Kaioshin/South Kaioshin/Dai Kaioshin/Kibitoshin REVALUATION

[goldsaint13]

As I already said, I think that the Kaioshins are among the most underrated characters...
About many of them we just don't know a single thing, but there's enough material to say that at least those four are strong and often underrated...


(East) Kaioshin: he is actually weak as a Kaioshin, that's stated in many situations, that doesn't mean he is not relatively strong.
He is far stronger than Piccolo as stated... That means Piccolo + Kami + RoSaT training + pre-Tenkaichi training...
I would list that Piccolo at at least equal to 2nd stage Cell and at best as Ascended Super Vegeta... We don't know for sure... Anyway, I red the whole first part of Buu's saga and it seems that the power of Saiyans Kaioshin admires as far superior to himself, is "the power beyond Super Saiyan", that is what Goku will call Super Saiyan 2 further on.
That's again Super Saiyan 2 that makes Goku, Vegeta and even Gohan not worried too much about Darbula himself, while Kaioshin is.
Basically it's Cell Games scenario, beside the fact that there are three Super Saiyan 2s and so Cell/Darbula wouldn't be a threat at all...
Kaioshin is then something like a Super Saiyan Full Power... Maybe low on the scale, but still...
He could be like Cell Games Goku or like Buu's saga Gohan... Maybe a bit below... But remember how Cell Games Goku HALF power scared Vegeta that was able to turn 2nd and 3rd grade... I think Kaioshin is AT LEAST like that... Like half Cell Games Goku, or even more...
Majin Vegeta SSJ2 said to Goku that Kaioshin should have been stronger than them, but now they are stronger... It's mostly refered to SSJ2 to me... As SSJ1 I don't think they're much different from Kaioshin that was totally unaware of SSJ2, because he said he would have used another strategy if he would have know that there was something beyond SSJ1...

South Kaioshin: he is stronger than North and West that are stronger than East... We don't know much, but I often ask myself why Kid Buu, one in SSJ3 tier, would have had to absorb him in the first place... Maybe he was not that weak... Or Buu is used to absorb the second strongest to fight the strongest? Like he did with Gotenks and Gohan...
South Kaioshin could have been quite powerful, but it leads to the following...

Dai Kaioshin: here comes the uncommon notice...
He may be actually far stronger than South Kaioshin... Don't be fooled... South Kaioshin is stated to be the strongest AMONG THE 4 KAIOSHINS...
Dai Kaioshin is another league... It would be like comparing the 4 Kaios with Dai Kaio...
Dai Kaioshin could have had a power level way above that of South Kaioshin, he was the absolute God of the whole universe...
We know that by the time Majin Buu absorbed Dai Kaioshin he dropped down in power because of Dai Kaioshin gentle and naive nature... It doesn't mean he wasn't strong... Or the strongest, actually...
Dai Kaioshin could have been easily SSJ3 tier and Kid Buu could have absorbed South Kaioshin because cornered by either the two...
Actually, the power gap there is between Kid Buu and Super Buu/Buff Buu could be made by, if not also South Kaioshin, at least Dai Kaioshin...



I know.........


The Z-Sword argument...




But the manga never said that EVERY Kaioshin tried to pull the sword...


Even less that Dai Kaioshin ever thought to try at all...
Many confuses Dai Kaioshin with a normal Kaioshin, while he absolutely isn't...


Furthermore, the Z-Sword has been there for many generations before the one South Kaioshin and his brothers were born... Kibith referring as "many Kaioshin tried" could be totally unrealated to the 4 Kaioshins of the last generation...

We are talking of aeons of time, not just the last few millennia when the whole Majin Buu mess occurred...





And last but not least...



