Ki vs Chi

Super Sonic · Post by **Super Sonic** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 12:50 am

Some things like names are ok to keep. Others just sound like when they are complained about are usually the rantings of Japanophiles though. Like when guys were complaining about Funimation saying "Wolf Fang Fist" instead of "Roga fufu ken" which means "Fist of the Wolf Fang".

Olivier Hague · Post by **Olivier Hague** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 2:25 am

desirecampbell wrote:There are a lot of terms that don't really need to be translated. Like, 'Shinigami' - how hard would it be to explain that it means death god?

But... It's a Western concept to begin with! ^^;

DB centric, I think Jinzoningen should've been kept.

Er... Sorry, but I totally disagree. Especially considering the fact the Red Ribbon army is clearly "Western".
And it just seems very lazy to do that, for a translator...

And then there's no confusion over "Android" or "Cyborg" or "Robot".

That's not much of an issue, in my opinion. We can just call them all "Androids". After all, even those who are technically cyborgs are treated by Dr. Gero as if they were mere robots (they were ripped of their own names, for one thing).

Swift · Post by **Swift** » Sat Nov 25, 2006 3:57 am

The whole Ki/Chi thing's already been explained. Ki is the Japanese reading, and Chi is the Chinese reading, which Viz went with because it was more well-known. Djinn isn't so much a translation as it is an interpretation of Majin. What does "Majin" literally mean? Roughly "demon(ic)/magic(al) being". If they wanted to call him the "Demon-Being Buu", fine by me. But Djinn is not necessarily the same thing as a Majin... Its meaning is also much more specific, I believe. Buu may be a demon-being or magic-being, but a Djinn is a very specific kind of magic-being. So, really, it's not a direct translation of Majin.

Like when guys were complaining about Funimation saying "Wolf Fang Fist" instead of "Roga fufu ken" which means "Fist of the Wolf Fang".

No... Rôga-ken would mean "Wolf Fang Fist" or "Fist of the Wolf Fang", both of which are viable translations. Rôga-fûfû-ken means "Wolf Fang Hurricane Fist" or, perhaps, "Fist of the Wolf Fang Hurricane" (note that hurricane is interchangable with any other strong wind, such as a gale like Viz used). It's not the word order, which can be translated a number of ways, it's the missing word.

Olivier Hague · Post by **Olivier Hague** » Sat Nov 25, 2006 1:15 pm

Swift wrote:Djinn isn't so much a translation as it is an interpretation of Majin.

Then again, most translations from Japanese are interpretations at least to some degree, if you go there.. ^^;

Djinn is not necessarily the same thing as a Majin... Its meaning is also much more specific, I believe.

That is true.

it's not a direct translation of Majin.

No, it's not... but what is, then? ^^;
If you don't want to keep the Japanese "majin" in the translation (and apart from the fact the name is spelled "Majin-Boo" on official merchandise, I don't see any more reasons to keep it than to keep "madôshi"), how would you translate it? The literal "magical being" would be a bit awkward, in my opinion.

"Djinn" isn't the only possible translation for "majin", but it is one of them (like I said, the word "genie"/"djinn" often becomes "majin" in Japanese), and there are several visual details in the manga that could arguably be linked to the "genie"/"djinn" tales.
So I don't understand why people are scandalized by that translation choice. 'Seems rather harsh to me.

Post by **desirecampbell** » Sat Nov 25, 2006 1:26 pm

Olivier Hague wrote:So I don't understand why people are scandalized by that translation choice. 'Seems rather harsh to me.

Actually, I thought about this during the 'widescreen' discussions.

It's not a big deal, really. It's so slight that it really wouldn't matter if you didn't know beforehand, there might be a few little things that seem 'off' (heads getting cut off/all them Ms) but for the most part it's fine.

It's just that doing it was extra work that never needed to be done. It's that frustrated "why?!" feeling.

