Why is the "FRIEZA" spelling wrong?

[The Time Traveller]

I think Frieza can work, but people who don't watch the series have actually pronounced that wrong, I've heard it as "Frayzer" and "Fryza" from non-fans before.

It's like Dr. Victor Fries from Batman, his name isn't pronounced as french fries, it's pronounced as Freeze.

Freeza is the most common, it's the most used internationally and it makes the most sense.

[Hujio]

I think Freeza can work, but people who don't watch the series have actually pronounced that wrong, I've heard it as "Frayzer" and "Fryza" from non-fans before.

This is definitely my biggest problem with the name. I still stand by what I've said, if people had never watched the dub and heard how to properly pronounce "Frieza", then his name in the U.S. would forever be "Fryza". And I don't understand the whole, but the word "frieze" is pronounced like "freeze". It has been brought up multiple times, but does anyone even know what a frieze is or how it's actually pronounced? I'll admit, I had to look it up. All I'm saying is that, what 13 year old fan knows how to pronounce "Frieza" without ever having seen the dub? There's a reason Viz went with "Freeza". To this day, I still pronounce the word as "Fryza" when I see it written, and not just because I'm 13, but because that's what it looks like to me. And also because I hate the spelling, so it's fun to bash it when I get the chance.

Freeza is the most common, it's the most used internationally and it makes the most sense.

Yes. Yes. Yes.

Just because your spelling is closer to the pun, it doesn't mean it's correct either.

Does not compute. I believe "Freeza" is correct, since that's how Toriyama writes it, Toei writes it that way, Shueisha writes it that way, Bandai writes it that way, and on and on. But really, what your saying does compute, and I see where you're coming from.

[Dayspring]

Just because your spelling is closer to the pun, it doesn't mean it's correct either.

Does not compute. I believe "Freeza" is correct, since that's how Toriyama writes it, Toei writes it that way, Shueisha writes it that way, Bandai writes it that way, and on and on. But really, what your saying does compute, and I see where you're coming from.

Wait, have we seen Toriyama write out the word Freeza in English? And I don't just mean he takes the English word, writes it in Japanese in a way that's transliterated as "Furiizer" and then makes a pun. I mean, has he ever written it in English as "Freeza?" If so, then that's all there is to this debate.

[Cipher]

If so, then that's all there is to this debate.

"Klylyn."

Just saying.

[Amigo Ten]

Has he ever written in as "Klylyn"? I remember "Kuririn" and "Kulilin" from the manga, but that's all.

[Gaffer Tape]

Red Ribon. That's all I'm saying.

Okay, I'm also saying that Toriyama's spellings could be given some credence, but he's not exactly perfect.

[Olivier Hague]

Just because your spelling is closer to the pun, it doesn't mean it's correct either.

Does not compute. I believe "Freeza" is correct, since that's how Toriyama writes it, Toei writes it that way, Shueisha writes it that way, Bandai writes it that way, and on and on.

Yes. Like I said, I agree with that argument (except for the "that's how Toriyama writes it" part... where does that come from?).
I just disagree with the "this spelling is closer to the pun, therefore other spellings are wrong" one.

[Cipher]

Has he ever written in as "Klylyn"? I remember "Kuririn" and "Kulilin" from the manga, but that's all.

Maybe "Klylyn" never appeared in the manga, but I know it's shown up on some merchandise.

Regardless, it's fairly evident that Toriyama never really cared or decided how to romanize "Kuririn."

[Hujio]

Does not compute. I believe "Freeza" is correct, since that's how Toriyama writes it, Toei writes it that way, Shueisha writes it that way, Bandai writes it that way, and on and on.

Yes. Like I said, I agree with that argument (except for the "that's how Toriyama writes it" part... where does that come from?).
I just disagree with the "this spelling is closer to the pun, therefore other spellings are wrong" one.

Yeah, I was in a hurry this morning and totally didn't mean that Toriyama himself uses it. I meant more along the lines of "Freeza" is used in the daizenshuu, which is Toriyama certified. But we all know what that really means...

I just disagree with "it's pronounced the same, so it's still correct". I don't buy it. The only reason people know how to pronounce it so it resembles the actual pronunciation is because they've been told how. Anyway, here's the truth that I think some of us have been dancing around. Something that some just won't understand, or agree with.