Kibitoshin: he is terribly underrated... For two main reasons... He is a Potara Fusion... Weren't they made of Character 1 X Character 2 multiplication?
The second reason is that as soon as he is born, he wanted to help Goku against SUPER BUUTENKS!!! Elder Kaioshin of course said he was a moron to think to be able to do something against THAT Majin Buu that was beating up Ultimate Gohan...
But wasn't him saying more or less the same thing to Goku a minute before?
Does it mean that Kibitoshin is SSJ3 tier? Not necessarily, but it can't be excluded at all...
I know that in this case Kibitoshin would have fought Kid Buu when SSJ3 Goku ran out of energy... But that final battle is forced... No one tries to use the best solution... Just like they didn't teleport Gohan to give AT LEAST a HUGE hand when they could, I don't see why Kibitoshin, stronger than any Earth destrution survived Z-Fighter beside maybe SSJ3 Goku, should have given an hand before...



The whole Kaioshin argument is complex... But I feel they are often greatly underrated compared to what instead they *could* be as power...

[dbgtFO]

The whole Kaioshin argument is complex... But I feel they are often greatly underrated compared to what instead they *could* be as power...

Indeed. The problem is we never actually see them in action. Sure we are told that East Kaioshin is far stronger than Piccolo and that he can one shot Freeza, but we don't get to see him fight until Majin Buu is released, who we all know he absolutely can't match. He just doesn't get a chance to fight opponents weaker than him, but instead has to fight one far superior to him, which doesn't make it look like he's incredibly strong.

I'm pretty sure South Kaioshin is stated to be the strongest Kaioshin though.

[Herms]

He may be actually far stronger than South Kaioshin... Don't be fooled... South Kaioshin is stated to be the strongest AMONG THE 4 KAIOSHINS...1

No, that's not specified. And East Kaioshin always speaks of the "5 Kaioshins", both when first explaining about Boo and then later when explaining about the history of Boo's absorptions, so I see no reason to assume he'd be distinguishing between the 4 cardinal direction Kaioshins and the Dai-Kaioshin when talking about South Kaioshin's strength.

[goldsaint13]

Indeed. The problem is we never actually see them in action. Sure we are told that East Kaioshin is far stronger than Piccolo and that he can one shot Freeza, but we don't get to see him fight until Majin Buu is released, who we all know he absolutely can't match. He just doesn't get a chance to fight opponents weaker than him, but instead has to fight one far superior to him, which doesn't make it look like he's incredibly strong.

Of course... Majin Buu is above even SSJ2 Majin Vegeta but it doesn't mean Kaioshin is weaker than, for example, SSJ1 Gohan...
As it seems, he is weaker than SSJ2s and didn't even know there was something above SSJ2... As long as we're talking about SSJ1, Kaioshin seems pretty much on the same league as them... We are talking about Full Power SSJ1...

I'm pretty sure South Kaioshin is stated to be the strongest Kaioshin though.

No, that's not specified. And East Kaioshin always speaks of the "5 Kaioshins", both when first explaining about Boo and then later when explaining about the history of Boo's absorptions, so I see no reason to assume he'd be distinguishing between the 4 cardinal direction Kaioshins and the Dai-Kaioshin when talking about South Kaioshin's strength.

Yes, it seems like this, but Dai Kaioshin is hardly seen as a fighter at the point he weakened Buu instead of powering up him... I think that being the Dai Kaioshin he hardly could have been weaker than a normal Kaioshin... Maybe his power was unknown and mostly hidden...

Anyway, whoever may be the strongest, the Z-Sword argument can't be thrown in to underrate the Kaioshins... It has been there from many generations before and many, not all, Kaioshin tried to pull it... Not necessarily one of those 5...
Also... As much as Gohan could have been SSJ2 while fighting Darbula, he could while pulling the sword...
Kaioshin seems very confindent in SSJ2 power, while SSJ1 power seems to be the expected ordinary for him...

[Kirby456]

I agree. Imo Piccolo was Ascended Super Saiyan tier after the Rosat and the Supreme Kai was stated to be stronger then him. Even if hes not stronger hes at least on par with Piccolo and you have to remember Piccolo had 7 years of training. The Supreme Kai overrated Pui Pui/Yakon due to them being Babidis warriors. I believe also dai Kaio is stated to be in another league then the 4 Kaioshins in the anime i believe. Plus its never stated Dai Kaio tried to pull out the sword ether.