Swift · Post by **Swift** » Sat Nov 25, 2006 4:16 pm

Then again, most translations from Japanese are interpretations at least to some degree, if you go there.. ^^;

True, but Djinn is too much of an interpretation. I personally like to choose whatever is closer to a translation than an interpretation. And since such a choice exists, why use Djinn?

No, it's not... but what is, then? ^^;

I don't see what would be the problem with just using Majin and putting "Majin=Demon/magic-being" as a footnote... They do that for attacks often. If you really want to translate it, I'd just keep it "Demon-being Buu".

If you don't want to keep the Japanese "majin" in the translation (and apart from the fact the name is spelled "Majin-Boo" on official merchandise, I don't see any more reasons to keep it than to keep "madôshi"), how would you translate it? The literal "magical being" would be a bit awkward, in my opinion.

I think the Majin in Majin Buu is kind of part of his name, like the Daimaô in Piccolo Daimaô (which I personally would keep untranslated but with a footnote). As I said before, though, I think "Demon-being Buu" or "Buu the Demon-being" would be fine (or "Magic-being" if you prefer). It's a direct translation with little interpretation that, at least to me, doesn't sound any more akward than the "Great Demon King" translation of Daimaô.

Suupaa Gohan 2 · Post by **Suupaa Gohan 2** » Sun Nov 26, 2006 4:07 pm

I was raised on calling it "Ki", so Ki it is. XD Hey, DBZ is a product of Japan, whether it takes PLACE in Japan or not, and just because "Chi" is more well-known in the Western world, I just don't think a Chinese word fits with the Dragonball spirit. But that's just me, I guess. *shrug*

Not a fan of VIZ and their translations, anyways...I mean, after what they did to Bleach and Naruto (not that I'm saying they're BAD, either, but again, not what I'm used to for either Manga), I'm just not a fan of their style, I guess.

Plus, Mr. Satan was actually called HER-CULE in the English Manga...that warrants me enough ability to say VIZ's translation of DBZ isn't the absolute Word of God, I think.

Olivier Hague · Post by **Olivier Hague** » Sun Nov 26, 2006 9:57 pm

Suupaa Gohan 2 wrote:I was raised on calling it "Ki", so Ki it is. XD Hey, DBZ is a product of Japan, whether it takes PLACE in Japan or not, and just because "Chi" is more well-known in the Western world, I just don't think a Chinese word fits with the Dragonball spirit.

Well, there are a few Chinese names in the series...
Does that mean "chi" sould be used over "ki"? Or an English translation of "ki"? That's another problem...

Plus, Mr. Satan was actually called HER-CULE in the English Manga...that warrants me enough ability to say VIZ's translation of DBZ isn't the absolute Word of God, I think.

I wasn't trying to say that Viz's translation was the "word of god"! I was simply defending them concerning the "djinn" thing, here. ^^;
As for "Hercule"... Well, who's really to blame? Viz, or bigotry?

Suupaa Gohan 2 · Post by **Suupaa Gohan 2** » Mon Nov 27, 2006 10:08 am

Olivier Hague wrote:
Suupaa Gohan 2 wrote:I was raised on calling it "Ki", so Ki it is. XD Hey, DBZ is a product of Japan, whether it takes PLACE in Japan or not, and just because "Chi" is more well-known in the Western world, I just don't think a Chinese word fits with the Dragonball spirit.
Well, there are a few Chinese names in the series...
Does that mean "chi" sould be used over "ki"? Or an English translation of "ki"? That's another problem...

Hm, that's a good point. Well I see it as early DB was based highly on Chinese legends, considered it's based off Journey to the West, and among other things, Gokou's name, Shenlong, the names of all the Dragonballs and the like are named from Chinese counterparts...

But by the time Ki really became PREVALENT throughout DB (not when Gokou first learned the KameHame Ha, more around the 22nd Budoukai, when EVERYONE started using Ki attacks), I dunno, it started to feel more Japanese than Chinese to me...

But I may just be pulling that out of my ass, you made a really good point. ^^;