Along with everything else that happened back in the early days, the whole thing is just a slap in the face to fans from FUNimation. That's especially how most people thought of it back then. Hence most of us saying, "it will haunt me forever". It's just one of those things, I guess. So to some it's just a name, so what's the big deal? Well, to others it's something they've hated since day 1, something they've asked to be changed, something they've had shoved in their faces and basically down their throats... It's one of those things that harks back to the day when FUNimation came to town, and started dismantling everything we knew about the series. It hasn't been until very recently that FUNimation has even really acknowledged these non-dub fans. So, is there some resentment built up. Hell yeah there is! However, it still stands that it's a horrible transliteration that no sane person would think of. Hence, a slap in the face of Japanese fans.

I think it's just one of those things that has so much to it. It's more than just a question of, "why is spelling wrong?" It's everything the word encompasses. It's what it represents. It's what it really means to one group of people, versus another. It's the rage I, and many others, feel every time we see it. The worst part of it is, many dub fans consider it the most acceptable spelling. All the pages on DB Wikia and Wikipedia will use nothing else but "Frieza", and go so far as to not even allow "Freeza". I just find it so ironic that when they talk about the manga they still use "Frieza", even though Viz itself uses "Freeza".

So, where does that leave us? In the end, the word "Frieza" encompasses everything most hate about what FUNimation has done to the series we love. For most, it was the last straw. It's more than just a word, it represents FUNimation's commitment to thoroughly bitch-slapping the series and fans in the face, and then asking for their money.

All that, and it's just stupid to begin with. I mean, seriously... Frieza?

[Gaffer Tape]

I agree with all of this. Despite the fact that I don't think it's wrong wrong, to me (even though Freeza is much more correct), it's another one of those FUNimation-isms that pollutes the series, so I dislike it on principle. Plus, I also find it to look aesthetically unappealing.

[MajinVejitaXV]

So, where does that leave us? In the end, the word "Frieza" encompasses everything most hate about what FUNimation has done to the series we love. For most, it was the last straw. It's more than a just word, it's represents FUNimation's commitment to thoroughly bitch-slapping the series and fans in the face, and then asking for their money.

All that, and it's just stupid to begin with. I mean, seriously... Frieza?

I agree, and raise another point:

We all know how annoying it is when someone tries to show elitism by calling the characters nonsense like "Torankusu," "Seru," etc. right? To me, Frieza is basically the "dub fandom" counterpart of that. Whenever I see it, I'm basically reminded of the divide between the English speaking fandom and the rest of the DragonBall watching/reading world (aside from perhaps the Big Green fandom).

It's just another mindless change, and the main thing that annoys the hell out of me about it currently is the use of it in the promos for the DragonBoxes. It's just...stupid to me.

[Bussani]

You know, when I first watched Dragon Ball Z dubbed and Freeza first appeared, I spelled his name "Freeza", without any exposure to the manga or fan sites or anything. It just made sense to me. Then I later found out I was "wrong" and it was spelled "Frieza".

...And then much later, I found out I was "wrong" again.

I could be wrong again right now, but I imagine if you were in a Japanese language class and you translated フリーザー to "friezer", you'd probably get an F.

[bkev]

When people critique Toriyama's spelling, keep in mind that that's him spelling English. Not English words in ... katakana or whatever they use for foreign characters. I didn't learn japanese, so sue me.

[Olivier Hague]

Yeah, I was in a hurry this morning and totally didn't mean that Toriyama himself uses it. I meant more along the lines of "Freeza" is used in the daizenshuu, which is Toriyama certified.

I see. Agreed. ^^

It's more than just a question of, "why is spelling wrong?" It's everything the word encompasses. It's what it represents.

Oh, I can definitely relate.
My point was really about the "why is this spelling wrong?" angle, and just that. I find some people a bit quick to pass judgement on these things, sometimes. Because it's closer to the pun, because it's closer to the original Japanese... When really, it should just be the author's prerogative (... even if the guy doesn't seem to care all that much).

All that, and it's just stupid to begin with. I mean, seriously... Frieza?

"Bulma"? ;þ

I could be wrong again right now, but I imagine if you were in a Japanese language class and you translated フリーザー to "friezer", you'd probably get an F.

But if you had to translate the name スティーヴン and answered "Steven", you'd probably get the same grade as the guy who came up with "Stephen". ^^

[desirecampbell]

Okay, let's try this again:

Toriyama, took the word freezer and changed the final syllable to a short 'a' sound. Where does anyone get the idea that there should be any other change to the word?

"Frieza can be pronounced like Freeza so both are correct." - You can get the same pronounciation from 'Phreeza' or 'Ghroiai' too, they are also incorrect. Your argument is invalid.

"Frieza is used in an official English distribution of DBZ, therefore it's correct." - Harmony Gold calls Goku 'Zero', the Philipino dub calls Saiyans 'Space people'; they are also incorrect. Your argument is invalid.


