Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 45 - DBZ episode 43-47

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Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 45 - DBZ episode 43-47

Post by Robo4900 » Wed Nov 04, 2020 2:12 pm

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Hello, ladies, gentlemen, and everyone between and beyond, and welcome to week 45 of the first Dragon Ball rewatch of the decade.
We're doing five episodes a week, and we'll be watching every single episode of Dragon Ball, Dragon Ball Z, and Dragon Ball GT. All 508 episodes. Plus the TV specials and the movies.
I encourage you all to watch in Japanese with subtitles, especially if you have never done so before, but watch along in whichever way brings you the most joy.

What better way to distract ourselves from the horrendous chaos going on all around us than to indulge in Vegeta's finest hour. Or, his finest six hours, in anime time. As much as I love the Namek arc, my god is it bogged down in filler. Still, we'll soldier on.

Previous thread: Week 44 (DBZ 38-42)
Next thread: Week 46 (DBZ 48-52)

Anyway, without further ado...

Episode 196 - The Dragon Balls Are All Here! Piccolo-san Comes Back to Life (DBZ episode 43)
Dub title: A Friendly Surprise (Funimation)
Originally aired 11th of April 1990

Kai equivalent: Episode -
Edited dub equivalent: Episode 31 - Who's Who?

Episode director: Yoshihiro Ueda
Animation supervisor: Mitsuo Shindō


The sixth Dragon Ball is inside an icy cave! Gohan and the others easily obtained the Dragon Balls, but the cave collapses! They slide through the cave riding on fragments of ice! Behind them rolls a gigantic ball of ice!! The are furthermore sent flying off a precipitous cliff, but somehow manage to save themselves with Bukūjutsu. They finally arrive at the lake where they last Dragon Ball is, but Raichi and Zarkro are there! It turns out that the pair are not really Namekians!!

Anime-only/filler content: Everything except for the scenes with Vegeta, which are themselves somewhat padded out. (Written by Katsuyuki Sumisawa)

Episode 197 - A Tough New Enemy! Emperor of the Universe, Freeza (DBZ episode 44)
Dub title: Brood of Evil (Funimation)
Originally aired 18th of April 1990

Kai equivalent: Episode -
Edited dub equivalent: Episode 32 - Touchdown on Namek

Episode director: Tatsuya Orime
Animation supervisor: Katsuyoshi Nakatsuru


It turns out the Raichi and Zarkro are aliens who were caught up in the universal current and crash-landed on Fake Planet Namek! They tricked Gohan and the others by showing them illusions until the universal current died down! As Gohan and Kuririn are caught by gigantic shellfish and can’t move, Raichi and Zarkro try to steal their spaceship, but are defeated by Gohan and the others as they follow a hair’s breath behind them. Escaping from Fake Planet Namek, Gohan and the others finally arrive at the real Planet Namek this time. But at the same time, Vegeta’s spaceship lands…

Anime-only/filler content: Everything up until Kuririn, Bulma, and Gohan arrive on Namek. (Written by Keiji Terui)

Episode 198 - Vegeta’s Ambition! I am the Greatest Warrior in the Universe!! (DBZ episode 45)
Dub title: Frieza Strikes! (Funimation)
Originally aired 25th of April 1990

Kai equivalent: Episode -
Edited dub equivalent: Episode 33 - Face-off on Namek

Episode director: Shigeyasu Yamauchi
Animation supervisor: Masayuki Uchiyama


The evil emperor Freeza has arrived on Planet Namek one step ahead of everyone else, bringing Dodoria and Zarbon with him. Freeza attacks the Namekian villages in order to gather the Dragon Balls. His goal is the same as Vegeta; “eternal life”! Vegeta defeats Kewi, who followed after him. Vegeta’s battle power has increased from the battle on Earth! Meanwhile, Gohan and the others are attacked by Freeza’s underlings. They quickly defeat the underlings, but the spaceship is damaged.

