Woohoo! More News About The New Dragonball Special!

Xyex · Post by **Xyex** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 12:58 am

........................................................

*sigh*

These replies are a great example of what's wrong with the current generation. It's really, really, really depressing.

No, it's not. Stealing a DVD (or a hundred) from a store, or a distribution line, or someone's house deprives them that item. It takes it away so they cannot use it for whatever purpose they had in mind.
Making a copy of a DVD doesn't deprive anyone of anything.

Oh, sure, it's not like all of these companies lose lots of money when people get their stuff for free and never pay them anything for it.

DesireCampbell's deviantART page wrote:I've been asked a few times now about using my work for other art, to be posted on other websites, and the like. Copyright is simply the right of an artist to his original work. It's a protection against misrepresentation, not distribution. That's why none of my works here have copyright licences. I don't believe in hampering distribution or re-use. Anyone is free to use my works however they see fit. I don't require notification, I don't require credit, I don't require reimbursement - any of that would be nice, but it's not necessary.

Yeah, and you're not trying to make a living on your art, are you?

So, you wouldn't mind if people came along and took chunks of money out of your paycheck every week? $5 here, $10 there, $30 over here....

Oh, nice, there's so much off topic crap going on in this topic that I completely missed that pic.

That's old. Really old. Well before these topics came up.

I'd completely agree with Dark Vegeta-Sama on this. Theres no harm in downloading it if it isn't available legally. Especially if your going to buy the dvd, if and when it does become available, which Dark Vegeta-Sama said he would do.

If, sure. But what's wrong with doing what everyone did for decades before torrents and YouTube came along and just waiting a few months for the DVD release? Fuck, it used to take years for movies to hit store shelves after leave theaters. No one felt entitled to steal a copy of it then to see it just because they couldn't get to a theater to see it.

But the law against downloading doesn't accommodate for those of us who will buy the dvd when it comes out.

The law isn't there for you. It's there for the owner of the property. It doesn't have to, nor should it, 'accommodate' those of us who are willing to pay for something after seeing it for free just becaue we're too damned fucking impatient to wait like everyone else.

No, you are not entitled to see it. Ever.

So should we be punished on account of those people who download and don't buy the dvd?

Punished?

What?

So now not getting something your not supposed to have is a punishment? The hell?

Only if your not going to buy it.

Actually, no, that doesn't work. Sure, it's somewhat applicable in this case, what with the special circumstances. But in the broader world that doesn't work. There's such a thing as box office sales and they're independant of DVD sales.

By the same token, how can I be doing harm if I'm going to pay for it?

You know, this makes me want to know something. How many times have you downloaded something with the intent to buy a copy 'later' and actually done so so far? And done so at the original full price when it acutally matters. Waiting until the price drops doesn't count.

Just curious, because I know a lot of us say "this is to tide me over until I can buy it" or "I'll buy it when it comes out" and I'm just wondering how many people go out and actually do so right when it comes out.

You wouldn't be. If an illegal downloader were anything more than a piss in the ocean, everyone would go out of business.

People have gone out of business, though. *coughgeneoncough*

Am I trying to tell you NOT to download this stuff? No, not really. And if I was, I'd be a really fucking big hypocrite. I've got 110 episodes of Naruto sitting in my room right now that aren't store bought and I've spent many a night watching things on CrunchyRoll from Super Sentai to PGSM to Monster to Kiba and quite a few others.

My only reason for bringing all of this up is this entitlement nonsense and justifying it with "oh, I'll be buying it later". Yes, it's great you'll buy it later. But that doesn't change the fact that it's still theft. And when people act otherwise it annoys me to no end. As I've said, you are not entitled to see something. It is not your right to watch the new DBZ special or anything else out there. And at present the movie and anime industry do not work on a "watch now, buy later" plan.

Now, with that out of the way.

Chuquita, I don't think anyone knows. And it doesn't really look like there's much more beyond what's visible, either.

As for the art, EX got that from Wasted Wisher. Maybe try PMing him?

Remix · Post by **Remix** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 1:15 am

My only reason for bringing all of this up is this entitlement nonsense and justifying it with "oh, I'll be buying it later". Yes, it's great you'll buy it later. But that doesn't change the fact that it's still theft. And when people act otherwise it annoys me to no end.

Oh. Well, to make it easy for everyone. I'll just go ahead and say I am nasty, unethical thief.

