it is like, and can judge for themselfs?

Thoughts?

I think you should cover them but try to get them all into one episode and just compare and discuss the different styles etc with a fun top 5 and a few more e-mails like you said.

[VegettoEX]

Just to put this out there...

When I listen to other anime podcasts, something I hear all the freakin' time is people e-mailing/calling in and saying, "Can you review [insert show here]? It's my favorite show ever!"

Now... if it's their favorite show... they've clearly already seen it and know that they like it... so why is it that they want a review of it?

People want to hear good things about stuff they already like.

Of course, I'm a dick, because I'm completely honest about things and have absolutely no problem trashing the fanboy-dream that is Sparking! NEO . But the fact remains that it's a DBZ show, and people want to hear about it. I've got both ends of the spectrum here... some people are dying to hear about the old games, and some aren't. Some people hate the music episodes, some people love them. What I take pride in is being a well-rounded fan for so disgustingly long, and I'm happy to be able to do something for these people every once in a while.

Hopefully, if you come across an episode of something you're just not that interested in, you'll come back next week, anyway, to find something that you do like!

[chibi_goten]

So basically they are going to happen some time or another, a lot of people want to hear them. It covers Dragonball, that's what the podcast is about and if you don't feel like listening, hey don't worry you can listen to the next episode which will hit something you do like (basically going back to normal, not a review episode).

Yeah that's cool, I guess this thread is over now.

[DBZ MAN]

Maybe it is, maybe it isn't. I don't see why you had to repeat what EX basically said even when your view was not to have old game reviews.

[Mr.Piccolo]

Well, maybe not game reviews but mabye an episode dedicated to past games and how they evolved to what they are now. There can be a feature on Atari and Bandai and how they played a part with the production of DragonBall games...

[chibi_goten]

Maybe it is, maybe it isn't. I don't see why you had to repeat what EX basically said even when your view was not to have old game reviews.

Well if you read it, it shows I have noticed what he said, respected his thourghts on the idea, agreed with him and understood where he is coming from.

It shows that I understand peoples points of views and although I was against the idea at first. I have read the posts from Li'l Lemmy, desirecampbell,VegettoEX and have changed my opinion and can see why it is worth covering the old games ( just one episode though ).

I also read the post from DaemonCorps, which showed that people who are not gamers or not serious gamers still enjoy the review podcasts.

That is what I posted for DBZ MAN, to show that although I was against the idea, with peoples thourghts and opinions it made me change how I felt about it.

[Kula]

Hopefully, if you come across an episode of something you're just not that interested in, you'll come back next week, anyway, to find something that you do like!

I listen to every episode all the way through. I rarely find the subject matter boring because it's so varied. I also like to llisten because you, Meri and Julian are so damned entertaining. If you were boring and didn't have a sense of humour, I wouldn't be listening.

As for the game reviews, if people aren't keen on individual reviews being spread out over several podcasts, why not do 1 or 2 episodes summarising the games? Point out their strengths/weaknesses/characters/gameplay etc. I'm not a huge fan of old school games but if some of them were recommended i'd probably try to track them down.

[DBZ MAN]

Maybe it is, maybe it isn't. I don't see why you had to repeat what EX basically said even when your view was not to have old game reviews.

Well if you read it, it shows I have noticed what he said, respected his thourghts on the idea, agreed with him and understood where he is coming from.

It shows that I understand peoples points of views and although I was against the idea at first. I have read the posts from Li'l Lemmy, desirecampbell,VegettoEX and have changed my opinion and can see why it is worth covering the old games ( just one episode though ).

I also read the post from DaemonCorps, which showed that people who are not gamers or not serious gamers still enjoy the review podcasts.

That is what I posted for DBZ MAN, to show that although I was against the idea, with peoples thourghts and opinions it made me change how I felt about it.

Ahh, then my apologies chibi_goten for misunderstanding.

[Li'l Lemmy]

Of course, I'm a dick . . .

His legend lives on.

. . . because I'm completely honest about things and have absolutely no problem trashing the fanboy-dream that is Sparking! NEO. But the fact remains that it's a DBZ show, and people want to hear about it.

This isn't necessarily the Golden Age of DBZ, but it's certainly an active one as far as the fan community goes . . . whether that community be dwindling or not. I think it's a great time for new and creative ways to express DBZ, a great time for thoughts and opinions about DBZ, and a great time for people to listen and discuss DBZ. The Podcast gives us all a unique opportunity for all three.

If it had started back when DBZ was Where It's At, I don't think the podcast could have had as much value as it could potentially have today. It may even have been lost in the shuffle, so to speak. Say what you will about DBZ's popularity; I personally think this is THE perfect time for your podcast to exist.

Which is why I think it's important to explore any ideas you may have but haven't acted on and to continually do so. While it isn't hard for me to imagine that I could enjoy podcasts NOT reporting on the news of the moment, NOT taking the time for e-mails or a Top 5, NOT doing any special
features . . . and simply being a mouthpiece to merely talk about "just" the manga and anime (one episode about Gohan's character arc, another about dub vs. sub, and so on), as a listener I like the idea of DaizenshuuEX keeping a bead on the modern DBZ and dishing out what's going on in the Dragon World. I like the thought of branching out into other aspects of the show that I might not be particularly aware of, such as the original BGM or the right way to make an AMV. I like the notion of hosts who enjoy the show enough that they can connect with it on a personal enough level to go into the obscure or unknown, like retro gaming reviews-- that the show can do all this without necessarily worrying from week to week about whether people enjoy this segment as much as that one, even if you do still monitor our responses regularly to keep an idea of what works and what doesn't.