Anime-only/filler content: Goku lifting water out of a glass with his mind at the hospital. (Written by Katsuyuki Sumisawa)

Episode 199 - Goku’s Power at Full-Force!! Six Days to the End of the Galaxy (DBZ episode 46)
Dub title: Defying Orders (Funimation)
Originally aired 2nd of May 1990

Kai equivalent: Episode -
Edited dub equivalent: Episode 34 - The Ruthless Frieza (Some footage also incorporated into episode 33 - Face-off on Namek)

Episode director: Mitsuo Hashimoto
Animation supervisor: Yukio Ebisawa


Freeza and his men pass by in front of the cave that Gohan and the others are hiding in. Gohan and Kuririn tremble as they sense Freeza’s bottomless battle power. After receiving the news that Vegeta and Freeza have come to Planet Namek, Goku revives himself with a senzu! He heads to Capsule Corporation on Kinto-Un, and sets off for Planet Namek on a spaceship that Dr. Brief prepared! It will be six days until he arrives. Goku begins intense training!

No significant anime-only/filler content. (Written by Hiroshi Toda)

Episode 200 - Surprise Attack!! The Elder’s Target was the Scouter (DBZ episode 47)
Dub title: Namek's Defense (Funimation)
Originally aired 9th of May 1990

Kai equivalent: Episode -
Edited dub equivalent: Episode 35 - The Nameks Versus Frieza (Some footage also incorporated into episode 34 - The Ruthless Frieza)

Episode director: Yoshihiro Ueda
Animation supervisor: Tomekichi Takeuchi


Gohan and Kuririn follow after Freeza, and arrive at a Namekian village. As they investigate the situation, Freeza begins killing Namekians in order to steal the Dragon Balls! At this point Namekian warriors come running in and defeat Freeza’s underlings. The village elder then learns that Freeza and his men found the village using their scouters, and destroys them. But this enflames Dodoria’s anger!

Anime-only/filler content: Goku doing push-ups in his ship. (Written by Aya Matsui)