This thread has too many pages. So, is Akira Toriyama writing this or is he just overseeing it?

SSj_Rambo · Post by **SSj_Rambo** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 1:23 am

Remix wrote:This thread has too many pages. So, is Akira Toriyama writing this or is he just overseeing it?

Well the Wikipedia page for this says that Toryama wrote the story, but I'm not sure how accurate that is. As far as I know the only thing we know for sure regarding him and this special is that he will be (more than in the past movies) involved in the overall production.

Post by **Herms** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 1:25 am

Remix wrote:This thread has too many pages. So, is Akira Toriyama writing this or is he just overseeing it?

According to the pages on this that have appeared in Jump, he basically came up with the idea for the story (but he didn't write the script or anything like that, and I don't think he's done any of the character designs for the new characters, but I could be wrong).

Sentou Ryoku · Post by **Sentou Ryoku** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 4:05 am

Any sign of those character sheets yet aside from the ones on the Daizex front page?

Victator Supreme · Post by **Victator Supreme** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 5:50 am

Oh, sure, it's not like all of these companies lose lots of money when people get their stuff for free and never pay them anything for it.

You are assuming people would run out and buy the product if they had not downloaded it. Therec is no proof to support that. Just because someone will try something for free, does not mean they will pay for it.

So, you wouldn't mind if people came along and took chunks of money out of your paycheck every week? $5 here, $10 there, $30 over here....

Not even remotely the same. Somebody takes money from you, you are minus that money. Once again here is no proof a downloaded was going to buy something if it were not downloaded.

If, sure. But what's wrong with doing what everyone did for decades before torrents and YouTube came along and just waiting a few months for the DVD release? Fuck, it used to take years for movies to hit store shelves after leave theaters. No one felt entitled to steal a copy of it then to see it just because they couldn't get to a theater to see it.

Why don't people wipe their asses with corn cobs? Why dont people sit in the dark and read by candle light? Why don't people ride horses to get places faster?

Because technology came along and made it easier. Whether it was Toilet paper, electricity, the car or internet download. Its here to stay and their aint no going backwards. You can either embrace it or get crushed by it.

mrkaizoku · Post by **mrkaizoku** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 6:14 am

Xyex wrote:If, sure. But what's wrong with doing what everyone did for decades before torrents and YouTube came along and just waiting a few months for the DVD release? Fuck, it used to take years for movies to hit store shelves after leave theaters. No one felt entitled to steal a copy of it then to see it just because they couldn't get to a theater to see it.

Are you kidding? As soon as home Camcorders became affordable people bootlegged tapes. Tons of them. So, yeah quite a few people felt entitled to steal movies. Back then it was even worse, because people were paying for the stolen content. Younger people now really don't understand how it was then. Today's children have always had the internet.

Xyex wrote:You know, this makes me want to know something. How many times have you downloaded something with the intent to buy a copy 'later' and actually done so so far? And done so at the original full price when it acutally matters. Waiting until the price drops doesn't count.

Just curious, because I know a lot of us say "this is to tide me over until I can buy it" or "I'll buy it when it comes out" and I'm just wondering how many people go out and actually do so right when it comes out.

I've done this more times than I can count. I own thousands of dollars in TV show boxsets. If anything internet piracy made me buy more than I would have without it.

Okay now that all that is out of the way back on topic:

Why haven't we seen the other character designs yet? If someone would be so kind as to email them to me I would be very grateful!

Exactly how long is this special? Does anyone know? I'd just assumed that it would be a short. I'd love to be proven wrong.

Jerseymilk · Post by **Jerseymilk** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 10:05 am

*starts readying rubber hose and getting list of addresses*

SSj_Rambo: Ya I can't imagine they wouldn't be keeping track. Like I said, it would be akin to tossing money into a fireplace.

Dark Vegeta-Sama · Post by **Dark Vegeta-Sama** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 11:26 am

Jerseymilk wrote:Yes, I am a girl. *gives you a cookie*

And I haven't heard or read anywhere so far about plans. Doesn't mean Funi isn't keeping tabs on this and has plans however. It would be foolish of them not to in my opinion.

I'm sure that they will. For the sake of maximizing profits, they'll go after whatever pieces of Dragonball footage that they can.

I mean, if the rights weren't all screwed up, they would have surely dubbed the "Plan to Destroy the Saiyans" OVA/Video Game Walkthrough years ago too.