[Metrite]

The way Kibito says that so many Kaioshins and even himself had tried and failed to pull the Z sword makes it sound like it was a common things for every kaioshin to try at some point even to that day. If South Kaioshin himself had never tried prior to Buu's first appearance, then it would only make sense that he would try then since it was believed that the one to pull it would gain incredible power. And the fact that the kaioshins were all significantly weaker than Gohan comes not just from their inability to pull the sword, but from Gohan's superior comparison to them. Kaioshin described Gohan as having power beyond imagination. It wouldn't make sense for him to be so amazed by Gohan's strength to the point of offering him a Kaioshin-impossible task if he had already known one that was just as strong.

[Herms]

I think that being the Dai Kaioshin he hardly could have been weaker than a normal Kaioshin...

I don't see why not, there's nothing said about rank being based directly on strength. In fact, Toriyama's explanation of the Kaio/Kaioshin selection process in the SEG is that whenever any Kaio/Kaioshin dies, they select a replacement via lottery. So going by that, the Dai-Kaioshin that got absorbed by Boo got the job simply because he was a golden fruit Shinjin who happened to be around when the previous Dai-Kaioshin died, and happened to win the lottery. No particular reason he'd have to be stronger than the South Kaioshin.

[goldsaint13]

I agree. Imo Piccolo was Ascended Super Saiyan tier after the Rosat and the Supreme Kai was stated to be stronger then him. Even if hes not stronger hes at least on par with Piccolo and you have to remember Piccolo had 7 years of training. The Supreme Kai overrated Pui Pui/Yakon due to them being Babidis warriors. I believe also dai Kaio is stated to be in another league then the 4 Kaioshins in the anime i believe. Plus its never stated Dai Kaio tried to pull out the sword ether.

Agree...
Of course Kaioshin couldn't be below SSJ1 Full Power level because of those many statements...
He couldn't defeat Dabra but the could easily win against the other two...

Kaioshin is greatly above even Dai Kaio, it's stated too...


Who knows what power Dai Kaio has though?

The way Kibito says that so many Kaioshins and even himself had tried and failed to pull the Z sword makes it sound like it was a common things for every kaioshin to try at some point even to that day.

South Kaioshin was described as a particulary strong Kaioshin though... Maybe that feat is not at the range of most Kaioshins but not necessarily any...

Actually Elder Kaioshin stated East Kaioshin to be instead particulary weak as a Kaioshin and he's already in the ranges of a SSJ1 FP...

If South Kaioshin himself had never tried prior to Buu's first appearance, then it would only make sense that he would try then since it was believed that the one to pull it would gain incredible power.

It seems that Buu absorbed him before he could... It's clear that the 4 Kaioshins tried to stop Kid Buu but were all killed or absorbed... Then, after Kid Buu absorbed South Kaioshin he was fought by Dai Kaioshin that lastly ened up absorbed too...

They didn't have time to flee and go try to pull the Z-Sword...

And the fact that the kaioshins were all significantly weaker than Gohan comes not just from their inability to pull the sword, but from Gohan's superior comparison to them. Kaioshin described Gohan as having power beyond imagination. It wouldn't make sense for him to be so amazed by Gohan's strength to the point of offering him a Kaioshin-impossible task if he had already known one that was just as strong.

Kaioshin was taliking about his SSJ2 hidden strength triggered by anger... Anyway, the battle with the Kaioshins is located millennia before...

How could you know than he wouldn't have stated also South or Dai Kaioshin power to be extraordinary?

Remember how he considers himself a weakling compared to them...


Maybe neither him nor North and West Kaioshin could pull the sword, and most Kaioshins couldn't either... They are all probably in the ranges of a SSJ1 Full Power... Although this, there are rare super powerful Kaioshins that are greatly stronger and have the true power a Kaioshin should have (like Elder implies saying East is weak for a Kaioshin) and a power that probably East Kaioshin got after fusing with Kibito...