-

Interesting trivia:
  • At this point in time in the manga, Goku concludes his training towards Namek, Vegeta, Kuririn and Gohan arrive at the Grand Elder's, the Ginyu Force land on Namek, Kuririn and Gohan fight Guldo, and Vegeta wins it by chopping Guldo's head off.
  • When Vegeta first arrives on Planet Freeza #79, two soldiers are playing a board game. It appears to be some alien mix of Chess and Go.
  • The soldiers mentioning Freeza having just left during Vegeta's arrival is the first time he's mentioned by name in non-filler material.
  • The Doctor's robes make him the first character among Frieza's men to wear a custom suit of armour (outside of colouring in Freeza's case). Custom Armour would be something of a hallmark for the Namek-era movies and specials such as Tree of Life, the Bardock Special and Cooler's Revenge, and is also seen with Dodoria's cape and the Ginyu Force's chest emblem.
  • Vegeta's recovery marks his first outfit change: he's lost his leg guards. This becomes a recurring thing: he'll drop the shoulder guards after recovering from his first encounter with Zarbon, then lose the chest armour by the Buu Arc, leaving him in just the blue jumpsuit and white boots and gloves. GT takes this a step further by putting him in civilian clothes, while still keeping his overall silhouette.
  • In the anime, Vegeta and the Doctor expect his tail to grow back in due time. It won't.
  • When Vegeta is informed that Freeza has left Planet #79, he replies that Freeza's bored of this planet already. This implies that Freeza had only recently conquered it.
  • In Kai, all of the manga scenes dispersed through Episodes 39-43 were compiled into the first half of its Episode 19, including the image training, Vegeta landing at Planet Frieza #79, Vegeta emerging fully healed, Vegeta talking with the Doctor, Vegeta's confrontation with Cui, and the scenes at the hospital where Goku does sit ups and then heals up with a Senzu Bean. Because of this, Kai Episode 19 has five different directors and animation supervisors inherited from the original Z episodes!
  • Edits in the original dub:
    • Uncut episode 43/edited episode 31 is the first to have no cuts or paint edits at all, according to Chris Psaros's guide. He doesn't note any significant dialogue changes either! I do find this somewhat suspect, however; I would imagine at least a few shots would have been cut for time constraints, but it would require a lot of effort to determine this.
    • Uncut episode 44 vs edited episode 32 doesn't have a detailed breakdown as he lost the tape when he wrote the guide, however he notes that, from his memory, there are no cuts in this episode either! There is one edit he notes, though: A shot of a dead Namekian was was edited.
    • Uncut episode 45 was almost entirely kept as-is, however two seconds were cut from epiosode in which Vegeta's punch at Kiwi shatters his armour.
    • Also in episode 45, they add sounds of one dead Namekian beside Freeza breathing, to suggest he's barely alive.
    • The song on Roshi's radio in uncut episode 46, originally a song by Hironobu Kageyama, is replaced with a weather report for the weather on Roshi's island.
    • Roshi grabbing a nurse's butt in episode 46 was cut. This is the only cut (or visual edit of any kind) in the episode.
    • Chris Psaros's guide notes the weirdness about Goku's old ship being rebuilt into his new ship, but it seems he misunderstood the original Japanese dialogue, or looked at one particular segment of a scene out of context, and he thought the plothole was introduced by Funimation's rewriting. More on the issue of Goku's space ship below.
    • In Japanese episode 46, Dr Brief tells Goku he can't leave because he hasn't installed the stereo system yet. Funimation changed this to him not having installed the cappucino machine yet.
    • Nothing was cut from uncut episode 47, but in one shot, smoke from a Namekian's dead body was painted out.
    • Uncut episode 47 (edited episode 35) also employs the trick of having a dead Namekian still breathing to suggest he's just barely alive. They actually extend this to apply to Freeza's dead henchmen too.
  • As an additional note, Funimation altered some dialogue in episode 45; in Japanese, Zarbon originalyl said Vegeta and Cui are roughly equal in strength, whereas both the edited and uncut Funimation dubs of Z have Zarbon say Cui is much stronger than Vegeta.
  • As Goku is about to leave the hospital, at the window he reveals that he had Dr. Brief recover his old pod from Mount Paozu and repurpose it as a training spaceship. In the anime this is actually a plothole, because in the filler Episode 18 Piccolo had blown it up after it caused Gohan to go rabid (which ITSELF is a plot hole because Mount Paozu is over 100km inland). Episode 18 aired less than a month before the hospital scene debuted in the manga.
    • Chris Psaros of DBZUncensored claimed that, in the Z anime, Toei dodged the plothole by having Goku say the ship was based on his brother's. While this might seem clever, it's forgetting that Gohan destroyed it back in the Raditz fight. This error may have occured becuase Goku DOES mention Raditz's pod at the hospital window, but it was only to explain that it's NOT a viable option. This is similar to the airship scene where the gang debate how they'll get to Namek: They discuss the Saiyan pods and Goku mentions Gohan destroying Raditz's pod, complete with a flashback.
  • The title for episode 43 is "The Dragon Balls Are All Here! Piccolo-san Comes Back to Life". Obviously, he doesn't, meaning the title is a fake spoiler on Fake Namek!
  • Episode 44's title says that Freeza's the Emperor of the Universe. While a title Freeza certainly wouldn't turn down, Freeza's empire isn't known to have any presence in Earth's North Galaxy at the time of the Namek arc, and we don't know if Namek is in Freeza's territory or whether he had to travel outside his usual territory to get there; if so, we know that Kaio said Namek is outside his juristiction, which would mean Freeza's empire only covers, at most, two of the galaxies.
  • Episode 44 is the first time Katsuyoshi Nakatsuru has been the animation supervisor of an episode. Nakatsuru had done key animation as far back as Dragon Ball episode 19, and would serve as animation supervisor for the first TV special (for which he also served as character designer) as well as Z episode 120 and Z movie 4 (Lord Slugg). He also served as assistant animation supervisor on Z movies 3 and 8 (Tree Of Might and Broly 1), and eventually he took over from Minoru Maeda as chief animator on Z episodes 200-291, and as character designer for Z 200-291 and all of GT.