Xyex wrote:If, sure. But what's wrong with doing what everyone did for decades before torrents and YouTube came along and just waiting a few months for the DVD release? Fuck, it used to take years for movies to hit store shelves after leave theaters. No one felt entitled to steal a copy of it then to see it just because they couldn't get to a theater to see it.

People have copied movies for years. During the 1980s and 1990s, people would rent VHS tapes from Blockbuster or wherever and copy them by hooking up two VCRs. And 7-10 years ago, before youtube and torrents and high speed internet, people were copying DVDs on their computers using various burning programs that could easily bypass the copy protection on the discs.

Now with youtube and torrents, people are still doing the same thing, they're just skipping a step. Don't act like this is a new phenomena; it isn't, it's just more openly discussed now than ever before. Is it easier? Absolutely, but that's just where technology has taken us. Don't blame teenagers and 20-somethings for doing something because they can; if you want to blame anyone, blame those who enabled us to do these things in the first place.

Xyex wrote:You know, this makes me want to know something. How many times have you downloaded something with the intent to buy a copy 'later' and actually done so so far? And done so at the original full price when it acutally matters. Waiting until the price drops doesn't count.

You know, this life of ours is expensive enough as it is. Why exactly should we have to pay full price for something? Waiting 6 months until the price drops is a crime that hurts creators too?

Come on, man. Not everyone is loaded with cash.

As for the new DBZ special, I fully intend on getting it on DVD when it's released, assuming that FUNimation gets to it within the next year or two. If for some reason they don't (which is unlikely, but still hypothetically possible), I'll just import the Japanese release. I'm sure that most others here would do the same.

Xyex · Post by **Xyex** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 2:47 pm

People have copied movies for years. During the 1980s and 1990s, people would rent VHS tapes from Blockbuster or wherever and copy them by hooking up two VCRs. And 7-10 years ago, before youtube and torrents and high speed internet, people were copying DVDs on their computers using various burning programs that could easily bypass the copy protection on the discs.

Now with youtube and torrents, people are still doing the same thing, they're just skipping a step. Don't act like this is a new phenomena; it isn't, it's just more openly discussed now than ever before.

I'm not denying that it didn't happen before. I mean, there's still plenty of old 15+ year old VSH fansubs out there to prove that it did. But the thing is, back then, it was an extremely niche thing. Very few people were copying videos and the majority that were were only making personal copies for themselves. And I see making a personal copy of a rental rather similar to making a personal copy of a TV airing of something.

But it's no niche anymore. It's rampant and still growing and every industry that has the problem is feeling it. Music, movies, TV, anime, all of them. It's to the point, now, that it's actually causing noticible, and in some places and cases, significant monetary losses. It's like the difference between a kid drawing a stick man on the side walk and a group of 100 people spray-painting graffiti over everything for 20 blocks.

Is it easier? Absolutely, but that's just where technology has taken us. Don't blame teenagers and 20-somethings for doing something because they can; if you want to blame anyone, blame those who enabled us to do these things in the first place.

That's bull and you know it. You don't blame Smith & Wesson when you shoot someone. Just because you can do something doesn't mean you should.

You know, this life of ours is expensive enough as it is. Why exactly should we have to pay full price for something? Waiting 6 months until the price drops is a crime that hurts creators too?

Because the price drops for only 1 of 2 reasons. Sales are good and they've recouped their losses and thus don't have to charge so much now. Or, sales suck and they need to try and get in as much money as possible to try and break even. Is it really so wrong to pay someone what something is worth if you like it?

You picked the expensive interest. They aren't forcing you to watch their shows. Don't like the cost, don't watch it, that simple. I'm not saying never wait for a price drop on something. Consider the full price purchase your "Early Viewer's Fee" if you must. It's just common courtesy to the creators, really. I mean, can you go out and get a brand new 2009 car, and then pay the dealership in 15 years when the price has dropped?

I can understand not always being able to purchase at full price or on release. But at the very least an effort should be made to the reguard.

Come on, man. Not everyone is loaded with cash.