Dai Kaioshins then are just another matter... They are the highest gods and I find it hard that they aren't far stronger than most normal Kaioshins...

I don't see why not, there's nothing said about rank being based directly on strength. In fact, Toriyama's explanation of the Kaio/Kaioshin selection process in the SEG is that whenever any Kaio/Kaioshin dies, they select a replacement via lottery. So going by that, the Dai-Kaioshin that got absorbed by Boo got the job simply because he was a golden fruit Shinjin who happened to be around when the previous Dai-Kaioshin died, and happened to win the lottery. No particular reason he'd have to be stronger than the South Kaioshin.

Well, but Dai Kaio is stronger than the 4 Kaios... Why? A randomness?

Anyway, Dai Kaioshin might have been weaker than South Kaioshin but surely stronger than the others and possibly by much... I think that Kid Buu absorbed the strongest two that maybe were even giving him trouble in battle... There's no reason why Buu would absorb someone if not when cornered by him...

[Herms]

Well, but Dai Kaio is stronger than the 4 Kaios... Why? A randomness?

In filler. And yeah, it could just be random.

[Darkprince410]

I don't see why not, there's nothing said about rank being based directly on strength. In fact, Toriyama's explanation of the Kaio/Kaioshin selection process in the SEG is that whenever any Kaio/Kaioshin dies, they select a replacement via lottery. So going by that, the Dai-Kaioshin that got absorbed by Boo got the job simply because he was a golden fruit Shinjin who happened to be around when the previous Dai-Kaioshin died, and happened to win the lottery. No particular reason he'd have to be stronger than the South Kaioshin.

Well, but Dai Kaio is stronger than the 4 Kaios... Why? A randomness?

Anyway, Dai Kaioshin might have been weaker than South Kaioshin but surely stronger than the others and possibly by much... I think that Kid Buu absorbed the strongest two that maybe were even giving him trouble in battle... There's no reason why Buu would absorb someone if not when cornered by him...

The thing is though is we don't know the actual circumstances behind why Chibi Buu absorbed South and Dai Kaioushin. The only Buu we see absorb people for the sake of a tactical advantage is Super Buu, who in any form is far more intelligent than Chibi Buu is. Maybe Chibi Buu, after absorbing South Kaioushin, just instantly assumed that absorbing another Kaioushin would give him another boost in battle power (sort of going off the simple fact of nature that if you do something that rewards you, you'll be inclined to do it again).

The only thing we can determine through canon information is that East Kaioushin was the weakest of the ones of his generation and that the others were stronger than he is. There's no concrete information on where the others stand in comparison to one another, and it can only be speculated that South was the strongest.

[dbgtFO]

There's no concrete information on where the others stand in comparison to one another, and it can only be speculated that South was the strongest.

But South Kaioshin is stated to be the strongest.

[CatouttaHell]

South Kaioshin > Dai Kaioshin > East Kaioshin IMO. I think South Kaioshin is stronger than Full Power Perfect Cell. He couldn't pull the Z-Sword out, but I believe Gohan was a SSjin 2 when he did that, so South Kaioshin can be pretty damn strong and still do that. East Kaioshin I personally feel is weaker than SSjin Gohan and Piccolo (just barely, in regards to Gohan) for various reasons. The power of the South Kaioshin is a big problem though if you believe Evil Boo > Pure Boo (I personally don't) since Pure Boo (South Kaioshin Absorbed) is implied to be a good deal above Evil Boo.

It's possible South Kaioshin just never tried to pull the Z-Sword out but I don't see why he wouldn't. He's apparently a strength freak so he should've tried at least once, and it's doubtful that he had anything better to do anyway. If you go by the Anime then both South and Dai are monsters. Pure Boo is an absolute god in the Anime and yet South Kaioshin holds his own against him and Dai Kaioshin is superior to Boo even after he absorbs South Kaioshin.