  • Episode 44 marks the final pre-Namek filler episode: Halfway into it we move back into the manga storyline.
  • There are 8 reanimated scenes in Kai episode 20, and 24 in episode 21.
  • In the manga, as Bulma and co. are about to land on Namek she tells Kuririn and Gohan to buckle up for landing, before adding that's if the ship can find a landing zone. In Funimation's Kai dialogue, she instead directly tells the ship to find the nearest landing zone. Robo was tempted to add comparisons with the edited and uncut Z dubs too, but he didn't have the time.
  • This is the first time we see the new Dragon Radar design, which has a curved shell around the button that now a mushroom top. This design would be used for the rest of the classic run, notably including Goku searching for the Dragon Balls before the Cell Games, and Trunks searching Capsule Corp. for it in the Buu Arc. The classic puck design would not be seen again until The Path to Power movie in five and a half years time.
  • When Bulma and Kuririn make their emergency plan after they see the Vegeta's Pod, Bulma mentions it'll take two months for her to return with Goku. This means that Goku didn't ask Dr. Briefs to build him his spaceship until after Bulma and co. left, before he even knew that Vegeta or Freeza would be there!
  • When Kuririn and co. discuss leaving plans, Bulma brings up Daimao killing Shen Long, and that it's a possibility here too. As far as KBABZ can recall, this is the only time this event has been mentioned after the Daimao Arc.
  • It isn't ever explained just how Vegeta learned how to suppress his ki, similar to how Gohan learns how to fly in the middle of the Saiyan fight.
  • Cui's Scouter is the second in the series to explode over a Battle Power too high for it to handle, this time at 22,000.
  • After Freeza and co. fly past the cave, when Bulma checks her Scouter, we see that it can now show a trail of where Dragon Balls have moved to. Previous Radars were incapable of this, simply showing the moving dot. Dots also now have a red arrow on it with a number indicating how many Dragon Balls the dot represents (NOT the number of stars).
  • In the manga, the wide shot of the hospital is the EXACT SAME one used for Chapters 243 and 244. Once again, the tell is the truck in the raised traffic tube, implying that West City's traffic jams are REALLY bad and last 39 days!
  • In the anime, the hospital scene is split in two, with the initial scene of Goku training while bandaged being shown during the orphan episode, and the second half where Goku heals up and leaves being shown after Gohan and Kuririn leave for the Namekian village. Incidentally, this means that during Roshi's second visit, he doesn't have to explain how he knows about Frieza and co., as it's implied he's visiting BECAUSE he recieved that news himself. This means the anime doesn't have to explain that Turtle radio'd him about it like the manga does.
  • In the anime, Roshi is the one overseeing Goku's hospital training, while in the manga, he visits with some pound cake in the middle of the scene.
  • Goku leaving the hospital is the final time he uses Kinto'Un in manga material (it shows up in The World's Strongest at least, and of course Goku uses it at the end of GT). After this point, it won't appear again until Gohan uses it at the start of the Buu Arc on his way to school (which he soon gives to Goten after using his Great Saiyaman disguise so he can fly much faster than it).
  • Episode 44 is also the first time Goku's met with Bulma's mum since he visited West City for the first time back in the original Dragon Ball, as she notes by talking about how much Goku's grown since then.
  • This episode begins the calvacade of slug/snail puns associated with Namekians. Cargo is Escargot, Nail is Snail, and so on. If a name doesn't make sense, like Dende or Moori, rest assured it's another name for snail or slug in some language.
  • Dr. Brief mentions that the pod uses amazing Saiyan technology, suggesting that Saiyans built it. While he nor Goku have any way of knowing, if true this contradicts the depiction of Saiyans in filler and the Broly movie, where they live in rather primitive dwellings and use Freeza Force technology.
  • The design of Goku's new pod has both Saiyan and Capsule Corp influences in its design. This would be taken a step further in GT, with that spaceship looking almost entirely Saiyan.
  • Apparently Goku knows about stereo speakers, to the point that he knows how such a minor detail they are in a spaceship!
  • The panel of Goku taking off for Namek is the first time we see the back of Capsule Corp., where it has a spherical shape all the way around. This would be adjusted in Super, where it has a section cut out of the upper-back quarter for a balcony overlooking the yard. In the anime, it would gain a pond that Yamcha appears in when he's wished back to life.
  • The Capsule Corp. scene is the first time Oolong has been depicted wearing a shirt since he gave Goku his pants at the end of the Pilaf Arc.
  • The first panel of Chapter 253 is the wide shot of the village from Chapter 252, but with Moori, Dende and Cargo drawn in outside a building. The same thing happens with the first panel of 253, re-using the panel of the Namekian warriors arriving from the last page of 252, and 254, re-using the panel of Zarbon shouting that he's destroying the Scouters.
  • Dodoria's Scouter rates the Namekian Warriors with a Battle Power of about 1,000 each (suppressed, as it turns out). This lends credence to Raditz's claim that Earth is a planet of utter weaklings when he first arrived there.
  • Episode 47 marks the 200th Dragon Ball anime episode overall.
Episode summaries, airdates, and titles courtesy of Kanzenshuu's episode guide. Filler breakdowns and Dragon Ball logo provided, and trivia co-written, by KBABZ. Additional trivia courtesy of Chris Psaros's DBZ Uncensored guide, and Kanzenshuu's animation production guide.
Last edited by Robo4900 on Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:02 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 45 - DBZ episode 43-47 (CURRENT WEEK)