-edit-
@Olivier Hague, I can see your argument that 'Frieza' can be pronounced as 'Freeza'. But it's still a terrible romanization of フリーザ.

If all we knew about the name was that it was フリーザ then 'Frieza' would be an odd choice, but not incorrect. But the fact is that we know that it comes from the English word 'freezer' and thus that spelling needs to be taken into account.

[Amigo Ten]

"Frieza can be pronounced like Freeza so both are correct." - You can get the same pronounciation from 'Phreeza' or 'Ghroiai' too, they are also incorrect. Your argument is invalid.

You could never get the pronunciation of "Freeza" from "Ghroiai". Never. That's just a silly example. "gh" may be a "f" sound when used as a suffix, but nowhere else.

[Cipher]

So, where does that leave us? In the end, the word "Frieza" encompasses everything most hate about what FUNimation has done to the series we love. For most, it was the last straw. It's more than just a word, it represents FUNimation's commitment to thoroughly bitch-slapping the series and fans in the face, and then asking for their money.

Cool story. Unfortunately, it has nothing to do with the legitimacy or accuracy of the actual spelling.

Whenever I see it, I'm basically reminded of the divide between the English speaking fandom and the rest of the DragonBall watching/reading world (aside from perhaps the Big Green fandom).

True. However, when I see people getting worked up over a single vowel (when there are worse examples of mistranslation), and sometimes using it as a platform for gigantic rants against the series' treatment during localization, I'm just as reminded of that divide.

Insistance on direct romanizations such as "Torankusu" is stupid. It over-venerates the Japanese version as greasy-haired otakus attempt to seperate themselves from its American counterpart. Builds an unnecessary divide.

Insistance on dub-only terminology such as "Frieza" and "Bulla" (which is one of those actually bad renamings I mentioned) is stupid. As said, they're needless changes and few, if any, other adaptations have changed the material in such a way.

And finally, insistance on never using the dub-only terminology is stupid. It represents such a forceful way of removing the divide that it just calls all the pointless, Japanese/American version bickering back to the surface. If the name isn't an aggregious change, it isn't an aggregious change. Sometimes that happens, but "Frieza" just isn't one of them.

Seems the only resonable thing to do if you really want the divide and bickering to go away is to simply ignore what spellings someone sticks to, so long as they read approximately the same. Which is why I'll defend anyone's right to use "Frieza," even if I don't personally care for it. It gets the job done, and actually maintains the pronunciation when several dub names don't, so why draw attention to it?

That's all I have to say on it. I thnk the semantics battle is over and we're well into purely personal opinions at this point. I'm kind of ashamed to have posted this many times on such a ridiculous topic to begin with.

[Gaffer Tape]

And finally, insistance on never using the dub-only terminology is stupid.

Well, I'm with you up until that point. By its very definition "dub-only terminology" is inaccurate, simply because it doesn't exist in the original. And I don't think fans should have to tolerate and accept inaccuracies with as much credence as elements from the actual series. The argument at hand is whether or not Fr ieza is a reasonably accurate translation of Furiiza (like Kuririn to Krillin) or if it's just a dub-only full-fledged inaccuracy (like Tenshinhan to T ien).

[Cipher]

Well, I'm with you up until that point. By its very definition "dub-only terminology" is inaccurate, simply because it doesn't exist in the original. And I don't think fans should have to tolerate and accept inaccuracies with as much credence as elements from the actual series. The argument at hand is whether or not Fr ieza is a reasonably accurate translation of Furiiza (like Kuririn to Krillin) or if it's just a dub-only full-fledged inaccuracy (like Tenshinhan to T ien).

Popped back in just to clarify this. Add the caveat of "so long as it's not completely different," which I tried to express in that post. If it's a total change like "Tien" or "Hercule," or something that completely absolutely misses the pun like "Bulla," it's probably best to sweep them under the rug just for the sake of consistency.

But if it's something that's pronounced the same but is just kind of stupid, like "Frieza," it's overwhelmingly best for everyone to just let it slide. Now I'm out.

[Olivier Hague]

I can see your argument that 'Frieza' can be pronounced as 'Freeza'. But it's still a terrible romanization of フリーザ.

Nope.

we know that it comes from the English word 'freezer' and thus that spelling needs to be taken into account.

Not necessarily, no. In the end, it's the author's prerogative. If the guy decides that the name is meant to be spelled with an "ie", that's just how it would be. Even if you personally think it should have been closer to the original pun.
When you don't know what's on the author's mind, you simply can't assert that such or such name spelling is "wrong".