[goldsaint13]

In filler. And yeah, it could just be random.

Strange thing though...

The thing is though is we don't know the actual circumstances behind why Chibi Buu absorbed South and Dai Kaioushin. The only Buu we see absorb people for the sake of a tactical advantage is Super Buu, who in any form is far more intelligent than Chibi Buu is. Maybe Chibi Buu, after absorbing South Kaioushin, just instantly assumed that absorbing another Kaioushin would give him another boost in battle power (sort of going off the simple fact of nature that if you do something that rewards you, you'll be inclined to do it again).

Yes, Kid Buu of course didn't use tactics... But he is an instinct beast... He could have guessed that absorbing would have given him more power, or, he was actually cornered by the power of South and Dai Kaioshin...
Kid Buu is SSJ3 tier... I think both South and Dai are too... Maybe North, West and Easty were all SSJ1 tier and usually a Kaioshin is that strong more or less, that's why they mostly can't pull the Z-Sword...

The only thing we can determine through canon information is that East Kaioushin was the weakest of the ones of his generation and that the others were stronger than he is. There's no concrete information on where the others stand in comparison to one another, and it can only be speculated that South was the strongest.

Yes, East was the weakest... As for South, he is stated as the strongest at least among the four... Dai Kaioshin should have been weaker, at least at the first sight... He could have an hidden power he kept the others unaware of... As much as he weakened Buu with his kindness...

South Kaioshin > Dai Kaioshin > East Kaioshin IMO. I think South Kaioshin is stronger than Full Power Perfect Cell. He couldn't pull the Z-Sword out, but I believe Gohan was a SSjin 2 when he did that, so South Kaioshin can be pretty damn strong and still do that.

I think he didn't try... South Kaioshin was very strong... I can't believe he was so close to East Kaioshin...

East Kaioshin I personally feel is weaker than SSjin Gohan and Piccolo (just barely, in regards to Gohan) for various reasons.

About Gohan, he may be... But he is far stronger than Piccolo... It's one of the few informations we have about his power...

The power of the South Kaioshin is a big problem though if you believe Evil Boo > Pure Boo (I personally don't) since Pure Boo (South Kaioshin Absorbed) is implied to be a good deal above Evil Boo.

I simply think that Super Buu is Kid Buu (as the base body) + Fat Buu (as a new separate Buu not anymore related to the main Buu and basically a Buued Dai Kaioshin)...
That's why detaching Fat Buu, that still had a weakening influence above Super Buu, while a lot smaller than before, Kid Buu reverts from Super Buu to Buff Buu that is too me still Super Buu but whithout anymore power reductions from Fat Buu influence, but the effect is brief and he lost all the power aquired with the Kaioshin immediately after, reverting to Kid Buu, feared because of his wilderness, not strength...
I don't say it's not absolutely possible that Kid Buu > Super Buu, but in that case we would have Super Buu >> Goku SSJ3 and Kid Buu >>> Goku SSJ3...
But since Goku SSJ3 and Kid Buu are tied, I tend to believe they are equals and thus both weaker than Super Buu, but it might be otherwise though...

To remain in topic, I think that both South Kaioshin and Dai Kaioshin are SSJ3 tier and that's why their power boosts Kid Buu by much...
But the influence of Dai Kaioshin weakned heavily him in Fat Buu's form and slightly in Super Buu's form... Weakened compared to the total power of the absorbtions, not compared to Kid Buu... Only Fat Buu was so weakened to a small percentage that he dropped below Kid Buu itself...

It's possible South Kaioshin just never tried to pull the Z-Sword out but I don't see why he wouldn't. He's apparently a strength freak so he should've tried at least once, and it's doubtful that he had anything better to do anyway.

Well, pulling the Z-Sword it's not a sport or something... The place is sacred and the sword is said to be the precious weapon of a hero that would give him unlimited power, to defeat Majin Buu in the last period, possibly to fight other calamities in the previous generations of Kaioshins...

