Freeza was 12,000,000

NeptuneKai · Post by **NeptuneKai** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 3:08 pm

KingBroly wrote:Really? Why doesnt someone do something about it?

Because that is what we call free speech, they have the right to give bad information just as much as we have the right to give proper information.

omegacwa · Post by **omegacwa** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 3:09 pm

Nah, I don't want someone to control the internet, I just want there to be some kinda law against computer viruses, and a punishment for the people who make them.
I know this is probably impossible, but it's fun to have dreams.

Post by **Herms** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 3:12 pm

KingBroly wrote:And I saw another Daizenshuu on youtube that has Freeza at 12,000,000. This guy who worked for Toriyama showed it to me.

Here's the video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMzl9XZxg6Y

And this is the guy who worked for Toriyama
http://www.youtube.com/user/CastleofAnime45

That book is a complete fake, and we've had a few threads about it in the past. Among other things, the "Japanese" the book is written in has many, many mistakes.

Olivier Hague wrote:Biggu kanzen na korekusho!

What in the name of God and Moses?

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 3:15 pm

Xyex wrote:Far as I know only Rocketman and Onikage are completely against the bigger numbers (I think it was Onikage....)

I'm not against bigger numbers so much as I'm against numbers in the hundreds of millions.

YouTube · Post by **Hujio** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 4:30 pm

Olivier Hague wrote:Biggu kanzen na korekusho!

Those are some nice looking Daizenshuu scans!

Chibi Mystic Gohan · Post by **Chibi Mystic Gohan** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 7:14 pm

Olivier Hague wrote:
KingBroly wrote:What about the book though. look at it.
I did. And I laughed. A lot.

You haven't heard the best part! (Well, maybe you have?) The names and numbers appear incorrect because the book is written in a rare Japanese dialect called "Meshiya" or something.

I mean, come the fuck on.

(As a side note, where have you been? I've sort of... missed you? >_>)

KingBroly · Post by **KingBroly** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 7:15 pm

Is Meyisha something they also made up?

Post by **Herms** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 7:19 pm

KingBroly wrote:Is Meyisha something they also made up?

Yeah. It was essentially their excuse for all of the book's Japanese mistakes, like writing all the numbers totally wrong.

Chibi Mystic Gohan · Post by **Chibi Mystic Gohan** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 7:23 pm

KingBroly wrote:Is Meyisha something they also made up?

Yes. He was just trying to cover his ass when people that speak Japanese started pointing out that the Japanese was all wrong in the "book." There is no such thing as "Meshiya."

Besides, any kind of guide book would be written in plain ol' standard Japanese (I forget what they call it. The kind that any old Tokyoite would speak). And, the idea of Toriyama just up and writing his own book is laughable, especially when he himself thanked his staff for writing the books in the Daizenshuu, because he'd forgotten everything, and that he could have used a book like the Daizenshuu when he was writing the series.

And, he's just a forgetful kind of person.

Olivier Hague · Post by **Olivier Hague** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 8:15 pm

Chibi Mystic Gohan wrote:You haven't heard the best part! (Well, maybe you have?)

I have, as a matter of fact! Caught that a couple of hours ago (along with a headache... so that's why I had stopped reading Youtube comments!).
But thanks for the notice anyway!

The names and numbers appear incorrect because the book is written in a rare Japanese dialect called "Meshiya" or something.

Or "simplified Japanese"!
So awesome.

(As a side note, where have you been? I've sort of... missed you? >_>)

Awww... ^__^;

KingBroly · Post by **KingBroly** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 9:12 pm

Another user linked me to this

http://db.schuby.org/daizex/viewtopic.p ... ko&start=0

I'm just wondering if a podcast was made that talked about this like Vegetto ex said there would.

Post by **VegettoEX** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 9:33 pm

KingBroly wrote:Another user linked me to this

http://db.schuby.org/daizex/viewtopic.p ... ko&start=0

I'm just wondering if a podcast was made that talked about this like Vegetto ex said there would.

We never did it because it doesn't warrant the attention it's getting.

KingBroly · Post by **KingBroly** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 9:44 pm

Maybe you could mention it on the youtube channel?

Raki · Post by **Raki** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 10:01 pm

KingBroly wrote:Maybe you could mention it on the youtube channel?

The Webmaster has already spoken on that.

VegettoEX wrote:
KingBroly wrote:Another user linked me to this

http://db.schuby.org/daizex/viewtopic.p ... ko&start=0

I'm just wondering if a podcast was made that talked about this like Vegetto ex said there would.
We never did it because it doesn't warrant the attention it's getting.

Onikage725 · Post by **Onikage725** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 10:19 pm

Xyex wrote: Far as I know only Rocketman and Onikage are completely against the bigger numbers (I think it was Onikage....)

Yup. Not that I necessarily swear by the mistranslation, but I have a big problem with "ZOMG power level 1 million?????" being a big deal, and shortly thereafter we're sucking on 150mil.

But I won't go into that now.

As for the rest... what the fuck? Cocaine's a hell of a drug.

Xyex · Post by **Xyex** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 10:58 pm

It was "Meyisha" actually. Which is even funnier, since "yi" doesn't exist in Japanese.