You're preaching to the choir, here. I'm broke. Literally broke right now. No money, none. Anyone who uses cost as reason is just trying to justify themselves. As I've said before, I've got no real problem with downloading in moderation, especially if the person has every intent to purchase later. But all of this entitlement and justification crap is ridiculous. You don't have the money, so what? Neither do I. That doesn't give you the right to steal it. I don't have the money for a brand new Ferrari either. Doesn't mean I can go out and steal one.

johnboy1 · Post by **johnboy1** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 3:39 pm

Xyex wrote:I don't have the money for a brand new Ferrari either. Doesn't mean I can go out and steal one.

You obviously aren't trying hard enough. It's actually pretty easy.

Snail · Post by **Snail** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 3:52 pm

How about, making another 'Thoughts on Copyright infringement, and today's consumers' article on a webpage, complete with a comments box underneath and argue *ahem, i mean discuss the topic there.

Olivier Hague · Post by **Olivier Hague** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 4:25 pm

Xyex wrote:all of this entitlement and justification crap is ridiculous. You don't have the money, so what? Neither do I. That doesn't give you the right to steal it. I don't have the money for a brand new Ferrari either. Doesn't mean I can go out and steal one.

Besides, that kind of arguments would be a lot more compelling if we were talking about food or shelter...

Dark Vegeta-Sama · Post by **Dark Vegeta-Sama** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 4:51 pm

Xyex wrote:
Is it easier? Absolutely, but that's just where technology has taken us. Don't blame teenagers and 20-somethings for doing something because they can; if you want to blame anyone, blame those who enabled us to do these things in the first place.
That's bull and you know it. You don't blame Smith & Wesson when you shoot someone. Just because you can do something doesn't mean you should.

No, it really isn't "bull" at all. People do shit that they shouldn't because they know they can. If the ability to do such things were never given to us in the first place, people wouldn't do them.

I mean, this is rather basic human behavior. We are often tempted to do things that are wrong because we know we can, especially if getting away with it is a real possibility.

saiyanprincess · Post by **saiyanprincess** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 5:02 pm

You know, this life of ours is expensive enough as it is. Why exactly should we have to pay full price for something? Waiting 6 months until the price drops is a crime that hurts creators too?

Come on, man. Not everyone is loaded with cash.

As for the new DBZ special, I fully intend on getting it on DVD when it's released, assuming that FUNimation gets to it within the next year or two. If for some reason they don't (which is unlikely, but still hypothetically possible), I'll just import the Japanese release. I'm sure that most others here would do the same.

[/quote]

I can totally agree with you, I fully intend to go and buy that DVD as soon as it is released. As for life being expensine don't we all know it.

Inflation is at an all time high, wages are not going up... Infact unemployment is rising meaning people can spend less. Be honest we are in a recession. (Well we are here in the UK.)

I don't mind paying for DVD's in the shops and its true you can never beat the real thing. It's like comparing a blue ray movie to an old VHS.
What does get me is the extreme copius amounts of profits that the companies actually make from each DVD.

To make each DVD bought in our stores is literally pence, and yet some... I'm not saying all, are released at almost premium prices because they know that people want it, and will buy it at that premium price.
(Yes I am guilty of this.)

I just think some DVD's are quite overpriced for what they are, and then in a couple of months they are in sales half price. If they can sell them for that price, why can't they sell them at that in the first place. I know everything is about maximising profit, but its a shame that some are just so darned expensive.

I can't wait for this new special! If I could preorder it I would...

I hope the Japanese realise just how lucky they are!

SSJ Helldog · Post by **SSJ Helldog** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 6:53 pm

So what's the countdown on the premiere showing of the special? It's this weekend, right?

Post by **Herms** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 7:19 pm

It will be shown in Osaka on the 21st, this coming Sunday.

Post by **desirecampbell** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:54 pm

Xyex: doing it less makes it less wrong? So, if I only do it a couple of times it's fine? And, it's okay for you to make a copy off of TV, but noone else?

Second, noone loses money from file sharing. It's not theft, it's just not buying. Not buying something doesn't mean they make less money. If your problem was with the production company not getting a cut, you'd be against used DVDs too.

Third, graffiti is an important form of cultural expression.

To sum up: your reasoning is both flawed and in an improper place; let's just talk about the new special we will never see.

Remix · Post by **Remix** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 10:35 pm

Never see? Speak for yourself!

I'm gonna steal it!

Chuquita · Post by **Chuquita** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 10:48 pm

Remix wrote:Never see? Speak for yourself!

I'm gonna steal it!

That Piccolo avatar of yours augments that comment in the best way ever.