Post by KBABZ » Wed Nov 04, 2020 2:21 pm

This is a question for Ajay or Mike (assuming they read these threads of course), but where did "Panty" for Bulma's mum's name come from? On the infamous Fandom DB Wiki they claim it was mentioned in a Dragon Ball Forever interview in 2004, but I read both of those interviews in the archives and couldn't find it.

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Re: Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 45 - DBZ episode 43-47 (CURRENT WEEK)

Post by ArmenianPepsi » Wed Nov 04, 2020 2:55 pm

With that snoozer Fake Namek out of the way, we can really start to dig into the nitty gritty of this arc.

I really enjoy this 1st act of sorts with everyone hunting the Dragon Balls. Of course you get your intense action scenes, but for every time a fight occurs, there's a moment when the story settles down a bit and we get to see the characters carefully thinking their next move. It's like navigating a huge spider web of relations, alliances, and Battle Powers. Everyone is on Namek for the same reason, and they all know that one wrong move could make everything fall apart.

On top of that, ignoring the filler episodes before-hand atleast, I also like how Frieza's introduction is done. He looks alien for sure, but doesn't instantly give off the vibes of a murderous tyrant. His actions are allowed to speak instead of him just monologuing about how super duper evil he is like some generic villain.
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Re: Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 45 - DBZ episode 43-47 (CURRENT WEEK)

Post by SuperSaiyaManZ94 » Wed Nov 04, 2020 3:38 pm

Now we get into the real meat of the Namek arc. After the so so start with the Fake Namek filler done this is where it really starts as one of the lengthier parts of the series. It drags at points, but overall really has a high stakes feeling especially when Freeza and his forces make their introductions.
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Re: Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 45 - DBZ episode 43-47 (CURRENT WEEK)

Post by Planetnamek » Wed Nov 04, 2020 5:44 pm

This is where the censorship really starts to get noticeable in the original dub, if Saban had dubbed the entirety of the Freeza saga I can only imagine how much more ridiculous it would've gotten. Freeza makes a good impression as a villain, he enjoys toying with his opponents and is very cold and calculated. I like how Vegeta goes from villain to sort-of ally and has his own agenda.
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Re: Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 45 - DBZ episode 43-47 (CURRENT WEEK)

Post by MyVisionity » Wed Nov 04, 2020 6:05 pm

KBABZ wrote: Wed Nov 04, 2020 2:21 pm This is a question for Ajay or Mike (assuming they read these threads of course), but where did "Panty" for Bulma's mum's name come from? On the infamous Fandom DB Wiki they claim it was mentioned in a Dragon Ball Forever interview in 2004, but I read both of those interviews in the archives and couldn't find it.
It wasn't included in those two Forever interviews, but was apparently a couple pages later, in the "name pun guide" on page 158:

Akira Toriyama wrote:Now that you mention it, she didn’t have a name, did she? Supposing I did name her, I would have probably used “Panchy”. Not “Panty”.

This information is noted in the Family Names guide on the Kanzenshuu website.

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Re: Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 45 - DBZ episode 43-47 (CURRENT WEEK)

Post by Dragon Ball Ireland » Wed Nov 04, 2020 6:19 pm

These episodes really take me back to discovering Dragon Ball for the first time. I made a diary of my imaginary adventures on Namek because I wanted to live like Goku and Kuririn.

Always loved the look of characters like Zarbon, Dodoria and Guldo, and of course first form Freeza. It really felt like these were villains with substance, and not mere Saturday morning cartoon fluff.
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Re: Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 45 - DBZ episode 43-47 (CURRENT WEEK)

Post by Robo4900 » Wed Nov 04, 2020 8:51 pm

MyVisionity wrote: Wed Nov 04, 2020 6:05 pm
KBABZ wrote: Wed Nov 04, 2020 2:21 pm This is a question for Ajay or Mike (assuming they read these threads of course), but where did "Panty" for Bulma's mum's name come from? On the infamous Fandom DB Wiki they claim it was mentioned in a Dragon Ball Forever interview in 2004, but I read both of those interviews in the archives and couldn't find it.
It wasn't included in those two Forever interviews, but was apparently a couple pages later, in the "name pun guide" on page 158:

Akira Toriyama wrote:Now that you mention it, she didn’t have a name, did she? Supposing I did name her, I would have probably used “Panchy”. Not “Panty”.