Pulling the sword is tried when there's the need... Not just to kill time...

Possibly until Majin Buu's birth that was a peaceful time and South Kaioshin had no reason to pull the sword...
I think that East Kaioshin may have tried after the death/absorbtion of the other 4, but failed... Luckily for him, Bibidi sealed Fat Buu because he wasn't able to control him and East Kaioshin managed to kill him...

If you go by the Anime then both South and Dai are monsters. Pure Boo is an absolute god in the Anime and yet South Kaioshin holds his own against him and Dai Kaioshin is superior to Boo even after he absorbs South Kaioshin.

They show to be SSJ3 tier, not as strong as Vegetto... I'll never think that anime Kid Buu may be that much different from the manga one...
Anime Goku said to not have chances against Super Buu... I'll see if he say that with a 100% SSJ3 attack he can defeat Kid Buu... Because it would be close to prove that Kid Buu is weaker than Super Buu like it's closely proven in the manga (not as 100% proven as Gotenks > Goku though, there're still chances that Kid Buu may be actually stronger than Super Buu albeit I don't think so)...


Anyway there's no need to talk specifically about Majin Buu to talk about Kaioshins...

One may think that with the two absorbtions a new Majin Buu is born, that is Fat Buu, able to live as a separate being than Kid Buu...

[Metrite]

Pulling the sword is tried when there's the need... Not just to kill time...

Then why did Kibito try pulling it himself before? Because it was obviously considered a sport to kill time. And it doesn't make any sense to describe somebody as having such amazing power beyond imagination if you used to regularly hang around a guy that was way stronger, in which case the proper description of Gohan should have just been, "Eh... not too bad."

[jackjack]

It's possible South Kaioshin just never tried to pull the Z-Sword out but I don't see why he wouldn't.

I don't see why he would, honestly, considering the sword is for gaining power, and SK's already the top dog of the group.

He's apparently a strength freak so he should've tried at least once

Probably the reason why he wouldn't try, because he wouldn't want to improve himself through magical means?

Then why did Kibito try pulling it himself before?

Because he was weak and wanted more power?

Because it was obviously considered a sport to kill time.

It isn't obvious at all, at least to me.

And it doesn't make any sense to describe somebody as having such amazing power beyond imagination

Beyond what he imagined the Saiyans to possess? Kaioshin had already seen Boo's power, so Gohan's couldn't have possibly been beyond his imagination.

“It’s no use…There’s no way that a human would be able to pull out something which many Kaioshins challenged but were unable to pull out…”

Kibito doesn't think SSJ2 Gohan can free it because the Gods couldn't, when earlier...

“…Wh-what tremendous power…I can’t believe he’s a being of the lower world!”

...he couldn't believe humans like Gohan were that powerful as though it wouldn't be so shocking to him if Gohan were a God.

Oh, and why didn't he say "...which even the strongest Kaioshin challenged but was unable to pull out…”? That would've left a stronger impression, wouldn't it?

[hleV]

Oh c'mon... The Z-sword is obviously some magical thing from Kaioshins realm. If they wanted they could have destroyed the mountain in which the sword was stuck. There was some magical seal around the sword, I bet. Possibly against Kaioshins.

[jackjack]

It seems like a homage to the sword in the stone, and AT was a huge Disney fan. Gohan even made a clear reference when he first saw it.

[goldsaint13]

Then why did Kibito try pulling it himself before? Because it was obviously considered a sport to kill time.

Kibito tried to get stronger because he was far from even East Kaioshin level... Z-Sword is supposed to grant power, to awaken hidden power for one who has it... That's what actually the Elder does...
Someone like South Kaioshin, possibly trained to the limit, didn't need to find a new hidden power within himself...

And it doesn't make any sense to describe somebody as having such amazing power beyond imagination if you used to regularly hang around a guy that was way stronger, in which case the proper description of Gohan should have just been, "Eh... not too bad."