Yup. Not that I necessarily swear by the mistranslation, but I have a big problem with "ZOMG power level 1 million?????" being a big deal, and shortly thereafter we're sucking on 150mil.

But I won't go into that now.

Same with me, really, which is why I pushed them as low as I could in my list, while still following the manga, and I still ended up with Freeza at 95 million and SSJ Goku at 100 million. Just have to consider that Toriyama wasn't really thinking about such things and it makes a little more sense. Still not a big fan of the 90k to 2 million power leap Goku makes in my list but there's not really much one can do. I've yet to be fully (re)convinced of the "KKx10 from the start" concept. Though I could maybe buy a normal Kaioken from the start (which would at least halve the powers).

Chibi Mystic Gohan · Post by **Chibi Mystic Gohan** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 11:00 pm

Onikage725 wrote:
Xyex wrote: Far as I know only Rocketman and Onikage are completely against the bigger numbers (I think it was Onikage....)
Yup. Not that I necessarily swear by the mistranslation, but I have a big problem with "ZOMG power level 1 million?????" being a big deal, and shortly thereafter we're sucking on 150mil.

But I won't go into that now.

As for the rest... what the fuck? Cocaine's a hell of a drug.

But... we know that Kaiô-Ken x 20 Goku must at least have a battle power of over 20,000,000 (although it must be a lot higher than that, because form 2 Freeza's power alone was over a million, and Piccolo was stronger than that, and Freeza's third form was stronger than that, and Vegeta was stronger than that, and Freeza's forth form was stronger than that, and Goku was stronger than that... That was long. So I think he's at least 2,000,000-3,000,000 at that point), and 50% Freeza was much higher than that, and 100% Freeza's power was twice that, and Super Saiyan Goku was higher than that...

I know, that was annoying. But my point is, we can easily figure that Goku and Freeza were over a battle power of 50,000,000 at that point. Well over, in my opinion. Like, over one hundred million.

Xyex wrote:I've yet to be fully (re)convinced of the "KKx10 from the start" concept.

There's not even anything to support it in the manga, at all. Nor the Daizenshuu. The concept was created simply because of the 15,000,000/12,000,000 mistranslation. No one would have ever thought 150,000,000/120,000,000 was odd if it were translated properly.

Just little things (like Goku saying he could never defeat Freeza, right after he transformed into his third form, yet saying his new power was incredible after he was healed. How is it incredible if he was still weaker than Freeza?) show that he was at least as strong as Freeza's initial level of power at that point.

Hell, Vegeta thought that he was a Super Saiyan. Or was he using the Kaiô-Ken x 10 while standing there and talking?

sailorspazz · Post by **sailorspazz** » Fri Jul 11, 2008 12:28 am

Olivier Hague wrote:
Biggu kanzen na korekusho!

But....but....this guy worked with Toriyama on the manga from 1995 to 1998! (Ignore the fact that the manga ended in 1995). Can't you see his name in the video, he's none other than James Hitotsu no Nelson! (Which means he obviously didn't just plug the name "James A. Nelson" into a Japanese translator and fail to notice that it translated the 'a' rather than giving the katakana rendering of that letter....he said on the Internet that he graduated from a Japanese college, so it must be true!

)

These kinds of videos give me lolz, yet it's disturbing how many people believe them.

Chibi Mystic Gohan · Post by **Chibi Mystic Gohan** » Fri Jul 11, 2008 12:32 am

sailorspazz wrote:(Which means he obviously didn't just plug the name "James A. Nelson" into a Japanese translator and fail to notice that it translated the 'a' rather than giving the katakana rendering of that letter

Ha, I hadn't thought of that. I was wondering how the hell he managed to get "hitotsu" in there. >_>

Onikage725 · Post by **Onikage725** » Fri Jul 11, 2008 12:53 am

Chibi Mystic Gohan wrote: There's not even anything to support it in the manga, at all. Nor the Daizenshuu. The concept was created simply because of the 15,000,000/12,000,000 mistranslation. No one would have ever thought 150,000,000/120,000,000 was odd if it were translated properly.

I'm not really interested in getting into another (read: the same one as always) power level debate. But I'll just add that the theory your speaking of owes a bit to the anime before the mistranslation (that just seemed to correlate the two back when initially watching the fight). The anime shows a Kaio-ken aura that only Kaio can sense, which is where the "noone else could sense Goku's Kaio-ken aura" theory first came from. I can understand wanting to disregard that, as it wasn't in the manga. But this constant attitude that such a theory was never once presented anywhere and its just desperate fans pulling shit out of their asses really ought end. I mean... I think Goku fighting Buu at SSJ2 was bullshit to generally be disregarded, but I don't act like the scene didn't exist when discussing such things.

Hell, Vegeta thought that he was a Super Saiyan. Or was he using the Kaiô-Ken x 10 while standing there and talking?

Goku could have had a power level maximum of 3 million or 300 million, and this wouldnt matter. Goku supresses his power, fighting in bursts. So whatever Vegeta assumed about Goku while he stood there, it wasn't some raw display of Goku's full force. Vegeta knew Goku was the shit when he first showed up on Namek, but Goku was only putting forth 5k "at rest."