This information is noted in the Family Names guide on the Kanzenshuu website.
KBABZ and I hoped to put it in trivia, but we couldn't find a source on it, so we weren't sure if it was a fan invention. Thanks for clearing it up! :)
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Re: Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 45 - DBZ episode 43-47 (CURRENT WEEK)

Post by MasenkoHA » Wed Nov 04, 2020 10:16 pm

Planetnamek wrote: Wed Nov 04, 2020 5:44 pm This is where the censorship really starts to get noticeable in the original dub, if Saban had dubbed the entirety of the Freeza saga I can only imagine how much more ridiculous it would've gotten
I think the CW Kai edit gives a decent idea of what Z would have looked liked if Funimation had dubbed all of the Freeza saga under Saban.

I like how Vegeta goes from villain to sort-of ally and has his own agenda.
He’s still very much of a villain, he’s not even close to being a sort-of-ally until the Ginyus show up

He’s literally after the dragon balls for the exact same reason Freeza is.

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Re: Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 45 - DBZ episode 43-47 (CURRENT WEEK)

Post by KBABZ » Wed Nov 04, 2020 10:45 pm

MyVisionity wrote: Wed Nov 04, 2020 6:05 pm
KBABZ wrote: Wed Nov 04, 2020 2:21 pm This is a question for Ajay or Mike (assuming they read these threads of course), but where did "Panty" for Bulma's mum's name come from? On the infamous Fandom DB Wiki they claim it was mentioned in a Dragon Ball Forever interview in 2004, but I read both of those interviews in the archives and couldn't find it.
It wasn't included in those two Forever interviews, but was apparently a couple pages later, in the "name pun guide" on page 158:

Akira Toriyama wrote:Now that you mention it, she didn’t have a name, did she? Supposing I did name her, I would have probably used “Panchy”. Not “Panty”.
This information is noted in the Family Names guide on the Kanzenshuu website.
I'd be hesitant to include it as an OFFICIAL name, but it's certainly fun trivia!

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Re: Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 45 - DBZ episode 43-47 (CURRENT WEEK)

Post by ArmenianPepsi » Wed Nov 04, 2020 11:41 pm

Planetnamek wrote: Wed Nov 04, 2020 5:44 pm This is where the censorship really starts to get noticeable in the original dub, if Saban had dubbed the entirety of the Freeza saga I can only imagine how much more ridiculous it would've gotten. Freeza makes a good impression as a villain, he enjoys toying with his opponents and is very cold and calculated. I like how Vegeta goes from villain to sort-of ally and has his own agenda.
My favorite Saban tip-toe around Frieza's gruesome murder spree is how they made people who were clearly killed gasp and breathe after falling to the ground. :lol:
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Re: Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 45 - DBZ episode 43-47 (CURRENT WEEK)

Post by Robo4900 » Thu Nov 05, 2020 11:59 am

MasenkoHA wrote: Wed Nov 04, 2020 10:16 pm I think the CW Kai edit gives a decent idea of what Z would have looked liked if Funimation had dubbed all of the Freeza saga under Saban.
Not really. The CW Kai edit was able to use the far-better, far-more-advanced visual edits from Ocean which wouldn't have really been possible back in 1998 (most impressive is that TV edit of Kai keeps a lot of shots that possibly would have had to be cut back then, but which could be kept in 2011 by painting over the blood to look like spit, dirt, and/or sweat).

Additionally, standards for what's acceptable to show on TV relaxed quite a lot between 1998 and 2011, and as I recall, Kai wasn't showing in the early morning timeslot that Z was (early morning means parents are less likely to be around to supervise, therefore there are more restrictions), so the edits didn't have to be anywhere near as extensive as what Funi would have been told to do in 1998. I'm pretty sure Kai was actually allowed to acknowledge death being a thing once in a while, for instance.
MasenkoHA wrote: Wed Nov 04, 2020 10:16 pm
I like how Vegeta goes from villain to sort-of ally and has his own agenda.
He’s still very much of a villain, he’s not even close to being a sort-of-ally until the Ginyus show up

He’s literally after the dragon balls for the exact same reason Freeza is.
Yeah.
The only reason he works with the others is because all of them know they're fucked if Freeza and/or the Ginyus get the balls first; "The enemy of my enemy is my friend"
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Re: Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 45 - DBZ episode 43-47 (CURRENT WEEK)

Post by Kakkaroto735 » Tue Nov 10, 2020 2:52 pm

These episodes make me realize how much of a god Vegeta really is in the namek saga.