South Kaioshin lived millennia before and has been gone from a long time... Kaioshin was looking for powerful fighters in the present time who could have had an hidden power worth of notice...
It wouldn't make sense to talk about a person so far gone...
For the present standards, when East Kaioshin is the strongest because he is the only one left, a power like Goku's, Vegeta's or Gohan's is the best around...

I don't see why he would, honestly, considering the sword is for gaining power, and SK's already the top dog of the group.

He could even have been aware of not having anymore hidden power to unlock...

Probably the reason why he wouldn't try, because he wouldn't want to improve himself through magical means?

Yes, too... Or because he already had improved himself to the limit with training... He was possibly the strongest Kaioshin in the last few generations, although it's implied that at the time when the Elder Kaioshin was young there were other strong ones too... East Kaioshin is fairly weak for a Kaioshin instead...

Because he was weak and wanted more power?

Of course... He is far from even the weakest Kaioshin... I would say he is outside of Kaioshins power range...

Beyond what he imagined the Saiyans to possess? Kaioshin had already seen Boo's power, so Gohan's couldn't have possibly been beyond his imagination.

Of course... He is happy to have found people of the lower world that are as strong as a Kaioshin and even beyond...
Without the Saiyans, East Kaioshin was the strongest of the universes among the good guys and he couldn't pull the sword... Without the Saiyans help there was no hope...

Kibito doesn't think SSJ2 Gohan can free it because the Gods couldn't, when earlier...

...he couldn't believe humans like Gohan were that powerful as though it wouldn't be so shocking to him if Gohan were a God.

Of course... The surprise is to know that there are mortals as strong as Gods and actually stronger than the last God left...

Oh, and why didn't he say "...which even the strongest Kaioshin challenged but was unable to pull out…”? That would've left a stronger impression, wouldn't it?

Of course...

[Chou Gohan]

This seems like another attempt to try and bend clear implications of a part of the story because it doesn't agree with a certain part one's chosen belief system. lol I think it seems clear that all the context and events from Kaioshin's amazement of the saiya-jins to the Z sword all shows that the point was that the saiya-jins had already surpassed even the strongest of gods by the start of the Buu saga. You have to really go out of your way to make up reasons for the idea that some of the kaioshins were as strong as a ssj3.

I guess it is always fun to see people make up crazy things to try to bend a part the story to match their beliefs. I remember a awesome argument somebody once made about how the Genki Dama works. Since Gohan's energy alone wasn't way more than enough to destroy Buu, which would suggest Gohan isn't ungodly superior him after all (blasphemy!), it meant the Genki Dama doesn't actually gather any ki. Then why did Goku look up at it and say, "This ki is from Gohan"? Um, he just didn't know what he was talking about. The truth is that the Genki Dama gathers a special substance called "it". And no matter how strong a person becomes, his it never increases meaning Gohan's it is no greater than a normal person's it. Then why did a third of the Genki Dama come from Gohan? Um... well... you see... Ah! When a person becomes stronger, the amount of room that his it takes up increases, but the power of his it never increases regardless of how big it gets. A brilliant explanation that causes everything to make perfect sense.

[TobyS]

And here you are doing the same thing.

The genki dama collects genki, not ki. It's in the name. They could not have flown around talking to people if they had given all their ki (like how they struggled to fly in the freeza saga when they gave their chi to Piccolo.)

And before you say the flying around was filler, it's only by using anime filler you can possibly make a 'case' for Kid Buu > Gohan.

Also, at least in Vis, Goku comments that "this much from Gohan and the others" or something to that effect, not "this exact bit is everything Gohan has and look how it's nothing compared to Buu LOL"

Otherwise the kids would have fused before contributing to the bomb, or at least went super-saiyan.

Having said that, on topic, yeah the gods could not pull the z-sword, that much is clear.

If they were ss3 tier they could have beaten kid buu, at least collectivly, and would probably be too skilled to be absorbed.

They were obviously weaker but still strong enough that buu absorbed them for the lullz, or just superfluous bonus strength for fun.