I might not like everything that's on my plate, but if looking at it makes me feel full before I sit down to eat then I'm happy, and more and more I think of the podcast as something that's becoming well-rounded and evolving. I'm into that, even if I'm not big on this or that or a particular thing. Fresh, inventive, atypical.

I've got both ends of the spectrum here... some people are dying to hear about the old games, and some aren't. Some people hate the music episodes, some people love them. What I take pride in is being a well-rounded fan for so disgustingly long, and I'm happy to be able to do something for these people every once in a while.

Hopefully, if you come across an episode of something you're just not that interested in, you'll come back next week, anyway, to find something that you do like!

Aside from DVD releases, the games are the biggest things that can happen these days. Realistically, you can't be expected not to comment on them. But if you and Meri and Julian like the older games too, then by all means I think you should comment. Those of us who have been listening to the podcast for even just a few episodes will come back next week if they don't like what's playing this week, I guarantee. I can't see anyone turning off the podcast permanently based on whether or not they care about the experimental subject material one particular week: I think-- this is just my opinion, I know-- that it has enough substance now where the style has become endearing and worth looking in on.

There's a decent amount of things going on during any given month that can (and do) fill out the episodes and keep them from being complete randomness, but during the weeks that there just isn't much news or material on I think it'd be just fine to recap old news and indulge in something new-- like a game review or a music retrospective-- as you have done in the past.

[Li'l Lemmy]

Hmm. In addition to my previous thoughts:

I still say that you should do as you would normally do without worry. But if you really are interested in or concerned about listeners' opinions regarding the matter, you could use them as a springboard with which to launch your first review. Newer reviews need to be done when the games are released (or at least, that's the pattern you've established), but clearly the older games are like a library from which you can pick and choose at random.

So if your mind is set on doing at least one, utilize that freedom to both the listeners' advantage and your own. Here's a hypothetical example: Instead of hinting here and there that you've been thinking about it, mention in an upcoming podcast that you will in fact be doing a retro review of a classic DBZ game in the near future, and offer listeners a few weeks' chance to chime in with their choices for which game they'd want reviewed first and why. Tell them you want to know what they think. I'm sure you'll have no shortage of e-mails. It wouldn't necessarily be a binding vote, but it would still give you an opportunity to get an idea of what people are thinking when it comes to games (as well as weed out any "review this because I love it!" type opinions). You could even read some of these opinions on the air in the weeks leading up to your choice review to "hype" the episode . . . though truthfully I'm not sure hype has any actual value to you, since the Podcast is clearly more about having fun than anything else.

This particular strategy of listener interaction also carries the benefit of people actually making a choice; you're more likely to get actual picks rather than people sending in reasons why they do or don't actually want reviews in the first place, and the level of response could allow to gauge just how popular or unpopular the general idea is.

Though perhaps you've gone over all this in your own mind already. (*shrugs*) Any thoughts?



(I wonder. Does it look as though I'm pushing for this a little too hard?)

[VegettoEX]

No, I really like that idea. I have a couple thoughts on which games would be easiest for me to review, and I actually think those specific ones would be the games people would request reviews of.

Podcast listeners always like to feel that they have some type of connection with a show's content, whether or not that means that they request something, or have that tight of a love for the general topic that it doesn't matter which direction it goes in. I really strive for both on our show.

As an avid podcast listener for quite a long period of time (well, relatively speaking, considering the age of the medium...), I really like to think that I've considered long and hard exactly what it is about shows that I like and dislike. I wouldn't say that I've flat-out copied things from other shows, but I definitely have a good feel for what DOESN'T work for me as a listener. Just like with AMVs, you really have to take a step back and look at (listen to?) your product from a different perspective... the audience's perspective. Is this something I want to watch / listen to? Why? What draws me in? What doesn't?

I guess I'm leaking a few "secrets" about how I work the show, but that's OK . If you're reading this much, you're entitled.

In the long run, I'm totally flattered that some of you are really gung-ho about letting us do what we want to do. We definitely have a crap-ton of fun DOING the show, which was the first priority for me... if it wasn't entertaining to DO and MAKE, it certainly wouldn't give me any further incentive to work on it. From there, I wanted to make sure there'd be some type of audience... luckily, we've got a pretty well built-in initial audience. As I mentioned earlier, I geared the show towards myself... what would *I* want to listen to? If I want it, surely someone else out there does.

But anyway... yeah! I don't think I have any further coherent things to say on the matter. By all means, pop in.

[Tanooki Kuribo]

I actually skipped through the Sparking Neo review for week two cause I just coulndt stand to here more about it.

Hmm, reading back on that it kinda sounds insulting. Hope you didn't take it like that. I love the Podcast, just didn't feel like listening to more Sparking Neo news.