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Re: Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 45 - DBZ episode 43-47 (CURRENT WEEK)

Post by Matches Malone » Wed Nov 11, 2020 11:11 am

Kakkaroto735 wrote: Tue Nov 10, 2020 2:52 pmThese episodes make me realize how much of a god Vegeta really is in the namek saga.
Definitely, Vegeta is by far at his best in this arc. In terms of the arc itself, it alongside the Saiyan arc are without question DB at its absolute finest.

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Re: Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 45 - DBZ episode 43-47

Post by ikaos » Sun Nov 15, 2020 5:04 pm

Robo4900 wrote: Wed Nov 04, 2020 2:12 pm
  • Uncut episode 43/edited episode 31 is the first to have no cuts or paint edits at all, according to Chris Psaros's guide. He doesn't note any significant dialogue changes either! I do find this somewhat suspect, however; I would imagine at least a few shots would have been cut for time constraints, but it would require a lot of effort to determine this.
  • Uncut episode 44 vs edited episode 32 doesn't have a detailed breakdown as he lost the tape when he wrote the guide, however he notes that, from his memory, there are no cuts in this episode either! There is one edit he notes, though: A shot of a dead Namekian was was edited.
  • Uncut episode 45 was almost entirely kept as-is, however two seconds were cut from epiosode in which Vegeta's punch at Kiwi shatters his armour.
Fortunately due to my Saban/Ocean audio project I can confirm some of this. Episode 43/31 does have a very short cut while Krillin is having the flashback to the dinosaur that they escaped from in the previous episode. I'm not really sure why there's a cut here since there's nothing to censor, but it's about 2 seconds or so.

In addition to the censored shot of the dead Namekian, episode 44/32 also cuts a shot of Krillin getting choked by the sea monster, again about 2 seconds max.

I believe a frame or 2 of Kiwi's face as he's exploding is also cut from 45/33.

The censorship differences between season 1 and season 2 are almost night and day considering how little is cut from here to the end of the season, and yet they still manage to whittle away 2 or 3 episodes off the total.

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Re: Dragon Ball Rewatch, Week 45 - DBZ episode 43-47

Post by Robo4900 » Mon Nov 16, 2020 10:43 am

ikaos wrote: Sun Nov 15, 2020 5:04 pm
Robo4900 wrote: Wed Nov 04, 2020 2:12 pm
  • Uncut episode 43/edited episode 31 is the first to have no cuts or paint edits at all, according to Chris Psaros's guide. He doesn't note any significant dialogue changes either! I do find this somewhat suspect, however; I would imagine at least a few shots would have been cut for time constraints, but it would require a lot of effort to determine this.
  • Uncut episode 44 vs edited episode 32 doesn't have a detailed breakdown as he lost the tape when he wrote the guide, however he notes that, from his memory, there are no cuts in this episode either! There is one edit he notes, though: A shot of a dead Namekian was was edited.
  • Uncut episode 45 was almost entirely kept as-is, however two seconds were cut from epiosode in which Vegeta's punch at Kiwi shatters his armour.
Fortunately due to my Saban/Ocean audio project I can confirm some of this. Episode 43/31 does have a very short cut while Krillin is having the flashback to the dinosaur that they escaped from in the previous episode. I'm not really sure why there's a cut here since there's nothing to censor, but it's about 2 seconds or so.

In addition to the censored shot of the dead Namekian, episode 44/32 also cuts a shot of Krillin getting choked by the sea monster, again about 2 seconds max.

I believe a frame or 2 of Kiwi's face as he's exploding is also cut from 45/33.

The censorship differences between season 1 and season 2 are almost night and day considering how little is cut from here to the end of the season, and yet they still manage to whittle away 2 or 3 episodes off the total.
Thanks.

Realistically, I don't think the difference is a matter of censorship, it's a matter of season 1 being a 26-episode order, in which they wanted to fit the entire 35-episode Saiyan arc, so they made some drastic editing decisions to make that work, which weren't necessary in season 2.
If the Saban dub had continued, they almost certainly would have continued on in the same manner as season 2, with only minimal cuts for time, since it seems they dropped the idea of doing one arc per season starting with season 2.
The point of Dragon Ball is to enjoy it. Never lose sight of that.

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